Drakkheim Posted January 26, 2004 Posted January 26, 2004 Update: Project finished and available for playing with... This is just an FX shot that im playing with. The main model still needs to be textured and finished, but the FX are pretty close to being done.. just need to fade the particles out before they die.. 600kb quicktime can be found here. Feedback welcome -Drakkheim Quote
Grubber Posted January 26, 2004 Posted January 26, 2004 Wow! That's really nice! I woald like to now how to make that! Quote
Drakkheim Posted January 26, 2004 Author Posted January 26, 2004 Thanks Grubber, Here's the project as it currently stands if you want to pick at it and see how it works. Enjoy! -Drakk shiptest_early.zip Quote
Zaryin Posted January 26, 2004 Posted January 26, 2004 If you can get the toon line problem worked out, this is going to look great. Quote
Drakkheim Posted January 27, 2004 Author Posted January 27, 2004 FYI: This isn't the toon version which im having problems, this version is rendered with an actual skydome and skylight. I think im going to try and see if i can pull the shot off going for that 'realistic' look. Still below --: -Drakk Quote
johnl3d Posted January 27, 2004 Posted January 27, 2004 Nice use of sprites... by the way I looked at the toon problem a little and didn't see a solution eithertoo many ripples that are slightly two small too many ripples that are slightly two small Quote
hashlister Posted January 28, 2004 Posted January 28, 2004 Nice work! I've always been strangely interested in AirCrashes. Again, Nice work! Now- If I may, the 'smoke' seems to arise way too fast, almost 'out of scale'. Now I'll quit kiaboshin- Again, Nice work! Campy Quote
Aminator Posted January 28, 2004 Posted January 28, 2004 Really cool look. There's a slight "video game" feel to the effect. I agree that the smoke rises too fast. Was it intentional the way the aircraft penetrates a "focus barrier" and goes from blurry to sharp along its length? But the biggest problem is, with that dramatic fireball on the way down, how are you going to top it with an even bigger explosion when it hits the ground? Quote
Drakkheim Posted January 28, 2004 Author Posted January 28, 2004 hehe thanks guys. as for the focus barrier... just call that non multipass motion blur. I see what you mean with the smoke rising too fast ..that shouldn't be too hard to fix. And what I had planned on was after the plane hits and slides for a few feet (gotta spray up some dirt and stuff in front.) It would start flipping and disintegrating throwing bits and pieces of itself in every which way, and bouncing like crazy, followed by an even bigger kaboom. :-D but first, i've gotta finish the model and get it textured. I'll post some more wips as that comes along. -D Quote
tobinjim Posted January 28, 2004 Posted January 28, 2004 You know, it's not like we're all a bunch of sadists, but I'll bet we all did light small fires when we were young'ns. That aside, my opinion would be: Why continue to model something you're just going to blow up? In fact, as a far as feedback goes, I'll be we'll all contribute a lot more helpful information to the explosion of parts and dirt and gas tanks and stuff than we will the actual modeling So, how about appeasing the adoring masses first and get on with the action!?!? Ever looked at the F-22? Pretty boring on the outside -- for small radar cross section reasons! But if we had footage of one hitting the ground (with pilot swinging safely under a parachute, of course) -- now that'd be something to see!!!! Jim Quote
sjcrerar Posted January 29, 2004 Posted January 29, 2004 The FX are really excellent. But I have one concern that will end up sounding like a science lesson. Hashlister mentioned that the smoke seems to be rising too fast... The smoke should be following the exact same path as the flames. This is because they are both the same thing...except at different temperatures...as the ash is expelled off the wreck, it's freaking hot, causing it to glow (the fire)...but as it cools off it turns from yellow-red, then to black....the black being the smoke. But not all flames produce smoke... (because the hot products are water/carbon dioxide)... I hope this helps... You are definitely on the right track with your FX... Shane Quote
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted January 29, 2004 Hash Fellow Posted January 29, 2004 And what I had planned on was after the plane hits and slides for a few feetand have some "camera" shake when it hits. Quote
Drakkheim Posted January 31, 2004 Author Posted January 31, 2004 Thanks peoples. And what I had planned on was after the plane hits and slides for a few feet and have some "camera" shake when it hits. Oooh good idea! definatly gonna do that. The smoke should be following the exact same path as the flames. This is because they are both the same thing...except at different temperatures...as the ash is expelled off the wreck, it's freaking hot, causing it to glow (the fire)...but as it cools off it turns from yellow-red, then to black....the black being the smoke. kept that in mind as i made some changes... Its currently rendering and I should be able to update it by sunday night if it finishes rendering. So, how about appeasing the adoring masses first and get on with the action!?!? heh i agree, but things get more interesting when you strap on some missiles and bombs before slamming it into the ground Thanks again for the feedback Quote
jfirestine Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 All in all that is very good. One crit... I would have the smoke and flames not rise too quickly. The smoke should rise a bit slower in my opinion. Still a very good animation! Keep up the great work! Quote
Drakkheim Posted February 2, 2004 Author Posted February 2, 2004 adjusted the particle systems a good bit.. made some changes that worked and some that,... well... didn't ... Looks like im gonna be startting the particles out smaller so they dont appear to pop into existance. but overall I think its a step in the right direction. Have a looksie. -Drakk Quote
Aminator Posted February 2, 2004 Posted February 2, 2004 Looking very hot! Couple suggestions: (1) the ship appears to lose its forward momentum briefly when it hits the ground (2) the camera suddenly drops when the ship hits. But I'd imagine a cameraman following the ship down, a little more centered in the frame, continuing down at the same speed through the time the ship hits (because he's watching the ship, not the ground), then bouncing back up. (3) the camera shake is pretty good, but maybe less roll and more up/down tilt? Quote
Drakkheim Posted February 2, 2004 Author Posted February 2, 2004 ooh good call on the loss of momentum thing.. turns out tehre was a keyframe in there in which the ship did nothing but move directly away from the camera... should be smoother next pass. as for the camera motion im still poking at it. I hadnt noticecd that drop before, ive smoothed it out a little.. thanks Quote
Drakkheim Posted February 17, 2004 Author Posted February 17, 2004 well I finally got this thing finished. Only problem is, I cant render it. For some reason the particles shift around when I start rendering in the middle. I rendered the first 30 frames at 20 minutes a pop but when I went to start the render at frame 31 the particles are recalculated to be in a different position. And since there is no way I can let the computer render the entire sequence in one sitting I'm pretty much stuck at this point. So I've zipped the entire project and made it available on my website. you can get it HERE(5.5mb) if you want to play around with it. If you want to see the problem you can step forward to like frame 30 in the project. and then hit back.. It recalculates the position of the sprites and they shift around. -D Quote
Admin Rodney Posted February 17, 2004 Admin Posted February 17, 2004 Curious. I may be off the mark here but... Can you adjust the preroll? Does the option exist for you to adjust? If you can perhaps you can lower the preroll in your second instance to match the first. I've downloaded your project and will try to look at it first chance I get. Rodney Quote
Drakkheim Posted February 17, 2004 Author Posted February 17, 2004 I havent messed with the preroll thing before.. I'll take a look and see when I get a chance tonight. What my opinion of what's happening is, the collisions aren't being calculated properly. But i've been unbable to recreate it outside of this project. anyway here are some shots showing what the problem Im seeing Is: when I step forward from 0:0:00 to 0:00:29 the particles look like this. when I step forward to 0:01:00 the particles look like this. then when I step BACK to 0:00:29 the particles look like this. rendered frame 29: then when I restart the render on another dat at frame 30 the particles look like this: which is quite a bit different. -D Quote
natess44 Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 Maybe the guys at hash changed the sprites between versions? Quote
Admin Rodney Posted February 18, 2004 Admin Posted February 18, 2004 Maybe the guys at hash changed the sprites between versions? Excellent area for inspection. Did you upgrade or change any major setting in between final renders? Did anything change besides the times of rendering and frame numbers? Also: I rendered out frame 29 and 30 but I'm NOT getting the same results you did. I'm re-rendering frame 30 at this time. Is there any way what you've displayed is just one frame from one of the multipass renders. Flipping back and forth between the two chor shots you posted it appears to be a problem prior to render time. However, since we're looking at rendered images and not real time that may skew the results of our efforts to *see* what you see. Rodney Quote
Drakkheim Posted February 18, 2004 Author Posted February 18, 2004 well originally i had done everything in 10.5p i have since switched over to q hoping that it would fix it. no luck tho. If I start a render at frame 29 it gives me different results.. however starting at 0:00:00 and gradually woking my way up to 29 the position of the particles is different from when i start a render at 29. the frames 29 & 30 are just 2 numbers i pulled out of thin air, the particles jump about at any given frame provided I step up to it from 0:00:00 and then step backwards. ok here's step by step instructions to see 'what im seeing' so we can see if im cursed / jinxed. open up the choreography1 chor punch in 0:00:00 for the frame to jump to. press + on the keypad a bunch of times. Dont press any other buttons. stop when the chor advances to around frame 30 look at where the particles are. press the - key on your keypad once. The program then recalculates the postition of the particles... and they all jump around destroying my continuity. man i wish there was an easy way to show everyone im not crazy..... gonna try a couple other things -d Quote
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted February 18, 2004 Hash Fellow Posted February 18, 2004 man i wish there was an easy way to show everyone im not crazy.....Crazy people never know they are crazy. However, I did DL your project and see the same problem you do... I can advance to any frame then step back and the particles won't be positioned in the same way they had been before. Upon stepping back the smoke things seem to take on a more orderly, circular arrangement as if a turbulence was being omitted. Just a guess. I don't think this is the way it's supposed to work; particles are supposed animate the same no matter where you jump into your animation. If that's not true then rendering in passes for compositing purposes would be a hopeless technique in A:M, no? If you need to get this sequence rendered quickly in one "take", how about a 4-pass "multipass" render. I got 640x480 frames in about 35 seconds each that way and they didnt' look bad. There was detectable aliasing only on the ship itself and since it's crashing into the ground... who's going to notice? This is a neat looking shot you're putting together. Since you've got it all zipped up, you might as well ask the Hash folks about it. Either there's an A:M reason it's doing this, or it's misbehavior that needs to be corrected. Quote
natess44 Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 You know, I think I was having the same problem in v11 alpha 8 with the dynamic constraint. Didn't think of it untill you mentioned what you did to create the problem. It seemed that it was calculating from were I scrolled too, instead of from the begining. Quote
Drakkheim Posted February 18, 2004 Author Posted February 18, 2004 Crazy people never know they are crazy. Yeah that's what the voices kept telling me... Ok Now that my halucincations have been verified I'll ask the hash guys to take a look at this behavior. As for the render, I'm looking to do the final render (skylights, motionblur, & the whole shebang), I've got a stack of preview renders but the real thing just looks so much better. Thanks for taking the time to take a look at this gang. -D Quote
starwarsguy Posted August 9, 2004 Posted August 9, 2004 the file i downloaded just had the art in it Quote
Drakkheim Posted August 9, 2004 Author Posted August 9, 2004 I just checked the zip archive, its in there.. project file is called modelshopb.prj and turns out there is a second copy of itself in there... you can just ignore that :-D Here's the link again (5.5 mb zip file) Quote
Julian Posted August 10, 2004 Posted August 10, 2004 At the end of the animation, when there isn't any more motion blur applied to the sprites, the smoke looks very much like it's made of individual sprites. Maybe the sprite image should have more blur applied to it. Quote
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