Resurected old model

[ypoissant]

I have a couple weeks in front of me with a lot of available time so I decided to resurect an old (year 2000) model I had started but got diverted with skylights and never finished. Here comes the new revised edition. The head is completely new with v11 hair. The body is considerably reworked with about half less splines and smoother musculature. The anatomy, although quite exagerated, is more believable too. I am currently reworking the hands. Next, the arms need rework then dressing and eventuelly, I'm ready for rigging.

 

C&C are welcome.

[josema]

Fantastic! I'm trully without words! You really know your anatomy. I also like your style, very clean. Do you model from rotoscopes? Also, if I may, what is your thought process in modeling something like this? Do you draw the splines first on paper to figure them out, or do you work things out as you go?

[pabloschmid]

man this model is really great...!!!

Give her some designer clothes and make her ready for the A:M mascott 2005. I'm impressed

[ypoissant]

Do you model from rotoscopes?

The rework I just did is without rotoscope. I only looked a my numerous anatomy books and other photos references and went with my own feeling of the anatomy. However, when I originally modelled her, I was greatly inspired by Mike James (Azimuth Design) sculpted figurine. There is one figurine which is rather straight posed and photographed from full front but there are no other full side or full back views of her so I kind of rotoscoped the front view but I had to go with my own anatomy knowledge for the rest of the body. This said, I've since completely redid her with my own proportion preferences.

 

Also, if I may, what is your thought process in modeling something like this? Do you draw the splines first on paper to figure them out, or do you work things out as you go?

 

Well, I drew a lot of splines schemas on paper for different models before. I first tried to model every muscles with splines but the model turned out over 10000 splines and was nearly impossible to animate. Then as I did other models, the mesh layout refined and gradually decreased in size and became more elegant. That is several years of learning process I'm describing here.

 

I'm still not quite satisfied with the current mesh though. In fact, I'm never really completely satisfied and I always try slightly different mesh layouts for each new model. The reason is that once I've finished a model, then I start to see how I could have done something otherwise by examining peoples around me, tehir face, their body, their expressions and their postures. Then a different approach for some particular area of the model starts forming in my mind and I try to apply that on the next model.

 

When I model, I just go with the flow. I work with transe music to help in getting a rythm in my modeling task.

 

When I started modeling, I tended to work in front, side, top and bottom views only. But I don't do that anymore especially with fast computer and accelerated graphics cards. It never produces good models. Instead, I constantly turn the model around to look at it from all angles as I model it in shaded wireframe mode.

[Emilio Le Roux]

Fantastic, and voluptuous.

 

I'd really like to see a wireframed render of her! If you are confortable with this of course.

 

 

Excellent work.

[John Keates]

Hey Yves, that is a really beutifull modell! I always liked that one. I would love to see some wires if you could. A before and after would be intersting too.

 

Are you thinking of working your magic shader programming skills in your spare time? (John crosses fingers).

[KenH]

I work with transe music to help in getting a rythm in my modeling task.

 

I never would have imagined that.

 

Oh and forget about the wireframes, I want to see her other side!

 

Nah...wireframes too!

[ypoissant]

Thanks all for your appreciation.

 

Here's the wireframe. The other side will come tomorrow. As for the "before" model, you can take a look at it here.

[josema]

Thank you for the explanation. Very insightful. I guess the most difficult part for me in modelling, is to figure out how the splines should run (or flow). So I too, would be interested in seeing a wireframe of the model.

 

I forgot to comment about the texturing. Simply great skin tones and the lighting is also phenomenal. Could you comment a little bit on this. Any advice you can give us when lighting a scene and when doing skin tones?

 

Thanx again.

[JohnArtbox]

The old version was my all-time favorite female am model. I always wondered what happened to her. The rotate has pride of place in my reference library. This version looks like it'll be even better

Have you used your skin shader on the render ?

Lovely work.

[ypoissant]

Here is an explanation I wrote on the "Naomi" Wip page:

 

The outdoor sunny lighting look comes from the bluish surrounding light that comes from the sky and a yellowish light that comes from the sun.

 

The easiest way to get this effect is with 3 lights:

1 yellowish sun light (I like to use a bulb for that)

1 bluish skylight light

1 bluish negative sun light (I like to use a bulb for that)

 

The main idea is to set the bluish and the yellowish lights at the exact opposite spectrum on the hue weel. You could use a straight yellow sun light or to get a warmer light lean a tiny bit toward orange and to get a hot light, lean more agressively toward orange. The saturation is maximum and the lightness is about 80%.

 

Once you have selected your yellow for the sun, you now set your skylight light and your negative sun light to the exact opposite bluish color on the hue weel. Again maximum saturation and about 80% lightness.

 

Of course, as you mentionned, you have to reduce the skylight light intensity. First I turn OFF the sun and the negative sun lights and adjust the skylight light intensity so that I still have nice shape shade definition but rather with about 1/3 or 1/2 the normal lighting intensity I would use with the slylight alone.

 

Now here is the trick: Turn ON both the sun light and the negative sun light. In choreography, on the negative sun, add translate and orient like constraints like the sun. On the Negative Sun attributes, set the intensity to minus 10%. Then adjust the (positive) sun intensity to get a nice bright light with clearly visible shadows. Some overexposure can help convey the feeling of the sunny day.

 

The negative bluish sun trick is to help enhance the bluish shadows vs the yellowish lights. The negative sun will remove some of the blue shades coming from the skylight where the yellowish sun should hit. By playing with the sun vs negative sun intensity, you can enhance this effect even further (but don't overdo it). My goal, with such a setup is to approach the lightings achieved by some painters (the Hildebrandt brothers or Maxfield Parish are notable examples).

 

I basicaly use this technique except that instead of using a bluish skylight light, I use a skydone with a mapped sky which serves as a color filter for the skylight. Apart from that, the negative sun light technique is used exactly as described. And I use my 20 lights skylight rig with 2 rays cast and 9 passes multipass.

 

As for the skintone. That's quite another story. Except for the face which have a whole set of maps (color, specularity size and intensity, bump, etc.) the body is only flat colored. The subtlety in the skintone comes from two things: 1) the blue-yellow lighting setup and most important, a skin plugin that I wrote which does this red transition between the light and the shadow side of the surfaces. I've attached the skin.shd plugin for everybody to download and try. (Note to Mac users: I'm waiting for the people at Hash to come back from vacation to get a Mac version of the plugin. My first intention was to wait for the two versions to be aailable before offering it for download. But since I mention it here, I might as well post it.).

Skin.shd

[Mega]

Yves - as always fantastic! I especially like how the form flows into each other. How the pelvis has such a graceful curvature into the rib area and blends right into the chest cavity. I notice the subtle "S" shape throughout the form -- very nice. Reminds me of the some of the early loose sketches of Titian.

 

I can't wait for the back view to see the latissimus dorsi... I guess now my old curious anatomy studies are piqued.

 

Tony

[John Keates]

Hi Yves. Thanks for the wirs. I will give them some study. Nice to see that your skin shader is being let out of its cage.

 

I have just niticed a possible crit. It is possible that the meat of the thumb is a little to big. Iether that or the thumb needs to be bigger. Might be the angle though.

[ypoissant]

Yes. When I launched a render yesterday (going to bed) I was reworking the hand. I had the 4 fingers done but the thumb was still to do. I finished it today and I'm also done with the arms.

 

There are 3 major problems with the thumb:

1) The thumb itself was turned 90° from its normal position. That is it was rolling 45° in and up now it rolls correctly 45°in and down.

2) The thumb was too long.

3) the "meet" between the thumb and the index was too long too. I mean it should have receded quite more into the hand.

[gschumsky]

I basicaly use this technique except that instead of using a bluish skylight light, I use a skydone with a mapped sky which serves as a color filter for the skylight.

Having only used the skylight rigs (which are great for product photos, btw thanks for those so many years ago. They have proven invaluable), how does one use a skydome with a mapped image as a color filter (I get the idea, but it can't be as simple as putting the skylight rig above the dome, setting the dome to 50% transparent or something similar, and the rest is magic as they say)?

[KenH]

I don't recognise the extension of that skin shader. I'm assuming it's used with your skycast product....

[ypoissant]

how does one use a skydome with a mapped image as a color filter (I get the idea, but it can't be as simple as putting the skylight rig above the dome, setting the dome to 50% transparent or something similar, and the rest is magic as they say)?

Yes. It is basically as simple as this indeed.

 

Actually, I use two domes. One for the sky filter and another one for the skymap. The skymap is sized a tiny bit smaller than the skyfilter.

 

There are a few things to take care though:

 

1) For the skyfilter, you can set the transparency to 50% as you say but you can get better results by setting the transparency to 100% and the index of refraction to 1.01. The transparency is computed differently when the IOR is not 1. Also, the skyfilter casts shadows but don't receives shadows and don't cast reflections.

 

2) For the skymap, set the ambiance to 100% and the diffuse falloff to 2000%. If the diffuse falloff is not adjusted, the skymap will be completely washed out by the skylight lights. Also, the skymap casts reflections but don't cast shadows and don't receives shadows.

 

3) For the skyfilter to act as a filter, the skylight light must be set to cast more than 1 ray. I set mine at 2 rays. If the light cast only one ray, then the shadow is comnputed with shadow falloff and the filter fades off before reaching the models.

 

4) By using the 20 lights skylights with 2 rays cast and 9 passes, I actually cast 360 random rays in the scene for each rendered pixel.

Edited August 24, 2004 by ypoissant

[ypoissant]

I don't recognise the extension of that skin shader. I'm assuming it's used with your skycast product....

The "shd" extension is the normal extension for shaders. Just drop the file in your "Shaders" folder.

 

And BTW, I'm not the author of skycast. I just did a few skylight rigs which I posted on my web site for downloads. The author of Skycast is John Henderson (JohnArtbox).

Edited August 24, 2004 by ypoissant

[Dearmad]

Yves,

 

Yours are about the only splines out there that nearly make me drool. This is inspired on the Arora girl, eh? That must be why her feet are tipped... I thought it was something to do with future rigging ideas, no?

 

Anyway, what can I say? The subtlety of that elegant twisting spline to the arms (they wind around the long axis of the arm) is unbelievable. Just placing those alone took forthought which I completely lack. But at least I get WHY you did that...

 

 

Anyway, in comparing the Arora with yours, you've got it all over Arora in spades. Reasons I like yours better:

 

the pelvis bones show at the top of the hip, that really gives her some solidity and "realness" considering her unreal proportions.

 

Breasts have weight to them and form. The concave/convex curve form is classy. Maybe push the concave top curve a little more if she's going to be nude? At any rate, thank you for doing that- much more attractive to me than the typical CG balloons.

 

Her stomach reads as much more layered in tissue than the Arora- nice job.

 

Well, better go before my wife finds me drooling here and doesn't believe me it's because of the splinemanship and not something else.

 

Oh, and for those interested: http://jamesart.com/

[ypoissant]

Yes, the original model was based on the Arora girl. And yes, the feet are in that position because of Arora. They will be placed flat soon. But I wait till the last minute because it adds elegance to the pose with the feet pointed down.

 

You observe several difference from Arora though. The biggest difference between Jame's taste and mine is the size of the hips. There are other more subtle differences but the hips is the bigest. And from that, the size of the thighs too.

 

This said, I really dig the attention to the musculature in James figurines and I plan to attempt adding muscle details with displacement maps eventually.

[KenH]

The "shd" extension is the normal extension for shaders. Just drop the file in your "Shaders" folder.

Wow...never used that before. Never even noticed the folder. Now to work out how it's used.

[mtpeak2]

Yves great model. Did you use map for density and length for the hair?

 

I was trying out your shader plug-in and I can't seem to change the blood color. Is it possible to change the color or am I doing something wrong. Thanks for the plug-in.

[ypoissant]

Last time I tried, I didn't have any problem changing the blood color. I made a green blod head for demonstration purpose two weeks ago.

[mtpeak2]

Here is a pic of the blood color changed to green and it rendered red.

Version 11n.

[Alli]

First of all, Great work Yves! And thanks for providing the Skin shader, Im already testing and trying to use it.

 

But I came up with the same result as others. When changing the blood color doesn't affect the model. BUT what I noticed is if you have a group on your model, the group will be affected by the adjustment instead of the main model.

Here are some shots from what i experienced.

 

The model with part of it as a group. Group diffuse color set to yellow. shader not applied yet.

 

shader applied

 

blood color changed to blue. model not changed but the group did.

 

 

Are we missing something out?

11n

 

thanks again for sharing this!

/a.

[ypoissant]

The skin plugin makes its calculations from the current surface diffuse color hue value. This surface diffuse color must have at least a tiny bit of saturation for the hue to be decidable and thus for the plugin to work. This means that if you set your surface color to any non-saturated colors such as white, black or any neutral grays, the plugin will not know how to shift the colors and will revert to default red blood.

[ypoissant]

I just edited the instruction, a few posts up, for the setups for a skyfilter and a skymap concerning some important shadows and reflections options.

[ypoissant]

Here is the back view. I'm not quite satisfied with the tricep on the arm yet. More tweaking to do there. And I will smoothen the musculature on the back too.

[ypoissant]

And here's the wireframe

[Fuchur]

It is a really great model, but I dont know... is this woman not too small?

I think she has a damn big backside for her size, and I think you should try to make the muscles a little less seeable... it's great because you know the whole muscles in a human body and that is quite impressive, but she looks like a women from a muscle-competition.... I would be happy if my muscles were as trained as her muscles are...

 

Hm... and I think the knees are a little bit too small... even the thinest person couldnt stay one that knees...

 

But maybe that is just your style...

But in the end I am VERY impressed....

 

*Fuchur*

[KenH]

It is a really great model, but I dont know... is this woman not too small?

I think she has a damn big backside for her size, and I think you should try to make the muscles a little less seeable...

You're not a J-Lo fan then?

[Fuchur]

*grin* I like big butts and i can not hide, what other boys cant deny...

I like nice (ah, lets say feminine) butts, but I dont know... it is a little bit too much, dont you think so? She has to be a little bit taller or anything... cant really say what it is...

It is really just a nuance (just a tiny-little bit too much)

 

*Fuchur*

[KenH]

She's petite and chiseled. I guess it looks weird as there are very few real women like that. Afterall it's the stylisation of the female form. In that area of art, anything goes.

[ypoissant]

It's also the point of view. The camera POV I mean. From this POV, she looks rather small and the legs looks too thin too but they aren't I'll try to post a low POV.

 

You are right about the "tiny-little bit". Really, proportions can be that subtle. In numerous times, I just tweaked that "tiny-little bit" to get a proportion just right. That's how it is.

[HeadlessBill]

I remember this model from way-back-when. I really like the changes you've made to it. She doesn't look so 'hard' now. A more friendly appearance, in my opinion.

 

I also may have to play around with your light set-up suggestion to change the lighting set-up in the default choreography being discussed here: http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=7592

 

Once you have the opportunity, I'd put some shoes on her so she doesn't look like she is walking around 'en pointe' (is that spelled correctly) all the time.

 

Again, great model and it just seems to be getting better.

[Dearmad]

Nice look there. I'd smooth the backs of her upper and lower leg muscles- but looks like you're going for some sort of athletic look to her legs. She's seriously buff in her legs, reminds me a little of the bicyclists in Triplets of Belleville.

 

As to the knees- I'd go jsut the opposite once I rouded out her legs muscles- smaller knees! They look great either way!

 

Her back is incredible. WOw- what a nightmare to rig that back, since you have a strapless she's going into, I'm sure... and causing the surface of that detailed skin to move right will take a lot of time... the underlying musclutature and bones to her back is outstandingly done.

[nerrazzi]

Yves, this model is reeeally great! The skin is smooth and the anatomy is very articulate, it's clear that you've paid due attention to the muscular structure. A fine job exellent, excellent work...

[gwinkelman]

Yves, your model contains some excellent splineage problem-solving techniques. Lately, I have been wondering how the great AM modelers are modeling the tips of the fingers. How did you handle the splineage at the fingertips?

[ypoissant]

Thanks everybody for all your compliments.

 

Here is a low POV. Does she looks so petite from this POV?

[Dearmad]

I never understood the petite comments about her in the first place... so, no. I LIKE your overall proportions a lot. They wouldn't be my personal choice, but that doesn't belong in a criticism of another person's work- that belongs in the praise department; I like to see the diversity of wonderful solutions people come up with in order to express an idea.

 

And besides, who can knock a woman willing to stand so patiently and so scantily in a field like that?

[jon]

yves,

 

your changes to your original model are all significant improvements. you made an already great model just about perfect!

 

i'm certainly glad you took a few moments away from quantum spline theory to get some applied work in!

 

-jon

[ypoissant]

gwinkelman,

 

Here is the splinage for the hand. I think you can see the tip of the fingers quite clearly. BTW, I picked the fingernails splineage trick from Jim Talbot. Thanks Jim.

[Sharky]

Hi!

 

This model is very nice and lifelike!

I don't find words, she is beautiful model!

 

How could you do her hair?

 

Cheers

 

Sharky

[strohbehn]

Yves, this is an absolutely beautifully crafted model. The lighting is amazing as well. Threads like this are pure gold. Thanks for offering your hard work for examination and instruction!

[ypoissant]

How could you do her hair?

The hair are v11 hair.

 

This is exactly the same head and hair as in my june image contest entry:

 

The hair materials are on a separate patches inside the head. The patches have a map for the hair color with spots of lighter hairs here and there. The hair guides are positionned the way they are rendered. The hair material is applied as separate groups for the left and the right part of the hair and as 8 different groups for the tuppet. That's really all there is to it.

[nerrazzi]

See... I had no idea you could do this type of work. That face is flawless, quite possibly the smoothest, most accurate face I've seen pulled out of A:M period.

[Parlo]

A truly beautiful piece of work Yves. It has so much subtle style to it - so many elements, features and curves are "heightened" just enough to lift it above the realms of the clinically accurate. Awesome.

 

I can't wait to see her move, and especially how you are going to handle joint deformation.

 

Catalogued together, all your work on this one model (from spinage to lighting techniques) could form a pretty substantial guide.

[ypoissant]

A truly beautiful piece of work Yves. It has so much subtle style to it - so many elements, features and curves are "heightened" just enough to lift it above the realms of the clinically accurate. Awesome.

 

Thanks. I struggle hard with that. It is when I visited a museum several years ago where I saw several great master sculptor pieces that I realized the importance of this "just enough to lift" technique. It really was an enlightenment.

 

I can't wait to see her move, and especially how you are going to handle joint deformation.

 

I've handled worse than that. The secret is to not try to fan-bone and smartskin her for any imaginable movements. I don't believe in this approach. It is too time consuming. Instead I add deformations as I need them. That is: when I pose or animate the model, I add and tweak the fans and smartskins to get the correct morphology for that pose or animation. This way, the model gets smartskinned as I need instead of a priori. You can keep on adding smartskin keyframes in this way. And as you go, the model needs less and less of them. You end up with only the smartskins you really need and use instead of all possible smartskins of which very little gets used.

 

Catalogued together, all your work on this one model (from spinage to lighting techniques) could form a pretty substantial guide.

 

Did I hear "tutorial" in the background?

 

See... I had no idea you could do this type of work. That face is flawless, quite possibly the smoothest, most accurate face I've seen pulled out of A:M period.

 

I took great care in smoothing the splines by visualizing the surface from a grazing angle in the modeling window. I go in shaded mode, turn the model, find an unwanted bump in the surface, switch to shaded+wireframe, click on the offending CP, leave my cursor over the CP and switch to shaded mode again and then pull out or push in the CP untill I get the best possible surface. But the premise for that is that the splines follow a nice smooth path first. And then, I apply the porcelain material.

 

BTW, I applied the porcelain material only on the head. The body still don't have a porcelain applied on it. I won't apply porcelain until I'm finished tweaking the surface. If I were to apply the porcelain immediately, I wouldn't get this visual feedback on the corectness of the surface.

 

your changes to your original model are all significant improvements. you made an already great model just about perfect!

 

From another fine girl modeler like you, jonathan, I'm flattered.

 

i'm certainly glad you took a few moments away from quantum spline theory to get some applied work in!

 

Well, I'm somewhat stopped in my quantum spline theory efforts right now. So, perhaps that's a good thing after all.

[ypoissant]

Nice look there. I'd smooth the backs of her upper and lower leg muscles- but looks like you're going for some sort of athletic look to her legs. She's seriously buff in her legs, reminds me a little of the bicyclists in Triplets of Belleville.

 

Well I wouldn't go as far as the cyclist in the triplets but I like muscular womans. However, I like elegant muscular womans, not some of the extreme bodybuilder types. But that's just my own personal preferences. This said, As I render more and more of her, I find more and more af subtle places where I would need to tweak some more. For instance, not apparent in the current renders, is the front of the lower leg. The subtle double-S profile curve of the tibia. Gil Elvgren was a master of that curve.

 

Her back is incredible. WOw- what a nightmare to rig that back, since you have a strapless she's going into, I'm sure...  and causing the surface of that detailed skin to move right will take a lot of time... the underlying musclutature and bones to her back is outstandingly done.

 

Again, I will only do whatever deformation that will be required for the poses and the views. That's two condition. Meaning for a particular pose where I don't show the back, then I won't need to deform the back.

 

Breasts have weight to them and form. The concave/convex curve form is classy. Maybe push the concave top curve a little more if she's going to be nude? At any rate, thank you for doing that- much more attractive to me than the typical CG balloons.

 

I know what you mean. Yes, this concave top would add some more sexiness to the model. This is definitely in my list of planned changes.

 

Anyway, in comparing the Arora with yours, you've got it all over Arora in spades.

 

That is a huge compliment. I have so much admiration for Mike James work that I don't know how to take it. But I thank you for it anyway and I appreciate and understand your preferences.

 

Well, better go before my wife finds me drooling here and doesn't believe me it's because of the splinemanship and not something else.

 

Now imagine the scene when my wife comes in and I'm tweaking the model.

[ypoissant]

Once you have the opportunity, I'd put some shoes on her so she doesn't look like she is walking around 'en pointe' (is that spelled correctly) all the time.

 

The feet will be remodeled flat on the ground. But I will only do that at the last tweak moment.. BTW, I already have the pumps that goes with those feets. (And yes, 'en pointe' is spelled correctly).

 

is this woman not too small?

 

She is actually 180cm, that is 6 foot tall. But Il will have to double check the head size just to make sure everything is practically (if not estheticaly) in proportion.

 

it's great because you know the whole muscles in a human body and that is quite impressive, but she looks like a women from a muscle-competition.

 

Hmmm... I don't think you will ever see a woman like that in a bodybuilding competition.

 

Yves great model. Did you use map for density and length for the hair?

 

Thanks. No, I did use maps only for hair color. The length of the hair is controlled by the length of the hair guides. I found I had more control of the hairdo with this technique.

 

very nice. Reminds me of the some of the early loose sketches of Titian. ... I can't wait for the back view to see the latissimus dorsi... I guess now my old curious anatomy studies are piqued.

 

Thanks. I've been struggling with the aponeurosis of the latisimus dorsi.

 

The old version was my all-time favorite female am model. I always wondered what happened to her. The rotate has pride of place in my reference library. This version looks like it'll be even better

 

Thanks. What happened to her is that as I was modeling her, my attention got diverted into trying to find ways to get realistic skin shading. That brought me into this skylight thing that was abundantly discussed at that time. And then a huge veterinary multimedia project took over where I used A:M and then from project to project, this model eventually got stored on a CD-rom somewhere. Funny coincidence that now that my skylight solution is done and my skin shader is also done, that I revert back to this pet project of mine.

 

I guess the most difficult part for me in modelling, is to figure out how the splines should run (or flow).

 

Looking at other splines will help for sure. But practice is still the best way to get this flow feeling. After you've done your 10th model and actually observed the shortcoming of your different solutions, you will definitely be in a better position to feel it than now.

 

And once again to all the others, thanks for your nice comments.