Working on a run cycle

[steve392]

Iv been playing around with walk and run cycles as I never seem to get it right ,heres my first go at a run

run0.mov

[Darkwing]

hmmm, looks good except for something, perhaps her back i to verticle or stiff(?)

[robcat2075]

It does look wierd because no one can run like that.

 

A lot of the principles of walks apply to runs. For example, the rear leg should be pretty much fully extended when it pushes off. How could she get any speed if she were pulling up the back leg before it had finished pushing her forward?

 

Likewise the front leg will be pretty much extended when it contacts the ground, so it can use its full length to cushion the shock, and raise the body back up. Right now the front leg is going forward and then starting back before it ever touches the ground. Each foot is only touching the ground for about 2 frames each which is probably impossible. Even in a run our feet are on the ground more than they are off.

 

Tip: go outside, run to the end of the block and feel what your legs are doing.

[steve392]

Yea you could well be right there I allso think it looks like the feet go to high ,but not really sure

[steve392]

Tip: go outside, run to the end of the block and feel what your legs are doing.

Now your joking right

Yea I see what you mean Robert ,I think I will have to restart it as I messed with this one a bit to much and progresively got wors

Thank's a lot for your feedback guys

[Darkwing]

there was an excercise we did in Art 12, where we would close our eyes and contort our body into a position where we could feel the tension, and then we would draw what our pose was with our eyes still closed. The point of the excercise was for us to feel our art, and get a feeling rather then just using site to observe our subjects, actually feeling the tension allowed us to draw that poses we were in and believe it or not, our figure drawings were pretty accurate to our poses

[robcat2075]

BTW, Richard Williams covers runs in his "Animator's Survival Kit" book.

[ludo_si]

work on the run cycle, it is always difficult;)

You should make a small rotation of the hips and shoulders for more flexibility.

Good work, it is very interesting.

 

Gratien

[steve392]

Well Iv changed the one I have been using ,trying to get what you sugested,The thing that I seem to find most dificult is the push off with the back foot ,it seedms like a oposite to the wight thing on a walk.Anyway heres what I got so far ,I done a back and side view .You know Iv looked at that book many times and keep meaning to order but have never gotten around to it ,Time I did

run_2.mov

run_2_right.mov

[mtpeak2]

The one thing I would suggest is using the FK arms, instead of the IK arms. It's easier to control the arc of the arm swing with rotation of the arm bones, than with translation of the hand targets. I also noticed this in your walk cyle.

[steve392]

Thank's Mark ,will try that

[alano]

I suggest showing at least five repetitions of any walk or run cycle from the side view - even more for short cycles like runs. That way we can see how the cycle "hooks up" from the end back to the beginning.

 

That said, I think you want to have the front leg go straight either one frame before or right at contact. The arms need to pump further forward for a sprint or less far back for a jog. The whole thing needs to be faster (fewer frames) unless you are doing a slow-motion run. Runs are, indeed, more difficult than walks, but you're getting there.

 

Alan

[steve392]

Thank's a lot for the advice .I will have a play around and see what I can acheive,Arms further back ,now thats suprised me

[Darkwing]

here's a good run cycle ref, there are more, just follow the other videos in the recomended videos pane:

 

[steve392]

Hey thats good ,I will find this very usefull can allready see some things I got a mile wrong Thank's a lot Darkwing. btw where did you get that name from

[Darkwing]

what, my user name? I dunno, not from the cartoons, if I remember correctly, I was toying with this Star Trek fan animation something or other and that was what I named the ship. I never really got past the initial idea stage and didn't take the idea seriously, but it has since been my screen name for the last 4 or so years

[steve392]

Thank's ,was just wandering nosey I supose

[steve392]

Tried a very Girly one ,but moved it up in the cho a bit before rendering

Girly_run0.mov

[ruscular]

I see several things that you could be doing, and I posted an example of all the tips to add.

 

When you run the feet needs to be closer together on a straight line, when they land. walking the feet could be further apart like a stagger, but that's manly looking, while women are more graceful, and shift their hips in order to walk straighter. so when feet touch the ground have them go closer to the center-line, and when they lift they will swing around.

 

Heel touch then the foot flatten 1-2 frame later, and when that foot flatten down after the heel touch the body sink the hips to the floor on the opposing side. maybe 1-2 frame later on that. When the back legs are fully extended, I arch the upper body just a little bit to fully stretch on that side the back leg is pushing. Right at the landing I arch the lower back and the upper back as if the upper body is falling forward, and at the extended stroke of the legs arch the back more as if the legs are pushing thru. I do this very small adjustment, not too much movement, but it is this subtle movement that polish the mechanics of movement for a more human, and less robotic motion.

 

Also twist the shoulder(collar bone) forward of the back legs. I didn't include that part because my model is naked and quite revealing. Girls run with their arms up high to cage their breast in, to keep them from flying all over the place. So the hands will be more inside and roll the wrist so that the palm is facing down on the up swing, maybe raise the shoulder up higher. Think of why girls in HS always carry their books across the front while guys carry the book in the arm hanging. Years of clutching book across the chest and raising the shoulders up high, also could be use to convey insecurities, protecting the heart (emotionally).

 

I also animate the fist during the run. Clench on the up swing and loose on the down swing.

SarennaRunstudy.mov

[steve392]

Thank's ,thats dam good .I can see your points very well on that vidio .I notice your wighting/smartskinn is very well done aswell I would love to see the full model moving if thats possible it looks like the proportions are spot on ie the thikness of the legs ,muscle .You should poste your work more .If you don't want to put it on the forum could you send it to me to study please

[steve392]

I adjusted some of the things you mention and its a big improvement I think,still wants work but its getting there

edit sorry about the size ,wrong codec

test2.mov

test2_side.mov

[ruscular]

I adjusted some of the things you mention and its a big improvement I think,still wants work but its getting there

edit sorry about the size ,wrong codec

when I get a chance I'll render out the realtime front and side view with bone showing.

 

nice improvement, on the lower body, I'll have to send you the link to the upper portion for you to see, but don't share because I am under contract for a paid site. I did the breast with 2 bones per side, and I think I work out the dynamics perfectly and differently from the norm. I used to use 3-4 bone per side in the past, but I switch to cp weighting with transfer weight plug-in between the 2 bone and it came out great. Plus if she grab her own breast while running the end bone can be compensate attach to the hand bone and thus only the middle part of the breast will bounce.

[steve392]

That would be great ,will not share at all ,I would like to know more about that breast bone and the wighting set-up if you get time,Many thank's

Steve

s-hara@ntlworld.com

[steve392]

Thank's a lot that is brilliant ,great movement

[jakerupert]

Hi Steve,

 

great improvements.

Here is what I feel still could be improved:

 

-What I did notice , is some strange "snaping" in the knees , when they change direction.

 

-From front view, I would also rotate the pelvisbone a bit right/left up/down when the feet hit the ground

to take away some stiffness from the movement.

 

-The feet slip a bit left/right from front view as well.

[ruscular]

I think when you rolled the foot foward it made the leg snap, and you need to drop the body a tad lower to compensate for the heel to flat foot shift.

studyrunfrnt.mov

[robcat2075]

a few notes about running motion

[steve392]

Yea I agree with that I have the drop a little before that /as the heel hits .I will check that out ,Thank's for the wireframe that will be very handy

Thats good Robert ,thank's for that

[steve392]

Another go at a run

runnew.mov

[Xtaz]

Hi Steve ... nice tests ...

when in run the hands tend to produce an arc parallel to the legs. In your example they are going to the front of the belly ...

[steve392]

Thank's Xtaz but could you show me what you mean please ,I find it hard to visualize it edit btw I think your models and animating are great

[Gerry]

Steve- I'm not sure I could offer much here but I think it would be easier to evaluate these if they were straight side views with the action looping a few times.

[robcat2075]

Another go at a run

 

Are her feet really doing the same arc that the guy in the clip was doing?

 

A side view is better for right now.

[Xtaz]

thanks steve ....

In the Project TWO I animated the strawbear running ...

check its arms... in the end of each step the arm should be almost horizontal, with the forearm slightly bent toward the body. In your example the arm is slightly bent while the forearm is very curved almost touching his hand on belly.

run1_2.mov

[steve392]

Ok I am rendering a side view and have changed the arms a bit as Xtaz sugested and am renering 3 cycles /72 frames

Robert I changed the feet hiting the ground and kept them more bent untill theye push her up on the forward movement to look like the guy a bit ,see what you all think in a while when I get it renderd

Phew theres more to this lark than meets the eye

[steve392]

Well here it is ,I think it looks better but more importantly what do you think .It seems to look so differant at differant angles and if I change something at one angle it then looks wrong at another,could be just my eyes lol

runnew_cho.mov

[ruscular]

The front part needs more work! it looks as if she is doing a front kick before she lands her feet on the ground. Think of soft circular path in order to make contact with the ground.

 

where the feet go the rest will follow, so draw a wide oval circle path with the feet, instead of a swinging pendulum path. So that the feet look like they are free fallin softly to the ground instead of slapping the ground.

 

I have done hundred of running and walking cycles and each time I do them they keep looking better, and thus I would say each time you do them, they are better than the last time. I think it applies to everyone, but a running and walk cycle is basically the main test for an animator. You'll have to spend the time to put in your hours of making many of them. So keep at em!

[steve392]

Thank's for the info ,I quite enjoy doing this ,its relaxing and funn so I will keep trying to get it better

[Xtaz]

Steve .. can you send me the last one test.. I trying to download it... it would be easy to explain my points ... xtaz *at* live *dot* com

 

I got it ... working on it

[Xtaz]

well..... the arms continues with a unsatisfactory movement yet, check a best position in the arms.mov frame 0 /16 /30.

 

in a run, the time when the waist is more down is when one leg is perpendicular to the ground. After that the leg pushes and raises the waist.. the reverse is happening in your cycle run...

 

in the run_original.mov I used your movie just pushing it to the right

in the run_balance_adjusted.mov I used the same scene but I adjust the Y axis ( check the Y_axis.JPG )

 

it means that you must increase Y values in the waist in the frames 0 / 15 / 30

arms.mov

run_original.mov

run_balance_adjusted.mov

[steve392]

Thank's a lot for this Xtaz ,I will change it ,thank's for taking the time to make the movies and show the y axis jpeg I can now see what your saying

I will be back

[steve392]

Im back ,got this now I think its looking better but the right arm seems to slow down and the toese need looking at

I made the stride shorter on the front and the up and down movement is (hopefully better).I triede to get the arm to move in more of an arc .I actually found how to use the xyz in the translate settings instead of moving the keys thank's Xtas.I will work on a new one looking at the movie Robert suplied ,it is so differant to what I have.I wish it had all the frames though

runtest_x_2.mov

[Xtaz]

It's better now Steve ... I would stretch the legs at the extremes of movement...

t2_run_steve.mov

[steve392]

Yea I see ,I moved them in to far ,will do that cheers,btw thats a good way of showing it

[steve392]

Done that ,

runtest_x_3.mov

[Xtaz]

Hi Steve.. the cycle is becoming better and better.

 

Note in the example I posted earlier, when the heel touches the ground, the leg is fully extended...

I'm late for an appointment .. I comment more later... keep posting ....

[steve392]

Thank's ,I repositiond the legs allso moved the shouldsers a little forward and droped them a touch .What do you think

Didn't realize your in Brazil ,you lucky devil,all that sunshine

run_4.mov

[TheSpleen]

I would chase her

[steve392]

She would take some catching lol

[steve392]

In my endevours to get a walk/run cycle I got this one ,thought you might like a luagh

run_4_blackgirl.mov