HASH 3D CITY

[Jin-Kazama]

dear\all

 

 

many of my friends adviced me to start a new thread for this topic and not leaving it inside my porsche thread..so here i go...

 

i decided to start a project called (HASH CITY)..hash city is a 3d vertual city where everyone on our commnuity is able to have his own building or shop or car agency...the idea came to me while i was modeling a small street to be as an environment for my porsche car...later on...i had a chance to play GTA vice city...and was amazed about the huge city of this game...so i was thinking...what if we can model a city like this...not big but fair enough...and has all kinds of building types...streets...just as any real city...the idea get larger as i thought it would be nice to share many users in this project...this project can help anyone who's looking for a city environment to make an animation or anything else...also....after i bought 3d game studio....i thought about modeling this city to create a car racing and adventure game...so if anyone is intersted about sharing this project...i will be more than happy..

 

to get things in the right order...i was thinking to devide this project into steps:

 

1- drawing the city map which will help us defining where every building would be placed and what type of building it would be..a police office..hospital...company..restaurant...and so on...

 

2- start to model each of those buildings depending on our imagination and some refrence images

 

3- when finishing all buildings..we will start to model the city accessories like street lights, signs..gardens...etc depending on our city map

 

4- then start placing these models in one big chor...and makings light setup and other weather environments

 

 

the method to model all these models is to use the game modeling way...simple textured blocks..we can also make detailed buildings facees using flash mx to draw the outlines of our building then import it into AM as ai file format..this would speed the process as i tried it my self and it works very very fine...for those who wish to know how to...i will post the method i used in detail..if someone asked..

 

 

 

if anyone would like to start working as a team...please join us...

 

 

jin

[nixie]

Its a great idea!

 

Like an open source city so If anyone ever needs a generic city for a project, theres one to hand!

 

Its important that with something like this we keep the number of textures to a minimum, perhaps have 5 types of brick 5 types of tarmac (asphalt!) then roadsigns etc (so a country would need to be set)

 

When you think youv got a map, I'd be happy to contribute a building

 

Regards - Nixie

[thejobe]

cool idea

i would like to help but im only good at modeling small things

[ruscular]

If you make this city I would like to request a plan for a roundabout with a sculpture of a water fall, fire on top scnenario.

[nickpoz]

I think it would be a GREAT idea! I am not a great modeler so forgive me... but I'll do my best. Maybe this could eventually turn into one of those virtual world games like Sims Online where we have a character that lives there... or maybe I should control my imagination...

[rossk]

Sounds like an interesting idea. Is there any way you could post the current project file for the city?

 

I also didn't know that flash mx could export .ai files... good to know though since I'm not comfortable at all with using illustrator.

[Flog]

great picture of a city, hey you should do a Wink on how you modelled the building with so many windows and such using Animation Master.

 

I would love to see how it was done. I can never get windows in my buildings

[KenH]

I really hope this gets off the ground. Are you going for the photo-realistic look like those used in Spiderman?

[Sevenar]

Just some ideas off the top of my head (which may or may not work):

 

--City sections, squares perhaps, with a rotoscope render of the next section on each of the boundaries. Keeps the city in manageable chunks, but the rotoscope/matte painting idea might not produce good results except at the point where the camera made the render.

 

--Some sort of Level-of-Detail proxy? One model with just decaled-boxes for long range shots and flyovers, one with the full-detail buildings.

 

--Inhabitants. 'Nuff said.

 

--Country-specific prop sets. Traffic signs, police uniforms/cars, etc.

 

--Every road/sidewalk to have a 2 built-in antiparallel paths to constrain a car/pedestrian model to. (so you can have 2-way traffic easier...)

 

--Royalty-free use.

 

--maybe a pose-slider wind system for direction and magnitude of wind forces for flags, chimney smoke, etc. (?) (0/100% = north, 25% = east, 50% = south, 75% = west, etc.)

 

--at least 1 side have a sea/water coast of some sort.

 

That's all I can think of at the moment...

[ddustin]

You are going to need to be aware of the file sizes/patch count for a city this large.

 

It would be great to have images from real buildings, then decal them onto the models.

 

It might be a trade off between large image decals, and High patch count.

 

I love the idea of the city and the different models.

 

I can offer a central location of storage ( I would need to figure out the anonymous, ftp thing), on one of my web sites.

 

David

[Jin-Kazama]

thanx for your replies...i was happy to know that you would like to join the project...now...lets talk about some easy way to model the front face of our buildings..infact..it's not a trick sence it's known from version 8.5 when the font wizard was found..i read a tutorial about it nut i don't remeber now who wrote it ( i should give the guy a credit )...which u can creat any shape by drawing the outlines using the pen tool in corel draw i guess or illistrator...so....as long as FLASH MX can export its draw into illistrator file format...y not trying there???!

a question : what do u mean by drawing in flash and how would the shape and count of CPs would be in AM??

 

EASYYYYY...baiscly u should know that when u draw an oval shape inside flash then u click on the white arrow beside the selection arrow tool ( the black on in the top ) u will see an oval line with points on it...so those points would be the CPs and the oval line will be the spline which's connecting every 2 CPs...also...if u make 2 lines crossing each others...the point where they meet will be a connected CP connects the 2 crossed lines.....enough?

first of all...i use the ruler to define the hight and width of a singal window...then draw a box..scale its hight...then convert it into a graphic symbol then make the guide lines which will define where to put every window and the distance between each window from every side...u can do this in may ways...my way isn't the only way...maybe u can just start with guide lines and define windows and distance guide lines then start drawing one them ( cuz the line will be snapped to the guide line ) and in the end u will get something like in the pic. below

--------------------

as u get here...take a look at what u drew..all are squares...if u exporet this into AM u will get no holes...cuz u will note that all the hor and ver lines are crossed which will make 4 points patches...to solve this...u add a horizintal line in the middel of each window then go to the line inisde the window and delet it...do this for all windows...in this case...u will got holes...

-----------------------

after that u can draw a big box and scale it so all windows are inside...the lines of the windows must cross the lines of this box to get a connected shape...( i know i'm using stupid english but forgive me...maybe pix and source files would help me to explain what i'm talking about )

 

one more thing...the drawn box should not have fill color at all...only lines...

 

when u go to AM...import your file then just choose the holes ot the windows and do extrude..that's all for the holes...what about the windows...infact...there's no windows...it's only a decal image made from the same squares i did in flash...i go back to flash and fill those window holes with a color then select them all and cop them...make a new layer and do a paste in place...using the ink bottle tool u make the outlines for each fill then delet the fill and save your work...now delet the layer contains our first outlines to leave only our new layer and export it as illistrator file...when done...do a redo to get back our deleted layer...if u don't do that..everything will be exported...this for the patch of the windows...decaling is made with the same layer...choose one of the symboles and edit it...draw the window inside the outlines..and use a texture fill like wood or metal...leaving the glass area in white color....why?????? cuz after decaling this image u will add the same image to the same decal but as a reflection map and reduce the value to about 30%..that's all..i will advice to use the decal as a rotoscope...an option can be found in the decal properties box to match the window patchs with our decal....aaaah....tired of writing...is there any point i missed to explain????!!!

[Jin-Kazama]

thax everyone:

 

 

ddustin: i'm sure that we have to check the patch

 

counts..in this case...game modeling method is the

 

solution, however. sme buildings must have at less window

 

extrueded holes for the shape..maybe would increase the

 

patch count a littel...

 

 

Sevenar: all what u said is good...u may start doing your

 

model from now...even i think we must do the mesurment for

 

everything to come up with hight valuse for each floor of

 

our buildings...refering to real mesurments...i don't have

 

good resource for this...also...i would ask someone who

 

knows those ppl who do cities desings to do us one map

 

like the image here.

 

..the city shouldn't be very big...we

 

can devide the city into distrects...so later we can

 

attache each one to the other..this in case of if we think

 

to do a game...but those who would use the city for some

 

animation...a distrect would be enough...also we will need

 

to gether all images available for some streets and some

 

buildings..as far as i know..buildings usually have stores

 

and shops in the ground floor...then a normal building

 

with windows...the style of those buildings is very

 

important..we can't use one bulding for more than 2 places

 

even if we change the decaling image..maybe the last one

 

would work a bit...the details should be in those gorund

 

floor stuff..where the camera will move around...but for

 

building ...maybe a decaled image will do the requested

 

look...we must first come with the drawing of the city or

 

at less one distrect as a begingin and go on...if the idea

 

will work..we can move on with the rest of the city

 

those who think they're not good with

 

modelig...please...would u try it first...we are all here

 

to support you...we will learn together...and will push up

 

our skills together...everyone would give the help...and

 

this way we all will improve our selves...remeber one

 

thing...even me....i'm just a newbi...

 

this project is very huge...means it need a real ppl who

 

will go on with it till end....i promise to go on till the

 

end....

[KenH]

I would advise starting with just one street. Once that goal is reached, then you'll be encouraged and you'll also have things to use in other streets like bins, lights etc.

 

Cars and people could be moved to whatever street is being used. They whole city doesn't need them.

 

Also, more than a few streets would be big enough. Just make sure there is plenty of variety. From these elements, more streets can be made up to peoples liking.

[Rodney]

First... great idea! I'm glad someone is taking the ball and running with it.

 

I think multiple models combined in a choreography will serve you (and the community best. You could probably even think up a shorthand way of letting the user know what type of roadway the building set/street contained so that users could change/update models on the fly.

 

Count me in for Baker Street.

[ruscular]

Winding your way down to baker street. light in your head and dead on your feet, and its another crazy day and your drinking it away! To forget about everything!

 

It would be so kewl to make a spiderman city, or even batman from Tim Burton vision.

As for the decal the detail versus the high poly count. Maybe organize the building for background versus up close high poly count? My brother-in-law was a city planner. Want me to see if I can get a real city layout from him?

[Jin-Kazama]

yes ruscular, please...ask him for a distrect diagram first....it's a start up to c how we would manage modeling and decaling...if it was ok...we will move on with the rest of the project...

 

Rodney: i'm more than happy cuz u read my thread....a big honor...i was thinking about preparing a package of the buildings used for this distrect...and actions which will arrange them in the chore making it easier for users to setup the buildings without any problems...i'm modeling hash stadium now...maybe tonight i can post something...your support at HASH is what i need...thanx alot and please except me as a loyal user ( after i escaped once )

 

your brother...jin kazama

[nixie]

Perhaps if people from diferent countries submitted buildings styled as such, we could have a street for each country or style? this way we'd get allot of variety whilst keeping a 'real' building look. China town, little england, Usa town etc?

 

Its an idea, good luck with the stadium!

 

- Nixie

[Jin-Kazama]

hi there

 

 

still working on this stadium....i hope it would look great when finish...

 

[KenH]

Wow! It's looking great already. A bit of colour seems to be the finishing touch. Good work.

[thejobe]

[falls out of chiar]

owww wow thats really awsome!!!

man how long did that take

oh wait it isnt finished still wow just wow

make the seats red like at a real football game

jay

[bentothemax]

*Cough* 5020394832 billiion pathes *cough*

 

BTW what is the patch count on that thing?

 

 

Hey, That is looking swwwwwwwweeeeeeeeeeetttt!!!!!

 

 

 

I could build an older type of house for a more old american look if you want. I could also build a newage type of office building!

 

 

Just tell me, and i'll pretty much do, cuz im bored

 

 

Ben

[thejobe]

im going to try building something now hehe

but i cant gareentee anything

[Jin-Kazama]

thanx guys for your replies....infact....this stadium has a very very very low patch counts...it is not as it looks...chairs....lots of patchs....hehhehe...those chairs are decaled cockie cut maps only....tomorow ( after 10 hours from now ) i will post u the wireframe image and everything about how i made this one....thanx again...and..hwwwwwom.....i can't open my eyes.....

 

(sleeping on the keyboard )

[Nosferatu]

Will you be modeling people to fill up the stadium?

 

We'll give you until Monday.

 

Nos

[KenH]

I just saw this in AM:Stills. Wow! Imagine getting that for the city!

 

http://www.hash.com/stills/displayimage.php?album=1&pos=-123

[nickpoz]

I have no Idea what kind of building to make! Maybe I'll just make a coffee shop or something...

[Jin-Kazama]

hio again....look at the wireframe of my stadium..sorry to not beeing writting for some days cuz i was preparing my self in the new branch of the company i'm working in....it's near my house

[KenH]

Absolutely stunning! I feel like getting out the footy ball and having a kick around now.

[Julian]

For those of you who want to work on high-rise buildings, have you thought about doing variable numbers of floors? You could have one model for the ground floor, one model for a middle floor, and one model for the top floor or roof, and then constrain them together in the choreography with multiple instances of the middle floor model. Alternatively, the ground floor could be the base model, and all the floors above it can be action objects. You could make different actions to produce different numbers of floors.

[Grafikimon]

removed

[Grafikimon]

removed

Edited August 26, 2005 by Grafikimon

[nickpoz]

I have a question. Do we have to model interiors, or just the exterior?

[iocane]

Could some forested area be added next to the city, or maybe a park? I am interested in putting togeather some buildings for the city to.

[gonzo3d]

While I am still a newbie here, I believe I've earned my chops in the real-time arena, where I do this "city building" every day.

 

Here are a few things to keep in mind. First, develop around a unit. This can be a dimension, but it's better for plugging different objects together if there is a common dimension. At work we use 660 feet as a unit; modules must be some multiple of this base unit. We plug different modules together to make cities. Someone here said at sometime that 660' is a city block, but I don't buy that. It is a minimum dimension for putting a nice 4-way intersection in though. You can categorize your modules as has been mentioned for different building grammars (ie, look and feel) but random mixing will not really work without some general conventions for the different floors/styles.

 

Some of our categories here at work include:

rural, freeway, urban, generic, filler, panorama..

 

Do a little work up front if you are serious about having multiple people work on this, as in specifications. Figure out how you want the roads: 2 lane, 4 lane, 4 lane with center turn lane, etc. Figure out if there will be different classes of roads - 2 lane (new) versus 2 lane (old). Publish these specs and the pieces should all play nicely together. You may even want to develop some guidelines in terms of amount of splineage per unit.

 

Check out http://www.vterrain.org/

for more info re: buildings, etc. - they have an existing virtual world project going, and you can drop in and check out how others have approached this.

 

Good luck, keep us posted!

[Mr. Jaqe]

Jin - the only wee thing that iffs me about your stadium is: the Grass. It reminds me of the decal'd grass used in FA Premier League Manager '98. Most grass formations are eitehr stripes, about 3-4m wide or tubey/circely, 3-4m thick.

 

Other than that: Awsome idea, great start and hopefully great people will help you with this!

[ruscular]

no word from my brother-in-law on city layout. Sorry guys!

[Jin-Kazama]

i was trying to plan something.....can someone add more stuff to this image???

[nickpoz]

Just finished draft #1 of the coffee shop I mentioned earlier. I used Projection Maps so the textures can change if they have to. I really need suggestions

[iocane]

Suggestion, I think the ceiling light fixtures shouldn't be a color that blends in with the bricks.

[nickpoz]

Suggestion, I think the ceiling light fixtures shouldn't be a color that blends in with the bricks.

I thought that it might not stick out enough, so maybe a dark blue?

[nickpoz]

Some Material changes.

[Nosferatu]

Some Material changes.

I notice your textures are stretched on the vertical surfaces. Not so on your original. You must have changed the mapping method to spherical or cylindrical.

 

I would scale the textures down. Yo might also want to use a lighter color on the lamps and chairs so as to see the shading better.

 

Keep posting!

 

Nos

[Zaryin]

This is a awesome idea for a project. Are you planning on trying to put all these building together into one project? That seems like it would be getting a little spline heavy after awhile...

[Jin-Kazama]

Zaryin, for the heavy spline...sure it will....but i won't do the hall city in one chore...only distrects of it....and i'm not planing to have interor modeling...only buildings

thanks for the coffee shop....i have some miss all round my life cuz this new branch....next week i will start making the city and before that i will upload the first distrect map so each of u can take a part of it...also the style..mesurements ...so all buildings have the same hight and style....thans for your support guys

[nickpoz]

and i'm not planing to have interor modeling...only buildings

thanks for the coffee shop....

No problem... so I shouldn't have the interior... few! Not that it was incredibly hard or anything, but it makes life easier just the same!

[jakerupert]

Hi all,

 

The idea off having an Hash-opensource-city, that everybody can use freely as sets for ones own movies really faszinates me.

Just think of all the possibilities, when time by time even models with heavy splinage will become less problematic with the computerspeed and Ram encreasing steadily, finally even an online-comunity could be possible, with every hash-user building his own house or apartment and having his own avatar, maybe with arcticpigs, but stop, maybe thats aiming too far for the time being.

Lets start simple!

I would suggest two versions or maybe two parts of the city, one proxy-like with just decaled blocks like in a game and one more detailed and even with interiors in parts ( I think, this could be reached by a modular aproach )

 

I started a thread on this in the German-hash-forum, to make a part of the Hash-city, thats mostly Germanstyle, that could be integrated lateron into the big

Hashcity.

 

I called it "Hashburg".

 

Anybody interested in the modell can download it at:

 

http://www.jostkeller.de/dreid/testing/hashburg220805.prj

 

If anybody else is interested in contributing to this modell, even smaller parts,

just pick one of the proxyparts and model happily away on it in an own project, so that it can be integrated later on.

 

What do you folk think of the model?

Well at least its a start

 

;>) Jake

[iocane]

The model has lots of potential

[Jin-Kazama]

hi brother and sisters

jakerupert: hashburg seems to be very good idea....as i think..a disict of the big city is very good idea...we can connect it with a highway road...this city must be done...and must be done 100% as perfect as it could be....i'm about to finish the map of the distrect...and give the mesurments to you so you canstart creating your won buildings...i'm very happy that my idea got all this care...on friday the map will be uploaded and we all will start it....i will create a site for this city...will have buildings download section...fore each part and also screen shots...let's do some good work....and i'm sorry again cuz i couldn't do the map quickly cuz the transfaring f my job distroyded my time....

 

 

thanks hashers

[jakerupert]

Great....

what do you folks think of making the licenceagreement for profesional use that way, that only people, who have contributed to the city, are allowed to use it?

 

The intention is clear, I presume?

 

;>) Jake

[seven]

I think it is best to use metric coordinates - a world standard - not feet and inches.

Perhaps jakerupert can insert some coordinates on his map - and suggest some different house types - and suggest some different official and commercial buildings?

So it not will end up in everyone doing a villa!