HomeSlice Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 I'm working on an animation demo reel. It was all animated in A:M, so I thought the WIP forum would be appropriate. What I have now is about 5 min in length. I've heard that 2-3 minutes is optimal for a demo reel, so I would like to trim it down to that. I would be grateful if you will look at what I have and tell me what clips you like and what clips ... not so much. Here is the link to a low resolution version with frame numbers: http://www.holmesbryant.com/files/video/Ho...Demo_draft1.mov (27MB) Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSpleen Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 not responding for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeSlice Posted February 27, 2011 Author Share Posted February 27, 2011 I just clicked on the link and it started downloading. Maybe try it again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJL Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 Your improvement is profound between TWO and SO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSpleen Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 looks great!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeSlice Posted February 27, 2011 Author Share Posted February 27, 2011 Your improvement is profound between TWO and SO. Thank you Myron. After all the hours I've put in, I sure hope I've improved at least a little bit. And THANK YOU for your music in SO!! looks great!!!!!!!!!!!!! thank you Spleen. But I'm trying to shorten it down to 2-3 minutes, so I need to cut out some clips. But I'm just not sure which ones to cut... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimd Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 I know I'm going to get in trouble for this but the audio is killing your work the vo's, background, music ect.. do not sit in the track or mix very well and their is no over all environment to the tracks and when its there is it's not on the mark it might help to find a music bed for the demo and then cut to maybe so vo tracks I found it better just to turn off the sound and watch your work which by the way is very good your not over working the action which is very nice ( your not heavy handed in your work) if your going to make a demo you have use that same sharp eye and ears and make the tuff call and make it pro as far as clips go i would stay away from those real short ones that end before they start of course this is just my opinion and my apologies if i ticked anyone off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted February 27, 2011 Hash Fellow Share Posted February 27, 2011 I'm looking at it and I'll try to come up with some picks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
largento Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 Great stuff, Holmes! I can offer some generic suggestions that I've read (and had lectured to me): 1) Always cut on Action. Stopping and starting slows down the pacing. When possible try to match the direction of action, that will help avoid jarring transitions. If the disparity can't be helped, consider a cross-fade or other transition rather than a hard cut. 2) Make a list of skills you want to show off (walk cycles, physical acting, face acting, lip synching, etc.) and then pick your best examples of each. Trim them down to just the essence of what you want the clip to show. 3) One guide I read suggested holding the full-length stuff until the end (after your credits.) That way they can watch your demo reel quickly (satisfying the time constraints), but then they can also continue watching if they are inclined to. 4) Using a single piece of music over the course of it, could also help with bringing it all together. Even in something like this, I think audio is half of the experience. You could always interrupt it for one of the musical sections (or dialogue sections) and then go back to the unifying music. 5) Make sure that your very first segment is the one you think is absolutely your best work. I wouldn't worry at all about continuity or chronology. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeSlice Posted February 27, 2011 Author Share Posted February 27, 2011 Awesome tips. Thanks guys! Jimd, you are not offending anyone, at least not me. The people I send this to will probably be much more critical, so I need "real" evaluations. Thanks largento. I had not even considered most of those points. Thanks Robcat for taking the time to look at it on a more granular level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtpeak2 Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 The thing that bothers me is, that it's all TWO and SO. It just looks like a preview of the Oz movies. If you can mix in other work, to break up, I think that will help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeSlice Posted February 27, 2011 Author Share Posted February 27, 2011 The thing that bothers me is, that it's all TWO and SO. It just looks like a preview of the Oz movies. If you can mix in other work, to break up, I think that will help. Unfortunately all the decent character animation work I've ever done was for TWO and SO. Before TWO, I didn't even know how to animate a character. Since then I've animated on a few other low budget flicks, but the emphasis on those was on *quantity* and *speed*, not something I really want to show on a demo reel. I've done other types of animation over the years, but this is a character animation reel. So I'm afraid TWO and SO is all I have to draw from... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nino banano Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Great stuff, Holmes! I can offer some generic suggestions that I've read (and had lectured to me): 1) Always cut on Action. Stopping and starting slows down the pacing. When possible try to match the direction of action, that will help avoid jarring transitions. If the disparity can't be helped, consider a cross-fade or other transition rather than a hard cut. 2) Make a list of skills you want to show off (walk cycles, physical acting, face acting, lip synching, etc.) and then pick your best examples of each. Trim them down to just the essence of what you want the clip to show. 4) Using a single piece of music over the course of it, could also help with bringing it all together. Even in something like this, I think audio is half of the experience. You could always interrupt it for one of the musical sections (or dialogue sections) and then go back to the unifying music. I agree. with largento..You have an interesting demo here...I think that there are many secuences with the same character...maybe if you select the best two of every one could help in time... very well done and don`t forget to show us the final result Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wedgeeguy Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Hi Holmes ... I would agree that your animation ability from "Oz 1" to "Oz 2" is very noticeably improved. I also agree, if possible, to create some animations that don't involve any of the Oz characters. Perhaps something simple that just shows that you have an understanding of the basics ... the model(s) wouldn't have to be anything too fancy I don't think. Just something that demonstrates you have an understanding of weight and timing. As far as sound and music, again good advice about having a constant soundtrack with some fading in and out of the original score/sound effects ... depending on the scene (if it has dialog or not) If I was going to pick some things from what you have already shown in the original reel, this is what I would keep ... 000-379 Tinman and the girl ... Perhaps cut right after he places the heart inside her and then cut after he rests his hand on her chest. Any longer it kinda looks like he is copping a feel. 780-850 Tinman with accordion player ... The timing of the sound is off so maybe that could be corrected as well? 2009-2180 The witch comes through the door and says "I'll turn you into vultures and I'll squish ya" ... That's a pretty funny visual. Definitely keep the original sound for that one because Nancy did a really nice job! Perhaps put that somewhere towards the front. I believe that one would grab their attention and hold it. 2419-2802 Scarecrow crossing bridge ... The hands and feet slide a bit on this one so it might be better to place this one more towards the middle or end of the reel. I would stop it right before the Scarecrow drops. Visually it is also a good scene. 3272-3700 Captain Bill ... Pretty good animation here. I would just cut the scene shorter where he goes to first light his pipe. Holmes are you left handed? Just curious ... 6424 - 7130 Scarecrow with Wartman (sorry I don't know his name) ... Just some good facial acting acting going on here. I wouldn't sell yourself short on the other movies you helped with. There might be some short sequences that you can pull from. I'm also pretty sure that you can get permission to use them as well. Also check out Animation Mentor's website to see what type of animations they are placing on their reels. I'm sure that they were prepped really well on what the reviewers are looking for. Disclaimer: Take these few tips with a grain of salt since I haven't actually created a demo reel myself and I may be talking out of my butt here. Best of luck Holmes with whatever you come up with. You definitely have the talent to showcase a nice demo reel ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyGormezano Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Also check out Animation Mentor's website to see what type of animations they are placing on their reels. I'm sure that they were prepped really well on what the reviewers are looking for. Tips and Tricks Volume # 2 talks about demo reels I'm quite impressed by the enormity of your efforts. And it's been evident that you've been cranking it out full throttle, with productive, wonderful results. I have no experience with demo reels either, but from what I've observed on YouAnimator, it would probably be good to take some of the best of your clips to the next level and finesse them. Take the time and put in some polish. However, not knowing who nor to what types of industry, position you are targeting to receive this reel, this may not be necessary. Severely editing your current clips to the shortest, bestest frame sequences sounds like a good idea, as others have suggested, if for an animation job. Would be different emphasis for special effects, production, management work. As a twist, you might consider a mashup to make a funny sequence, almost story, different from either TWO or SO. eg take Yoop swinging-booby entry sequence and follow it with cut to Trot face in horror (around 5371) or something like that As for sound, I have read that reviewers are known to turn the sound off, unless it's supposed to be dialog. Much luck to you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeSlice Posted February 28, 2011 Author Share Posted February 28, 2011 it would probably be good to take some of the best of your clips to the next level and finesse them. Take the time and put in some polish. However, not knowing who nor to what types of industry, position you are targeting to receive this reel, this may not be necessary. Yes that would probably be a good idea, but I'm not applying to Pixar or Dreamworks, just some local studios in the area. I don't even know if they will look at my demo. Almost everyone wants you to be familiar with Brand X or Brand M. I'm hoping that isn't a *literal* requirement I'm hoping they just want you to have the intelligence to be able to get around in a professional grade animation program, and A:M is certainly that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeSlice Posted February 28, 2011 Author Share Posted February 28, 2011 .... Disclaimer: Take these few tips with a grain of salt since I haven't actually created a demo reel myself and I may be talking out of my butt here. Best of luck Holmes with whatever you come up with. You definitely have the talent to showcase a nice demo reel ... Thanks Bruce. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paradymx Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 .... Disclaimer: Take these few tips with a grain of salt since I haven't actually created a demo reel myself and I may be talking out of my butt here. Best of luck Holmes with whatever you come up with. You definitely have the talent to showcase a nice demo reel ... Thanks Bruce. You have a good body of work but, not much variety. I am always updating my portfolio with both commissioned projects and self projects to fill in the gaps of what I feel needs to be shown that I can do well. Always taking with a grain of salt...... sometimes simpler can be better. Its easer to relay certain concepts and emotions with full set atmosphere and detailed model. However, if you can do the same thing with minimal set dressing and a stick figure...... But that all depends on your focus. From you, I'm getting character animator. So it might be something you want to try too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkwing Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 Depending on who you're marketing to, I have seen some that are more of a "progression of skill" type demo reel, where it's not the best of the best until the end. You sort of build up with a "this is where I started and here's where I ended up," type dealio. Of course it all depends on your needs and what your purpose for this is. As for audio use a singular soundtrack, using dialogue breaks up the fluidity of the reel unless you're cutting it in a trailer like style, in which you actually have a sort of mini, build up anticipation type story going on in it. But really, use a single music track, something that fits and is appropriate but has good energy to it. As is taught in film, sound is 50% of any video, so only make it silent if it better contributes to the reel. IMO having a soundtrack will help show that extra level of the awareness of the overall project, thus also being something you would want to show off. Now if somebody is really opposed to having audio, they can turn it off. It's much easier for them to turn off audio then to have it be lacking and the viewer getting "bored" because only 50% of the film is there. Look up the VFS animtion demo reels, they're usually very well done which brings something else to mind. A lot of demo reels I've seen don't actually show clips from everything they've done, but are a demo reel specific short, usually having a very very minor/basic story (basically, a lone traveler is looking for something, they climb over the hills and in the distance see a fortress, implying the destination and conclusion is there, end of reel). So it's all a matter of how much work you want to put into this, if you're willing to spend some months making a demo reel specific sequence of shots that have previously not been made, or just do a collage of your previous work. But like I said, go to the VFS youtube channel and look at their demo reels, they also usually include a "how it was made" sort of thing, not like a tutorial or narrative, but sort of a "layer 1 - background, layer 2 - character, layer 3- compositing, layer 4 - effects, layer 5 - colour correction" thingy. Hopefully that makes sense to you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeSlice Posted March 3, 2011 Author Share Posted March 3, 2011 After a couple of laaaaate nights, here's Draft Number 2!! I added a sound track and cut it down to a little over 2 minutes. I also watched a bunch of other animation reels. All the ones I liked had pretty tight cuts, so I copied that. http://www.holmesbryant.com/files/video/Ho...Demo_draft2.mov (27MB) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimd Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 After a couple of laaaaate nights, here's Draft Number 2!! I added a sound track and cut it down to a little over 2 minutes. I also watched a bunch of other animation reels. All the ones I liked had pretty tight cuts, so I copied that. http://www.holmesbryant.com/files/video/Ho...Demo_draft2.mov (27MB) the cuts works as you can see having a good professionally recorded track really makes your work spark but you'll still need to fix the first and last bit (more the last the berry bit ) it falls flat after the whole thing so you need to punch it up I like the opening no pun (it could use a bit of help in the fx dept) however can of worms time your using a music track without permission a BIG NO NO some might turn a blind eye others won't and it will prevent you from posting it on the web there must be an instrumental track from those movies that will work right ? look at it this way I can't take a section from "The Lord of the Rings" and set a score to to get work I could to it behind close doors but thats about it but what good is that, close door is exactly that closed doors (don't go down that path) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkwing Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 This is where Magix Music Maker or Garageband comes in. Easy software and your own original, non-copyrighted music Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
largento Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 That is GREAT, Holmes! Don't worry about the music. The worst case scenario is that it just so happens to be shown to someone who owns the music (which is highly unlikely) and they send you a cease and desist letter for you to remove it. No doubt this would be long after you had shown it to the local companies you wanted to show it to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkwing Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 What's a little copyright between friends? Must say I disagree with Mark's reasoning here on this one, copyright is copyright and it's simply not your material to use, especially if you're showing this around to get paid for something Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
largento Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Holme's music choice will have no bearing in whether or not he gets a job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 I don't think using someone else's music on a demo reel is a problem. Holmes isn't selling copies, it's just his demo. I believe this would fall under fair use. Copyright is primarily for preventing the marketing of multiple copies of someone else's work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animus Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 I like this version much better. These cuts give good rythm to the clip. You could maybe bring the volume of the song more slowly. It actually makes up for an entertaining trailer for TWO and SO. The big difference I see from we normally expect from a reel is that all the animation is done with the same type of characters, you want to show skill and also versatility. Maybe eventually spend some time animating more basic characters like Thom or Shaggy or any simple object. That would make cuts even more interesting. Michel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
detbear Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Holmes!, Remember that your reel is only as good as your worst piece on it. I think you can x out much of what you have in this and you will have a much stronger reel. Your reel is way too long. Music is a bit strong for me....But that's your artistic choice. HOWEVER...remember that you never know who is going to be reviewing it...So it is safer to have nothing that distracts or annoys a recruiter. A recruiter rarely "REWINDS" to watch again. They have hundreds of reels to go through weekly. If you don't get there attention on the first view....Errr, well.... SO IT's actually better to have 3-4 animations that are top-notch than 10 animations that are mixed quality. AVOID using all of that animation of characters talking and yet you can only hear music blasting. Its better to show your lip sinc animation ability. If there isn't any...cut it from the reel. CUT out that shot that starts right when you press play....You need to begin with the Name Tag. Plus...I think the witch coming through the door is not as strong of a shot...especially to open up with..You want to start with a great piece and end with a great piece. Although nothing on the reel should be weak....the weaker ones should come inbetween the start and finish ones. CUT OUT the shot where "liquid" is pouring down on the tin man. ALSO.....Don't cast the viewer into a scene where all of a sudden the person reviewing your reel has no idea what's going on even though the animation may be good. IF ALL POSSIBLE....use the shots that are understandable....as well as good animation. This means shots that begin in a way as to allow the viewer/ recruiter be able to see whats happening. THIS IS NOT ALWAYS EASY. I remember one time having what I thought was a solid reel and a well respected animator hammered me on this same point after reviewing my reel. I wanted to crawl under a rock I think you have about 4 pieces in here that if you cut the rest, it would be stronger. Hope this helps, William Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Holmes, I was going to add more but William makes excellent points on everything I would have said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimd Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 I don't think using someone else's music on a demo reel is a problem. Holmes isn't selling copies, it's just his demo. I believe this would fall under fair use. Copyright is primarily for preventing the marketing of multiple copies of someone else's work. well i won't get into a hugh debate over this however i've been in this business for a very long time and its not proper to use other artist music and or anything for ones own projects without permission and like i said i would not use someone else's footage to make a demo I'm sure there are tracks he could use and as artist it would be nice if everyone would respect each others works another way to look at is he's using someones music to enhance his work which it clearly does so if he gets the gig he profits from that as far as getting a job no behind close doors it might not matter but why would you want to live behind closed doors especially when you've put so much of your hard work into it and bty all he has to do is contact the Harry Fox agency and get permission Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 All true, jimd. I don't have strong opinions either way, I think it's largely a judgement call. If it was going up on a website that's one thing. If he's just sending cd's to a handful of folks, that's something else. But you're right, why hamstring yourself just getting out of the gate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeSlice Posted March 3, 2011 Author Share Posted March 3, 2011 Once again, Thank You for the great input. the cuts works your using a music track without permission a BIG NO NO Thank you Jimd. I do realize that, even though I am in no way compromising the commercial value of the original music, I still do not have the rights to the music. I have read that YouTube has agreements with most of the major labels to allow users to post stuff that includes various pieces of music. So I just did a search on YouTube for "Pink Floyd" and saw many videos that were definitely not uploaded by the copyright owners. So I figured I would just upload it and if I get asked to take it down, I will. But I have not done much research into it. Do you know anything about the YouTube agreement with music companies? That is GREAT, Holmes! Thank you Mark. I like this version much better. These cuts give good rythm to the clip. The big difference I see from we normally expect from a reel is that all the animation is done with the same type of characters, you want to show skill and also versatility. Maybe eventually spend some time animating more basic characters like Thom or Shaggy or any simple object. That would make cuts even more interesting. Michel Thank you Michel, That is one more reason to focus on Shorts instead of spending 5 years making 2 feature length movies I'll look at the other stuff I have done and see if any of it is good enough to put in there. Detbear, those sound like very good points. I'll start working on Draft #3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimd Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Once again, Thank You for the great input. the cuts works your using a music track without permission a BIG NO NO Thank you Jimd. I do realize that, even though I am in no way compromising the commercial value of the original music, I still do not have the rights to the music. I have read that YouTube has agreements with most of the major labels to allow users to post stuff that includes various pieces of music. So I just did a search on YouTube for "Pink Floyd" and saw many videos that were definitely not uploaded by the copyright owners. So I figured I would just upload it and if I get asked to take it down, I will. But I have not done much research into it. Do you know anything about the YouTube agreement with music companies? That is GREAT, Holmes! Thank you Mark. I like this version much better. These cuts give good rythm to the clip. The big difference I see from we normally expect from a reel is that all the animation is done with the same type of characters, you want to show skill and also versatility. Maybe eventually spend some time animating more basic characters like Thom or Shaggy or any simple object. That would make cuts even more interesting. Michel Thank you Michel, That is one more reason to focus on Shorts instead of spending 5 years making 2 feature length movies I'll look at the other stuff I have done and see if any of it is good enough to put in there. Detbear, those sound like very good points. I'll start working on Draft #3. The music agreement as i understand it is for a new music section of utube where artist such as Madonna ect.. will allow their music to be played as far as i know no agreement has been made to allow people to upload music or place music on their vids somehow i doubt that will change are you sure you can't find a track from the movies ( instrumental ) that will get it across take the time to find something ( really you put a bunch of work into this you don't want to have to pull it ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
largento Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 As someone who has used other people's music on videos I've made, my choice has been to post them to YouTube, where the copyright owners can control their content. For instance, the copyright owners block my demo reel in Germany. However, they don't block my Christmas Greeting. If, at anytime, they decided to block them in the USA or any other country, they can do that. Which, in my thinking, gives them control of their copyrighted content, which is what copyright is all about. In addition, YouTube's software recognizes the music used, identifies it and puts up links where the music can be purchased on Amazon and/or iTunes, offering a revenue stream to both the copyright owners and YouTube. I also consciously do not use the songs in their entirety, so nobody could get the full song by ripping it from my videos. To me, I've allowed the copyright owner to choose whether or not they want to allow me to use the content and therefore determine whether or not I am infringing on their rights. Of course, this isn't completely black and white, but I am completely comfortable with my choices. Now, were I to do something that I wanted to charge for, then of course, I wouldn't use materials that I wasn't given permission to use. That's common sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkwing Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 And don't be fooled by what JimD said, movie scores are copyrighted just as much as "regular" songs. Every track of a soundtrack (unless stated its royalty free) is under copyright. And don't use anything owned by the BBC, they'll remove it pretty quickly, if they find it usually, just sayin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 My wife does slideshows for her cooking blog and generally uses the "free" loops that come with iMovie. She posts them on YouTube so she can link them to them from the blog. Awhile back she got a notice that one of her slideshows would be blocked in Germany because the supposedly free loop from iMovie is copyrighted there. So the whole issue is not black and white by any means. On the other hand there are websites where you can download free loops, and some of it is pretty nice! It might be worth looking there if this all gets too unresolvable, Holmes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkwing Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 And depending on what you want, I might be able to whip something together pretty quickly, I mean I did make some of the music for ELZ afterall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimd Posted March 5, 2011 Share Posted March 5, 2011 As someone who has used other people's music on videos I've made, my choice has been to post them to YouTube, where the copyright owners can control their content. For instance, the copyright owners block my demo reel in Germany. However, they don't block my Christmas Greeting. If, at anytime, they decided to block them in the USA or any other country, they can do that. Which, in my thinking, gives them control of their copyrighted content, which is what copyright is all about. In addition, YouTube's software recognizes the music used, identifies it and puts up links where the music can be purchased on Amazon and/or iTunes, offering a revenue stream to both the copyright owners and YouTube. I also consciously do not use the songs in their entirety, so nobody could get the full song by ripping it from my videos. To me, I've allowed the copyright owner to choose whether or not they want to allow me to use the content and therefore determine whether or not I am infringing on their rights. Of course, this isn't completely black and white, but I am completely comfortable with my choices. Now, were I to do something that I wanted to charge for, then of course, I wouldn't use materials that I wasn't given permission to use. That's common sense. I meant from the movies he worked on tracks from people he knows if he asked i'm sure he could get and if this a track with vocals but the background is cool maybe a remix ( which by the way would most likely tie together very nicely ) you think i would do a rant about this and say hey go rip off a movie track so no not music from movies a note about borrowing music no pun the copyright covers that an example would be i borrow your lawnmower to cut my lawn you don't even know its gone and hey i figure if you want it back come and get it ( if you can find it ) and as long as i don't damage so what another extreme way of looking at this Ford makes a commercial and uses a Rolling Stone track with out asking and then they say hey we're not making money off this we're just showing our car and when people come in they are buying the car not the song (so what wrong with that ) everyone equates this to just money and it is the over riding factor but the other point its just proper to ask for Big projects you can contact the Harry Fox agency for permission and pricing (its easy and cheaper then you would think ) now don't get me wrong here I am very sympathetic to this problem of artist needing tracks in this particular case however there should be tracks available to HomeSlice and again it's a demo that reflects his hard work that I would think he would like to get out over the place so hows this, if one could avoid it just don't do it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Rodney Posted March 5, 2011 Admin Share Posted March 5, 2011 I just think Holmes should have picked better music in this case. If reviewing the Demo I think I might have rejected it on that alone. Sorry Holmes, you wanted honesty!!! As for my preference in accompanying sound tracks; sometimes just a decent beat... bumpbump bumpadump... (or whatever) will work fine. Vary the rate of speed of that beat along with the tempo and beats in the animation over time. There has been a lot of good advice here on what to have in a demo reel. I'd pick the top three or four from the Oz reel, cut everything to read fast and most definitely get their attention at the start. You've got to grab and hold the viewers attention. Don't waste their time. Things I like: - Your namecard at the beginning and end. (Follows the principle of first learned best remembered and retention of the last exposure. (For instance, some people say the last 90 seconds of a play is the most important to get right) - The Door pounding at the beginning (but once the door opens don't use Mrs Yoop... cut to the next shot) The door opens to reveal your demo (see bouncing ball suggestion below). - I'd like to see a quickly cut sequence of the SO shots where SC etc are calling out for Captain Bill... building up tension... end with the guards marching. You might even be able to get a finely cropped shot of SC moving across the ravine on the rope just prior to this shot. - I like the water splashing on TW, but would crop that sequence way, way down in size. Perhaps from where the water has just hit him until he steps forward... be merciless on that) - I'd keep Bumpyman but only from his last gesture with the dialogue, "Would you care to try some?" placing this at the end of the Demo just prior to showing your end title Namecard. (You are effectly suggesting the viewer dial you up and hire you) - The Demo is a Bouncing Ball (These scenes should cut together like we are following a red bouncing ball throughout. Where the viewer's eye goes should be where that ball would bounce. If the focal points of a sequence don't match up over the cuts... pull it out. Of course... there is no red ball to follow in the demo but nobody needs to know that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fae_alba Posted March 5, 2011 Share Posted March 5, 2011 As someone who has used other people's music on videos I've made, my choice has been to post them to YouTube, where the copyright owners can control their content. For instance, the copyright owners block my demo reel in Germany. However, they don't block my Christmas Greeting. If, at anytime, they decided to block them in the USA or any other country, they can do that. Which, in my thinking, gives them control of their copyrighted content, which is what copyright is all about. In addition, YouTube's software recognizes the music used, identifies it and puts up links where the music can be purchased on Amazon and/or iTunes, offering a revenue stream to both the copyright owners and YouTube. I also consciously do not use the songs in their entirety, so nobody could get the full song by ripping it from my videos. To me, I've allowed the copyright owner to choose whether or not they want to allow me to use the content and therefore determine whether or not I am infringing on their rights. Of course, this isn't completely black and white, but I am completely comfortable with my choices. Now, were I to do something that I wanted to charge for, then of course, I wouldn't use materials that I wasn't given permission to use. That's common sense. My daughter did a video for a High School class project. She used a partial soundtrack from Wizard of Oz I believe and posted it on youtube...I went back a little later to watch it and get a niotice that it had been removed at the request of the copyright owners... It all depends on how draconian the copyright owners are. I'd take the melody of the music, run it through a sound mixer (hand type it if you have to) change a little here and there, and it is a new music piece, yours to own, even if it is based on somebody else's work. Not entirely kosher, but that is how the copyright law is written, only the work, in its original form is protected. Takes more work, but it saves headaches down the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Rodney Posted March 5, 2011 Admin Share Posted March 5, 2011 This showreel from Uli Meyer has the quicker sense of cutting with short clips that I'm talking about (although not with much... very little... bouncing ball/match cutting): Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted March 5, 2011 Hash Fellow Share Posted March 5, 2011 I finally had a chance to watch the whole original reel. That's a lot of animation! I don't think I've done five minutes of character animation in my entire life. With an eye towards how everything could be polished, the two elements that strike me most often are: - lack of or improper use of overlapping motion. Things tend start and stop at the exact same time and move all together while they are getting there. For example a character might lean forward and the torso and head start and stop at the same time. - isolated motion. This is when some body part moves and the part attached to it moves not at all or moves in such a way that that they don't seem to be interacting naturally. For example, a character might be waving his hand and while the hand and arm move back and forth the torso remains motionless. These are not unique errors on your part. I can show you well-budgeted movies that have these same things going on. Movies that people who teach at AnimationMentor worked on. But while they will give their seven million dollar movie a pass on that because of its low budget they won't give your zero dollar movie a similar pass. In general your acting and staging choices don't bother me too much. I think a one minute reel is a good idea. I think there's enough here that we could identify a minute's worth of material for closer examination. I don't think it needs to have music running throughout or added. There are many shots where just better lighting would help quite a bit even though this is an animation reel and not a lighting reel. There's an overall flatness to it that bothers me. I'll look at this again and try to come up with some more specific suggestions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeSlice Posted March 7, 2011 Author Share Posted March 7, 2011 Thank you Robert. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted March 29, 2011 Hash Fellow Share Posted March 29, 2011 Here's my tentative distillation of what was in the first version. My goal was to pick the shots that would make the best impression in 60 seconds. All of these would benefit from further polishing and on many , lighting changes should be considered. If you want to pick some shots to work on I can offer ideas for polishing. I put a few frames of black between each shot to help convey that they are not originally contiguous. Sorry the sound is so glitchy I'm not sure why that is. HolmesCharDemoShort.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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