need inspiration for Logo

[jason1025]

So I want to create a 3-4 second cg logo using AM.

 

Particularly I would like to use some of the cool features of AM or at least 2 or 3.

Like Hair, AO, cloth, Dynamics, Norton, SSS and Radiosity.

 

This is my site and company. www.lightdims.com

 

I want to push the envelope but at the same time keep it simple and elegant like something from Apple.

[robcat2075]

idea...

 

We see "light dims" on screen but the dots over the i's are like LED lights and they are so bright that we can't really read the words.

 

Then a hand or finger or something puts a lightdim on each dot (or maybe they just fly in on their own), that cuts the glare, and we can now read "light dims". Yay.

[agep]

idea...

 

We see "light dims" on screen but the dots over the i's are like LED lights and they are so bright that we can't really read the words.

 

Then a hand or finger or something puts a lightdim on each dot (or maybe they just fly in on their own), that cuts the glare, and we can now read "light dims". Yay.

Clever! I like it

[robcat2075]

crude storyboard...

 

a font with fat letters would probably work well so the I dots can be large.

 

Of course they could be 3D letters.

 

[jason1025]

I like it. So how much do I need to pay u and agep to make it happen ?

[jason1025]

I love this idea. But it seems very easily done in AE. How can i do this idea but show off some of AM abilities?

[robcat2075]

Your product is about light. To me that's probably not much about cloth or hair.

 

I'd suggest some nice 3D letters lit with AO. A:M has a really good lens flare ability to make the glare.

 

 

in 3 seconds there isn't much time to do stuff.

[jason1025]

Ooo Robert u and your dam logic. If it were up to u Critically acclaimed classics like the Transformers Trilogy would have never been made.

[jason1025]

Robert watch this. Stan reminds me of u

 

http://www.southparkstudios.com/full-episo...ure-getting-old

[mouseman]

I tried to do a quick rendition based on Robcat's storyboard, and had some problems with volumetric lights not being blocked out by the "light dim" model being placed in front of it in a chor.

lightdimproject.zip

[robcat2075]

I tried to do a quick rendition based on Robcat's storyboard, and had some problems with volumetric lights not being blocked out by the "light dim" model being placed in front of it in a chor.

 

Use lens flare instead of volumetric. Use a fat san-serif font like Arial Bold or Black (unless that's the official "light dims" font). And it will need a ground and a background for the AO to be apparent.

 

I see it as looking like a "white" render.

 

 

Are there any round light dims? If not, pretend there are!

 

[jason1025]

I tried to do a quick rendition based on Robcat's storyboard, and had some problems with volumetric lights not being blocked out by the "light dim" model being placed in front of it in a chor.

 

 

Interesting. Thanks for the effort.

[mouseman]

Use lens flare instead of volumetric.

 

Lens flares seem like a much better solution. I tried playing with lens flares for 45 minutes and couldn't get them to even show up before I realized I had the lights INSIDE the model. Doh! But now it seems to work well.

 

I played around with the timing quite a bit to get something that seemed well timed to me.

 

Anyways, I haven't changed the font yet, as Jason hasn't mentioned any preference. The color of the light dims are probably wrong. Should there be more light visible at the end, since they are supposed to be readable but not glaring? Also, I don't have a good eye for lighting, so things could be improved there. And I'm still playing with the background plane.

 

EDIT: If you want, I could use COMIC SANS for the font! (and this is me ducking!)

lightdim2.zip

[jason1025]

Use lens flare instead of volumetric.

 

Lens flares seem like a much better solution. I tried playing with lens flares for 45 minutes and couldn't get them to even show up before I realized I had the lights INSIDE the model. Doh! But now it seems to work well.

 

I played around with the timing quite a bit to get something that seemed well timed to me.

 

Anyways, I haven't changed the font yet, as Jason hasn't mentioned any preference. The color of the light dims are probably wrong. Should there be more light visible at the end, since they are supposed to be readable but not glaring? Also, I don't have a good eye for lighting, so things could be improved there. And I'm still playing with the background plane.

 

EDIT: If you want, I could use COMIC SANS for the font! (and this is me ducking!)

 

Interesting

[mouseman]

Interesting

Is it something you want to follow up with? By yourself or with me? Either way, there's no charge, it's yours free and clear. There are a million things that could be done. Change the font, change the background, change the colors of the lights, change parameters on the lights, change the colors of the light dims, change the opacity/transparency of the light dims, etc.

[jason1025]

Interesting

Is it something you want to follow up with? By yourself or with me? Either way, there's no charge, it's yours free and clear. There are a million things that could be done. Change the font, change the background, change the colors of the lights, change parameters on the lights, change the colors of the light dims, change the opacity/transparency of the light dims, etc.

 

 

I appreciate the help. Its not a bad test. But it has that 1988 CG look to it. I think its going to take a lot of testing and work to get it to 2011. I either want to spend money on someone who can make a cutting edge 2011 look or just try to do it myself.

 

If you look at Agep work his renders are cutting edge, hi gloss and slick.

 

I am going for the high production value look.

 

Thats why I mentioned that I concentrate on the buzz features of AM like radiosity, ao, sss, newton, cloth and so on.

 

I will probably get some disgruntled feed back from this comment but as the years go by most of the work put out via AM seems to stagnate in time somewhere back in the late 80's.

 

That might be ok for some just playing around but I work in an HD and higher world. The next gen ipad is going to have a 2K resolution, the next apple monitors are going to be 4k.

 

The quality and resolution of AM renders need to go up.

 

Its not our fault. We don't have what other packages do. "HARDWARE rendering" So because it takes forever to render something that looks halfway descent say 2001 ish.

 

O I know AM can do it, that is Render something that looks like it is cutting edge, but its not easy. Most people cant rap their head around Radiosity even if they do have the render power.

 

 

I am extremely appreciative of V16 and its net render not to mention 64bit.

 

I think something needs to fundamentally change with the software in terms of ease of use for making these high value features like SSS, radisoity, AO, Newton, Cloth, Dynamics, and so on more instant in feedback

[Fuchur]

I appreciate the help. Its not a bad test. But it has that 1988 CG look to it. I think its going to take a lot of testing and work to get it to 2011. I either want to spend money on someone who can make a cutting edge 2011 look or just try to do it myself.

 

Lets say 1998, not 1988...

But yes, default lightening without environmentmaps, IBL or HDRI can easily look not that cutting edge...

 

So, lets face it: AO is very easy to get working, IBL is very easy too and radiosity is not needed in most cases. AO and IBL is enough for most things.

You can create little wonders with the Environement-shader or a good Env-Map so... shiny things are easy to create with those...

As easy as any other software or even less hard to work with.

 

A:M lags of arealights a little but you dont really need them to create good looking images.

If you found a workflow which gives you a nice look, you can copy from it with a good enough output if you ask me.

 

See you

*Fuchur*

[John Bigboote]

I think something needs to fundamentally change with the software in terms of ease of use for making these high value features like SSS, radisoity, AO, Newton, Cloth, Dynamics, and so on more instant in feedback

 

 

For the most part, I know what you are talking about. Stian's renders DO look better than most peoples, and I would attribute that to Stian having more experience than most of us. If our user base were 100X larger, we would have 100 Stians... and think of all the great samples we would see. The software we use is highly capable of modern day quality... just like the 'big-boy' packages out there are highly capable of producing crap renders. I know, I tried.

 

Most of the features you mention as having bad feedback(above) are actually quite tactile in my opinion. Dynamics are instant. Cloth and Newton require a simulation, but it is quite quick.

 

GPU rendering is coming, I think.

[pixelplucker]

This might sound stupid but are you going to use the logo on anything other than just the website? Usually easier to take a nice 2d logo and make it 3d than the other way around.

[robcat2075]

I think something needs to fundamentally change with the software in terms of ease of use for making these high value features like SSS, radisoity, AO, Newton, Cloth, Dynamics, and so on more instant in feedback

 

What apps have instant SSS or radiosity? FakeAO can be faster it it were GPU like in games but real AO... does anyone have truly real AO that is instant?

 

I know Newton was originally made for game engines so it is potentially real time, but is that still feasible in 3D apps that are not controlled situations like games are?

 

The real-time cloth approaches I've seen are only for limited situations. Is there an all-purpose, realtime cloth out there? Pixar doesn't have real-time cloth in their pipeline.

 

 

 

When I pitched my concept for your logo I was thinking of something similar to this in look...

 

 

 

 

Pixar probably has the simplest studio logo in the biz and it looks great... what about that is not do-able in A:M?

[mouseman]

As Robcat points out, the best logos are simple and clean. Pixar, Apple, Google, Microsoft. You indicated Apple in the original post. The important thing about a logo is what it evokes. Maybe it's not the right approach to say, "I want a 3-4 second 3D logo", but rather what do I want the logo to say, what colors say that, what images or icons evoke it? A lot of that has to be decided before the decision of how to do it within A:M is made.

 

I think one thing that is missing - not from A:M, but from the logo inspiration - is that logos need to have a ... "motif"? A color scheme, a theme, a "texture", a reason for being. They need to say something about the product or company they are representing.

 

People don't care that South Park is freakin' paper cut-outs! It means something to them, and is a symbol. You need the symbol first, and build the look around it. Once you have that, I'm sure it would be possible to translate that into something very appealing and iconic within A:M.

 

The main elements you have available to you are the LEDs (source of the problem), eyes that perceive the light (perceivers of the problem), the people that are annoyed by the light (the victims of the problem and their reaction), and the light dims (the solution!). You already are using sun glasses in some visuals. "Shades". What if you had the text with a bright light, and a hand comes up to it and pulls down a shade over it? Do you have a tag line? What about "Put a shade over it!". Or "Shade it out." Or "Dim it down". Maybe there is a pun or word play that could be made with the product name, as "Light" is the near opposite of "Dim". When animated, should there be a motion for it being applied/"peeled" on or should it plop on? Should it make a sound? What about focusing on the frustration? Someone gets annoyed at a light, glares at it, and then a light dim pops out of their eyes and land over the LED. What about a super hero doing the job of covering it up? What about arrows (with the suction cups on the end) that fly in and hit an LED on an appliance, then fall off to reveal that they've left a light dim behind, and then maybe the sound of a sigh of relief?

 

A few months ago, someone was talking about the "Slap Chop" commercials, and how their kids were glued to the TV every time the commercial came on. You can search for it on YouTube. The attraction there is totally audio - the guy's voice. The big thing to know up front is what about the logo will grab attention.

 

The other thing to remember is that logos get tweaked over time. Google has gone through a number of subtle color, shading, and texture changes on their logo.

 

That's it for my brainstorming for now. Just don't get disappointed because of what the software can't do without knowing what you really want! Especially when what you want should probably be simple in the first place.

[jason1025]

I appreciate all your feedback.

[Rodney]

An interesting difference between the Light Dims logo Chris rendered and the PIXAR logo (as well as many other similiar animated logos) is that at the end of the sequence an important element in the logo usually brightens up. With Light Dims we have something of a mental reversal in the process because the product itself is all about dimming lights. This works at odds with the standard approach but could still be taken advantage of. For instance, as the lights are dimmed by the Light Dims and fade away, the product name itself could brighten up, leaving the most important element of the product (what you really want to be remembered by the viewer) burned into their brains in plain sight. I assume the volume and tempo of any music might rise like that in the THX sound sequence as the name brightens and then everything (sound and image) goes silent.

 

Nice job Chris.

[Paul Forwood]

How's this for a concept?

LightDims05u.mov

It would need to be worked up, polished and some sounds added but it gives you an almost self explanatory LD logo.

[robcat2075]

How's this for a concept?

LightDims05u.mov

It would need to be worked up, polished and some sounds added but it gives you an almost self explanatory LD logo.

 

I like the design on that.

[Bruce Del Porte]

I don't know the magnitude of reach you expect for this logo but ideally you want a level of simplicity that your logo speaks to your brand from 5 pt. type to blown up on a Jumbotron. Think Nike, IBM, McDonalds, and Coke. Ideally, you want it to hold up in low resolution black & white, embroidered on hats, and silk screened on tee-shirts. If the logo relies on color contrast or gradients to be recognizable, a lot of places you want to use it will be hard to implement. A animated version is a very cool but is only useful in video applications. Your animation looks really good and will polish up nicely but I would make sure the final static logo will read on all conceivable uses. It isn't easy, that is why Madison Ave charges big bucks for a logo.

[jason1025]

How's this for a concept?

LightDims05u.mov

It would need to be worked up, polished and some sounds added but it gives you an almost self explanatory LD logo.

 

 

That has a lot of potential

[jason1025]

I don't know the magnitude of reach you expect for this logo but ideally you want a level of simplicity that your logo speaks to your brand from 5 pt. type to blown up on a Jumbotron. Think Nike, IBM, McDonalds, and Coke. Ideally, you want it to hold up in low resolution black & white, embroidered on hats, and silk screened on tee-shirts. If the logo relies on color contrast or gradients to be recognizable, a lot of places you want to use it will be hard to implement. A animated version is a very cool but is only useful in video applications. Your animation looks really good and will polish up nicely but I would make sure the final static logo will read on all conceivable uses. It isn't easy, that is why Madison Ave charges big bucks for a logo.

 

 

good point

[mouseman]

Yes, it is rather clean, includes a visible demonstration/representation of the product, and is primarily based on 2 colors. Quite attractive!

[Paul Forwood]

And if you want to lose the glow you could have something like this suitable for white paper:

[jason1025]

Finally getting around to this.

 

The text is modified from the font plugin. I fashioned it after the avengers font.

 

[pixelplucker]

How's this for a concept?

LightDims05u.mov

It would need to be worked up, polished and some sounds added but it gives you an almost self explanatory LD logo.

 

 

Nice design but seems off balance with the darker colors on one side, make all the text one shade or swap a color out so darks aren't all on one side.

 

When I first look at it I see the bright box and light. Flopping the box and shade might balance it out.

 

JMO

[jason1025]

This is a test I did using a trick I learned from matt cambel.

 

I didnt end up using this because the idea seemed better than the end product.

 

I was going to say say something like LightDims stickers fit most led's while this animation played.

tt4_000.mov

[jason1025]

[robcat2075]

Looks high dollar!

[jason1025]

Thanks, That is the highest compliment in my book.

[jason1025]

I should have said in the video that you can fine tune any of those looks with the slider below.

Photoshop_EXR_tut.mov

[jason1025]

I would really appreciate it if someone could help me figure out whats causing this?Silver_dims_logo4.prj

[Rodney]

When I render the project I'm not getting that circle so I'm scratching my head a little thinking about what it could be.

It looks to me like something the clone tool in Photoshop would make.

 

Since your Kicker Light is pointing to that exact location I'm going to guess that is the problem. When you adjust the light in Photoshop it is revealing that subtle shift in pixel color change. So, yeah... move or alter your Kicker Light and see if the problem doesn't go away.

[jason1025]

I think your on to something. Thanks Rodney.

[Rodney]

Oh! I just remembered something related to your experimentation with altering EXRs in Photoshop.

 

You have simply got to investigate A:M's Compositor. IT IS INSANE!

Many of the things you are doing with this still imagery in Photoshop you can do with animated sequences in A:M.