TNT Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 I decided to take a stab at modeling a 63 vette. So far I just have the dog house, hood, and front tires. It's got a long way to go and a lot of detail missing but it's starting to look like something. I used Photoman's tut on the bike tire to make my tires. It worked perfectly. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric2575 Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 That looks like a really nice start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 8, 2009 Author Share Posted November 8, 2009 I was originally going to follow the tuts by Xtaz but they don't seem available any more. I'm having some trouble keeping the sheetmetal from creasing. It seems that sometimes the bias settings tweak themselves and an edge I made straight gets twisted. I see it happens as I adjust the position of adjacent CP's. I must not understand something about how the CP's and bias settings are related. Also any bias settings I make don't seem to actually mirror when I C/F/A. It looks more like they translate. Lastly, I have no idea how to make nice shiney paint! Any suggestions or tuts will be appreciated. Thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R Reynolds Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 These are the quirks you have to get used to when attempting accurate mechanical modeling with A:M's splines. I have this vague memory from the last century that Hash splines did not originally act this way but due to complaints from character modelers concerning their difficulties of modeling faces without creasing that the spline algorithm was changed to include averaging over local cp's. I know all too well the temptation to concentrate on one local feature (a nicely hemmed sheet metal edge for instance) making it "perfect" and then moving on thinking it's finished, forever. But you really don't want to tweak bias until you have a significant chunk of the object built. And you'll just have to get used to re-tweaking splines after you do a C/F/A. I've noticed that typically the sign of some alpha's get flipped after that operation in an unpredictable way. After the C/F/A, put your model in wire frame and look through it for splines that don't match. Click on the badly aimed spline and change the sign of its alpha; + to - or - to +. This works most of the time but as I say it's unpredictable. Once you're mentally prepared for this added task; it's easier to swallow. As for nice shiny paint, I'd suggest a specular colour closer to white, low specular size (5?), high specular intensity (90?) and higher reflectivity (40?). Make sure you use a number of lights and surround your model with a background so there's something to reflect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsjustme Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 I found a couple of things that might help with car paint here, here and here. Hope those help, Tim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Bigboote Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 Looking good! My uncle would look at a car like that and say 'What are all those scratch-marks? Must be from girls trying to get in..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photoman Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 For my shiny car paint materials, I just create a couple of Fractal Sum combiners (To get the metallic look) and I put an environment map attribute under it to give it some nice reflections. Here is a quickie example I put together: Paintdemo.zip Contains a quick project with the material and environment HDR. Hope it helps Photoman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 8, 2009 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 8, 2009 I have this vague memory from the last century that Hash splines did not originally act this way but due to complaints from character modelers concerning their difficulties of modeling faces without creasing that the spline algorithm was changed to include averaging over local cp's. There are two custom buttons available in the Tools>Customize>Commands>Tools tab... One for "biased normals" and one for "Perpendicular normals" you can drag those to a tool bar and use those to set the style for a selected group. I THINK this is what rodger is referring to, the "perpendicular" is the old style, and "biased " is the new default. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 8, 2009 Author Share Posted November 8, 2009 WOW! The help this forum gives never stops amazing me! I found the buttons Robert mentioned and will gives those a "road test" to see what they do. I copied all the paint setups David pointed me towards and downloaded Photoman's example project. Lots to digest. I hope I can apply it and show more later. Thanks again to everyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 8, 2009 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 8, 2009 here's the brief mention I could find in the A:M docs. i don't fully understand the difference between the two except the interpolation of the splines between CPs appears a bit different. Biased Normals “Biased Normals”, which exhibit better smooth shading, are now the default spline technique, but old models will still load and animate the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSpleen Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 TNT Performance on tires is great touch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tralfaz Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 The vette is looking pretty good. If you have the Dark Tree shaders and the AM Simbiont plug-in, you could use their paint shader. It does a really great job of doing a metallic paint. You can get the shaders here. And get AM Simbiont here. I used the paint shader on the Honda Rebel I modelled a while back. Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 8, 2009 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 8, 2009 The Simbiont plugin is already included in A:M, but you do need to get the shaders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 8, 2009 Author Share Posted November 8, 2009 The vette is looking pretty good. If you have the Dark Tree shaders and the AM Simbiont plug-in, you could use their paint shader. It does a really great job of doing a metallic paint. You can get the shaders here. And get AM Simbiont here. I used the paint shader on the Honda Rebel I modelled a while back. Al I didn't realize I had this one. I gave it a quick render and found what I suspected would be the case. The vette now appears to have been made with a ballpeen hammer but the paint is nice and shiney! I guess I need to take what Robert and Roger have explained about the bias settings and work the surfaces till smooth. Hopfully I can get the vette to look half as good as your bike. Then I can work on more paint solutions to see which one is best for me. Thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric2575 Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 Lay out your model without bias tweaking first. Best to even turn off the bias handles. The tweaking comes later. If you bias tweak as you model, you're really opening a can of worms and you may also find that much of the bias tweaking was unnecessary. I started modeling with bias tweaking as I went and ended up setting many of the bias points back to zero once the modeling was done. Eric One more thing, I know it's tempting, but stay away from modeling or decaling your model until it's all done. This will keep you focused and less likely to rush the job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 8, 2009 Author Share Posted November 8, 2009 Lay out your model without bias tweaking first. Best to even turn off the bias handles. The tweaking comes later. If you bias tweak as you model, you're really opening a can of worms and you may also find that much of the bias tweaking was unnecessary. I started modeling with bias tweaking as I went and ended up setting many of the bias points back to zero once the modeling was done. Eric One more thing, I know it's tempting, but stay away from modeling or decaling your model until it's all done. This will keep you focused and less likely to rush the job. I'll give that a try. I figured I could remove the bias settings I have altered, get as smooth as I can and see what is needed when done. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 8, 2009 Author Share Posted November 8, 2009 I did have a bit of success using some of the paint settings David pointed out to make a polished aluminum rim. I thought I would post a shot of it. The Spleen mentioned the lettering earlier. I did it one letter at a time and rotated the tire to place each one radially. Is there a simpler way to make the font wizard follow an arc or path? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbenefi33 Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 The 63 vett turning out nice I like paint job on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 9, 2009 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 9, 2009 The Spleen mentioned the lettering earlier. I did it one letter at a time and rotated the tire to place each one radially. Is there a simpler way to make the font wizard follow an arc or path? Your method is probably the most accurate, but you can use distortion boxes to bend things. Because of the way fonts get splined some may work better than others. Another possibility is to create the letters in a a vector program like AI, use the better tools in that program to bend them, and import the result via the AI wizard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 10, 2009 Author Share Posted November 10, 2009 The Spleen mentioned the lettering earlier. I did it one letter at a time and rotated the tire to place each one radially. Is there a simpler way to make the font wizard follow an arc or path? Your method is probably the most accurate, but you can use distortion boxes to bend things. Because of the way fonts get splined some may work better than others. Another possibility is to create the letters in a a vector program like AI, use the better tools in that program to bend them, and import the result via the AI wizard. Thanks Robert, I never thought about using another program. I guess I have always just tried to find my solutions inside AM. I should have thought outside the box. I'll remember that for the next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 I wanted to give an update to the vette since everyone was so kind to offer help. Below is what I get after applying the techniques given by Roger and Robert to smooth the creases. All the bias settings are now 0,0,100,100. I don't know if it was the best way to get them all reset but I just selected the entire model, set the bias settings to 1,1,0,0 and then changed them to 0,0,100,100. It didn't seem to work until I changed them all and then changed them to what I wanted. I also found that I was not as careful as I needed to be in ending a few splines and they were causing a lot of the distortion. I broke a lot of connections and very carefully reconnected them properly. Below is what I get now. There are still some places that may need tweaked but as Roger suggested, I will wait till I am finished with the basic model. I am moving on to make more of the body now. Please critique so I can get better. Thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeSlice Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 Nice progress! It's looking good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsjustme Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 Looks great, so far, Tim! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtpeak2 Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 Nice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 12, 2009 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 12, 2009 newly pressed sheet metal! Does that "perpendicular normals" button make any difference or is that a false lead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 newly pressed sheet metal! Does that "perpendicular normals" button make any difference or is that a false lead? I removed all the bias adjustments prior to this change. It is hard to say how much it did on its own because I did not render after just that change. The way I used it was, I selected all the CP's and then applied the "Perpendicular" bias setting. You could see ALL the splines "tweak" when I did so I assumed I did it correctly. The change was subtle but it did make a difference. Thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 14, 2009 Author Share Posted November 14, 2009 Here are a couple more pics of the vette. Working out the back half. Still needs doods. Not sure how to do the glass???? Any suggestions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 15, 2009 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 15, 2009 Not sure how to do the glass???? Any suggestions. 1st, You model it's shape like anything else. You probably want to model it with thickness rather than single patch. about 95% transparent with a touch of green or gray. You can make reflections on glass and car paint more realistic by using a gradient combiner ( leave start and end at 0,0,0) to make a reflection material that makes reflections less apparent for viewing angles that are perpendicular to the surface. Real glass reflects much more when viewed at an angle than viewed straight on. Same with car paint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photoman Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Also for the glass you could set a IOR to about 1.3-1.5 for super accurate results but that would create gigantic render times. Photoman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tralfaz Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Wow! You've captured the lines of the 63 split window vette really well! The car just screams to be red or black though Looking forward to see more. Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 15, 2009 Author Share Posted November 15, 2009 Also for the glass you could set a IOR to about 1.3-1.5 for super accurate results but that would create gigantic render times. Photoman OK. I got to tell ya, in case you can't tell already, I am as green as they come to understanding lighting, texturing, and rendering. If you would be so kind, please explain what "IOR" is. I've seen several of your stills and you obviously have something to teach me here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtpeak2 Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 IOR=Index of Refraction. Located in the surface properties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 newly pressed sheet metal! Does that "perpendicular normals" button make any difference or is that a false lead? I did some more with this and it definately makes a difference once you have tight bends and corners. It straightened out the edges of the doors and the windshield opening a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 I've finished some more on the vette and so I thought I would post an update. I tried everything that was suggested from material for glass to IOR to red paint. I still need an interior and a few details but here it is after all the suggestions. Thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsjustme Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Looking great, Tim! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbenefi33 Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 You done a heak of a job on it. I like the paint job on the 63 vet how you get it so shiny ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 You done a heak of a job on it. I like the paint job on the 63 vet how you get it so shiny ? Thanks. David Simmons (itsjustme) gave me some links to creating the paint earlier in the topic. I made a few adjustments to get what I wanted. Here is the material in a ZIP file if you would like to check it out. Gradient_Paint.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 21, 2009 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 21, 2009 I've finished some more on the vette and so I thought I would post an update. I tried everything that was suggested from material for glass to IOR to red paint. I still need an interior and a few details but here it is after all the suggestions. Thanks, Wow, that looks sharp! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tralfaz Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 That is one sweet looking Corvette! Great job! Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyGormezano Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Yup, looks like a mighty fine Chickbot magnet to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 21, 2009 Author Share Posted November 21, 2009 Thanks everyone for all the feedback. I have some more of the detail done now. The fender wells, door handles, and interior are all there. I did them a bit rough since I don't figure on shots from inside the car. Everyones input has really helped with the modeling. Now I need suggestions on composition and lighting. It's probably not a winner but I thought I might an entry for the 2010 Mascot contest Jason is running. I would like to use my robot and the vette. Everything else is unsettled. I'm not sure just what makes a good entry but I'm pretty sure it's not stock trees and rocks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 21, 2009 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 21, 2009 I would like to use my robot and the vette. Everything else is unsettled. I'm not sure just what makes a good entry but I'm pretty sure it's not stock trees and rocks. How about a shot that concentrates on the character. Have him leaning out of the car window. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted November 23, 2009 Author Share Posted November 23, 2009 I would like to use my robot and the vette. Everything else is unsettled. I'm not sure just what makes a good entry but I'm pretty sure it's not stock trees and rocks. How about a shot that concentrates on the character. Have him leaning out of the car window. Thanks for the suggestion. I think I'll give that a try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSpleen Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 excellent! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT Posted December 14, 2009 Author Share Posted December 14, 2009 Here is the vette as far as I have taken it. I added some trim and basic interior. No engine and such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeSlice Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 beautiful model. Way to go Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtpeak2 Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Looks Great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pixelplucker Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Lettering can be done with a bump map or displacement. Make sure you make the letters white and background gray so that it raises and not indents. Used a decal for that will allow you to better blend the letters to the tire rather than just plopping letters as a model on top. Very nice looking model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsjustme Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Great looking, Vette, Tim! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted December 15, 2009 Hash Fellow Share Posted December 15, 2009 That's a fine looking car. Did they really sell them in baby blue? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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