New Head Model

[higginsdj]

Just thought I would post some shots of how my new model project is coming along. I have been asked to do some shots for a Star Wars Fan film (for free of course). 5 shots each revolving around a babies head - so I need a babies head model (very specific since they already have shots of the baby I need to duplicate the real one......) and it needs to be rigged for basic baby facial work.

 

Unfortunately I have only a front roto to work from so I have to 'wing it' somewhat. So I will welcome comment/recommendations about how it's working out as I progress.

 

For those wanting to learn how to model a face - I highly recommend "Model a Face with Bill Young" c/- Anzovin Studios.

 

Cheers

[steve392]

I would think a baby's face is verry hard to do ,will be keeping an eye on your progress and hoping to learn a few things .Its looking good at the mo

[higginsdj]

A little more progress. One thing I should point out is that this baby appears to have a large overbite. I'm a little worried about the corner of the mouth as well - more tweaking needed there I think! I think the spline count is OK - any opinions?

 

Cheers

[Paul Forwood]

Looks good to me, David!

[totlover]

i think it is awesome

[LeeAnderson]

That looks great David! Could you tell us a little bit more about the project it's for?

 

Lee

[higginsdj]

Thanks guys. The model will be released free to the community when it's finished and will be free for use on the proviso that anyone adding a body to it will also supply it free to the community

 

I know very little about the project itself. Its a young film student in the states who is putting together a star wars fan film. Apparently there is a sequence where the film transitions to a vision sequence of the babies entire life as seen by a prophet. One closeup shot (why the model needs to be very realistic) and 4 general medium baby head move and expression shots. Other than this (and the copious number of hi res images around the set of the baby and other charatcers) I know very little. It looks like he is trying to do it properly and he appears to have a very good understanding of the process including CG aspecs. This is just an exercise in modelling, rigging, texturing (and a chance to try out 3DPaint) and facial animation work for me with no promise to complete any work (so he has a 2D solution backup).

 

Cheers

[Chrury Sanson]

In that case, I'll say:

"Impressive. Most Impressive."

[higginsdj]

Finally got the side roto (or something I could use) requiring a lot of tweaking and reshaping (babies have odd shaped heads). Here's the latest. Just needs the ears, inside mouth and a bit of tweaking on the shape around the side of the head. Chin area might be a problem too. I've been glued to this model for so many hours I have lost all perspective.

 

Comments most welcome (even the critical ones)

 

Cheers

[itsjustme]

Kicking ass so far, David!

[higginsdj]

OK, here's a copy/flip/attach version with a rough decal (rendered to the clients animorphic 720x480 requirements - 1.2:1 aspect). Babies head looks far to big in standard view - just as well most of the head is buried in a blanket

 

Cheers

[Caroline]

That's an amazing baby - you've even captured his worried expression. Babies' heads are big - it's part of why they're supposed to look cute.

[Zaryin]

Excellent job so far. It's a bit creepy without the ears so far, haha. I'm assuming that will be the next update.

[higginsdj]

Latest update. Baby now has ears, inner mouth and gums (still needs a throat and tongue) and a slightly better decal applied (though applied poorly). Also tried painting direct on the model via 3DPainter (yes I paint detail with a 4" brush ) Also note this is a pixel aspect of 1.2:1

 

Cheers

[mfortunato]

Hey David -

 

This kid's looking fantastic. I'd love to see the latest update. You posted that you had updated it, but there's no image for us to gawk at and enjoy .

 

- Michael

[higginsdj]

Here's a turn-around. Decal on face only (still prety rough). This baby will need hair but I need advice/help here. AM Hair or Decal? Baby has some hair but not alot and it is very fine soft looking hair - unstyled.

 

Cheers

[steve392]

Thats looking realy good now especialy the eyes,nose and mouth areas

[higginsdj]

There were a lot of things the model commissioners didn't like about the baby - particularly the nose. I think most of the issues came from the decal itself (the fact it had pre-rendered shadows on it). Anyway, made some tweaks to the nose and changed the decal to get rid of all the shadows and highlights and rendered it in v14 with SSS.

 

There does appear to be a small rendering error inside the ear. Not sure whats causing that.

 

Cheers

[cfree68f]

Hey David,

 

Its a good start, but you are missing some key features that say baby.

 

His Eye brows are not opened up enough. Proportionally they should be higher up and more shallow on the slope. He sort of has ape like eye sockets. You might add a ridge for the brow line as well. Babies don't always have these, but it will add some room for more expression in the eyes.

 

The nose is to adult like, mainly along the bridge. try fattining the bridge a little and sinking the nostrils back into the cheeks just a tad. Something about the nostrils is off. They don't show up enough? or the SSS might be hiding the divit.. not sure. As chubby as this little guy is, you might try giving him a bit more of a line from the nostrils to the edge of the mouth. Nothing sharp like muscles would create. More of the Arnold on Different Strokes Chubby cheek effect. Good job rounding out the front of the face. The second to last spin was very flat, but the new one is much better.

 

The lower lip is just a bit small. All babies have a severe overbite but they have pretty puffy lips as well. Think of the "bow" shape you'd imagine on cherubs.

 

I think the main things harming readability as a realistic human baby are the eyes. specifically the brows. Maybe the forehead a little, not sure.

 

Theres a dark patch on the ear and I can't tell if its a flipped patch and SSS or a really deep indent. It adds a bit much complexity the ear, like he's got an extra hole. You might soften that just a tad assuming its not a flipped patch.

 

Something I just thought of that might help with the brows a bit. some more obvious eye brow hair. even slight might add to the expression.

 

If you are going for ultra realism.. try giving him some downy thin blondish or darkish hair. and model a little bit of some open skull ridges in the scalp (instead of ultra smooth) Babies skulls aren't fully formed and they can have rather large dents in their skulls do to the open ridges.

 

Great stuff. Keep it up.

[higginsdj]

Hi Colin,

 

Thanks for the critique. 'Unfortunately' I have to make this model look like a very specific baby so I only have some latitude. The nose has been a bone of contention with the 'owners' and I have been slowing lowering the nose into the face after they originally told me to pull it out and rotate the tip down. Its slowly refering back to original <_>

 

The brows were modelled on a specific roto that had the baby with a concerned look - I imagine this is the reason they are too low. I can pull them back up. There were some creasing/divits in the head and SSS got rid of them. Re the lips, I may have the upper lip extending too far out. The owners are considerign making the mouth smaller so it would/shoudl be a matter or making that upper lips smaller.

 

I checked the normals and they are all fine. There are 2 dark spots in the ears - just SSS rendering issues I think.

 

Hair - yes...... Thats my next challenge

 

New 360 attached

Edited February 18, 2007 by higginsdj

[Dhar]

Fantastic work Mr. Higgins.

 

How old is this baby? One feature that I notice about babies (which I also adore) is their cheeks. I call them bubble cheeks because of their almost perfect roundedness. I think this baby needs a more pronounced cheeks.

[higginsdj]

I have to take the baby back to 1 month old. I believe the roto was 3 months. Remember, this has to look like a specific baby rather than baby in general. Are you suggesting puffing the cheeks along the jawline or in the area behind it?

 

Cheers

[Dhar]

Google search the images of 1 month old and 3 month old babies and you'll see what I mean.

[higginsdj]

But the baby I have to model looks much different (see attached). As you can see, there is not a lot of puffiness in the lower cheek/jaw area although it's difficult to gauge just how much since the baby's head is turned. Since the CG baby is replacing the actual baby in some shots I have to mimic this baby as much as possible.

 

Cheers

[Dhar]

LOL, what a great pose for a baby. Those expressive eyebrows are a hoot. I can just hear a deep voice saying "Whata ya lookin' at?"

 

Well, I can see why you'd have a tough time since this isn't the baby's default face. His mouth is open, which will take the budguness out of his cheeks (I'm assuming it's a he). If you have a spline where I indicate you could pull it out just a tad to add that hint of pudgy/puffy-ness.

[higginsdj]

New version. I re-decalled the eyeballs and now they don't look right. Compared to the rest of the head they look like they have an ambient glow. SSS had only been set for the skin. Any suggestions for the eyes?

 

PS - fixed the rendering issue in the ears. It was the normals. Silly me had fixed them in the v14 model but I made changes to the v13 model and imported them and forgot to re-tweak the normals!

 

Cheers

[higginsdj]

Maybe it's just me but I am gobsmacked at how good sub surface scattering is in v14 and what it is doing for my skin tones. They should make a cream

 

Cheers

[jmf3d3d]

Maybe it's just me but I am gobsmacked at how good sub surface scattering is in v14 and what it is doing for my skin tones. They should make a cream

 

Cheers

 

obviously not just you! sss is an amazing addition to A:M. I caught yves thread when he first announced it and tried it out a bit back then. I'm looking forward to playing with it more. are you going to (or have you) published the settings that work so well here?

 

The model is looking great! The only part that doesn't work for me is the forehead. I think that it should curve back more above the outer edges of the eyebrow. That is one thing that puzzles me about working from rotoscopes... with precise front and side images you can perfect some of the dimensions, but the curve of the forehead and cheeks are harder to determine. I see the in photo that there is more of a shadow on the outer extremes of the forehead than in your model. on the semi profile view the forehead seems to bulge a little too much (very little probably) just over the outer sides of the eybrow. just a thought...

--jerry

[higginsdj]

Scary baby!

 

Heres a quick render testing some face rigging (about 1/3rd the face is rigged)

 

Cheers

[wwoelbel]

Hey David,

 

Have you done any more work on this model? I was hoping to see how it came out.

 

Bill

[williamgaylord]

Nice work all around!

 

Suggestions about the nose (all very subtle changes): The back side of the nostrils should stand out more from the face. The tip of the nose should be a tad rounder so that where the "upside-down bowls" of the nostrils meet the tip of the nose there should be a slight reverse curve that differentiates the nostrils a bit from the tip of the nose. (Imagine a marble as defining the shape of the tip of the nose.) The bridge of the nose is fairly wide by proportion on a baby's face since it doesn't stand out much and the flesh on either side softens the curve across the bridge. These fleshy bulges slope down from the bridge to each side. They also emphasize the crease around the back and top side of the nostrils a bit.

 

Like I said, these are suggestions for subtle changes, since overall you've done a fine job on the nose, and indeed the whole head!

 

A couple illustrations:

[aen916]

looks great! Are you planning to use the hair material or textured hair?

 

Andy.

[higginsdj]

Hi All,

 

I've been away for a long time due to time constraints related to work and study. Unfortunately I can't continue on this model in the short term (or the associated head animation work) so rather than leave the young director I was dealing with in the lurch I thought I would introduce him here and anyone willing to continue where I left off can chat to him (it was an unpaid gig).

 

Daniel Ross is his name and he has a lot of material available to download to you as you need it. He has been a delight to work with and not a hard task master. As I said - an unpaid gig.

 

I think it would be OK from a moderators perspective as long as the resulting model (less decals which might be copyright) was made available to to forum and development of the model and resulting animation was discussed on the forum for others to learn from.

 

Cheers

[djr33]

Thanks, David.

 

Hi, everyone.

 

Please let me know if you'd be interested in working to finish the model. David already has the mesh, 90% of textures, and almost all rigging complete, so the majority of the work would be the lighting and animation.

 

I'd be more than happy to give you more information about the project. In short, it's a fantasy film about 15 minutes long. (David earlier posted that it was a Star Wars fanfilm, and this was due to miscommunication, since we met through a site dealing primarily with fanfilms.)

 

The baby's role, specifically, is that of Osmond, the future savior of the kingdom-- if the king doesn't have him killed first.

 

Feel free to post questions here, though I wouldn't want to take too much forum space, so PM/email/IM would be fine with me.

 

We are looking for this to be completed soon, preferably within 1-2 months.

 

If there's anything you'd like to know, please ask.

 

 

I would continue work on this myself, but my skills with A:M are just a bit below this level , and I'm quite busy with the rest of the organization of the film. I'd really appreciate the help.