Displacement Dragon

[JohnArtbox]

Started this dragon to test the new displacement.

This was just a quick preliminary to check the effect. Still need to decal the rest of the model (arms and legs).

[attachmentid=13386]

and a wireframe so that you can gauge the effect.

[attachmentid=13387]

[Zaryin]

That looks awesome so far! Keep showing the progress on this.

[Rodney]

So far so VERY good John!

 

Would it be safe to say the ultimate trick might be to render your dragon model in its final form with displacement and then reimport those displaced renders as the final displacement maps for final tweaking. Or is that perhaps unnecessary or even overkill?

 

Rodney

[3DArtZ]

Must upgrade soon

 

Mike Fitz

www.3dartz.com

[JohnArtbox]

Next update. I love this new displacement.

[attachmentid=13418]

and this is what the displacement maps look like. There seems to be something unusual going on in the displacement on the dragons chest and belly where it doesn't seem to match the actual maps shown here

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Now that the object is decalled it should be fun to try different versions

For comparison here's the AM12 version...much longer render times

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[Zaryin]

Actually, the v12 one looks pretty good. But it could be your lighting and the amount of displacement. Do a v13 render with better lighting and a higher value.

[Mr. Jaqe]

I just have to say this: Ho-ly crap! So few patches and splines, yet it looks like a billion-spline model on the render.

 

Wow. Show us some more!

[JohnArtbox]

another displacement dragon.

Jeff: the am12 dragon faired reasonably well but there are noticeable 5 point patch and hook artifacts.

MrJage: a few more to come

[attachmentid=13427]

I still seem to be getting a few seams on stamp borders but that could be my maps.

[JohnArtbox]

colour and displacement only. Learning, learning, learning

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[MMZ_TimeLord]

Lookin good there John... Can't wait for it to breath fire and ROAR!

[Eric2575]

Sorry guys, but I'm not up to date on this. When did this displacement feature first appear? Sound like something I could use on my T-rex.

[MMZ_TimeLord]

Since V13 Alphas started showing up I believe. Check the thread here...

 

Oz Map -- Another v13 Displacement Fun Thread

[JohnArtbox]

New displacement was added in AM 13 Alpha 4 last Friday. There are versions for the AM 2005 and AM 2006 subscriptions, but as Yves mentioned in another thread, it's an alpha. I built and decalled the dragon in 12 and only switched it into 13 at rendertime. I also kept a version of the am12 dragon as the file format has evolved and AM13 files are not backwards compatible.

[John Bigboote]

A:M 13 files are NOT backwards compatable...we went thru this before right? was'nt it v 9 files that were not BC to 8...? It wasn't THAT big of a deal tho v9 is not many Hasher's most favorite...

 

THIS new feature is big.... BIG. It's got me balancing my checkbook to see how I can swing the upgrade, but I will. ONE QUESTION: How do these new fancy-shmancy displacements hold-up in animated situations... I'm sure they will expand and contract with the patch they are assigned to... but with extreme settings won't this cause the geometry to overlap? As a patch goes from flat to rounded what is the basis for the extrusions direction? The normal?

 

Another question: Once applied, does the modified geometry show in the modelling window or do you need to do a test render (shift Q) to see it's effect?

 

And yet another: What will this do to the new 'normal-mapping' feature...and will we even need to use bump mappes anymore?

 

And a comment: I am glad to see Hash did not go 'superstitious' to the number 13, I LOVE the sound of 'version 13'. I bet the lawyers for Maya would NEVER allow such a 'moondog title' to grace their product... but then, looks like they may never get to see version 10...

 

EDIT: THANKS to John Artbox for pioneering this new feature for us!

[robcat2075]

How does the rendertime of the map as a displacement compare to the same map as a bump map?

[KenH]

Displacements do show in realtime. But only at the highest "PageUp" setting. Slows the computer though.

 

Normal mapping and bump mapping are still valid. They render quicker because they don't actually deform the surface. Still useful for the small details.

[patrick_j_clarke]

Awesome, awesome!

 

Any chance we could get a screen grab of what you're doing in Zbrush to paint these maps?

 

Isn't it funny how all of this was timed perfectly?

 

Good programming, Martin! Good examples and implementation, John!

 

- pjc

[Paul Forwood]

Matt, I think it is going to take a while to get used to displacement maps and to discover where they can and can't be used. So far I have found them fun to play with but they do slow down interaction unless you turn off decals. Render times are not too bad unless the surfaces with the displacement map are large. I have brought my PC to a halt several times while trying to render.

 

I am getting varying results from my tests which include mixing bump, displacement and colour maps along with particle hair on a large terrain. I have noticed what looks like popping in some tests. If you observe the rocks in the following clip you will see a little of this:

 

[attachmentid=13481]

 

These rocks are modelled and the displacement used to rough them up a little.

Bump maps are still very much appreciated by me and I think that I will only use displacement in situations where bumps don't quite cut it. Useful for brick walls, rock, background objects that can be rendered seperately. I'll keep testing them in the hope that I can find a good balance.

[MattWBradbury]

Reminds me of something I see in myst every time I go to a new age. The camera flies around the island and shows where you are going to start.

 

John, try using ambient occlusion to get your renders if your using the alpha version of v13.

They're in the choreography properties. Set Global Ambience Type to Global Color, then set Ambience Intensity to 100%, then set Ambience Occlusion to 100% and render. Make sure that you have Ambience Occlusion turned on in the Render Options. You can set the quality of the lighting by increasing the Occlusion Sampling (Maximum 100%).

This should get you better lighting. You can set the occlusin smapling to 30% to get acceptable renders without texturing.

[JohnArtbox]

Rendertime comparison was bump 2:32 and displacement 4:24, with both files identical in all other ways.

I get realtime displacement in every viewport except the camera one. It's still a bit early to consign bump maps to their grave, but I'll certainly use them less.

Patrick: I'm just using the standard zbrush displacement workflow outlined in the ZBrush practical guide, if you have any specific questions feel free to email me, but these cover the workflow more thoroughly than anything I could throw together.

Matt: I did a quick render with the image based lighting, but I need to work it out still. One new feature at a time . I figure the whole IBL lighting is being well explored in the radiousity forum, and since I was one of the nagging forces behind displacement, I thought I should champion it.

[attachmentid=13522]

[Zaryin]

Hey John, that looking awsome so far. I really don't see that much of a difference betweeen the bump and displace. It might jsut be the view though. Looks great either way.

[JohnArtbox]

The difference is on the edges, and the fact that the displacement holds up better as you get closer and the angle changes

[John Bigboote]

Yes! You can REALLY see the difference in the underside of the dragons neck where you can see the outline being 'raised' by the displacement, but it is smoothe on the bump model...awesome!