Keyframing options diagrammed

[robcat2075]

Does this sort of thing make sense?

 

[Fuchur]

Sounds right too me... only that this is not only true for bones but for poses, keyframe-animation, constraints, surface-property-animations, etc. if you activate the corresponding filter.

That means the statement "AND would belong to the selected bone(s)..." is only partly true, because a pose does not have to be connected to the bone. So in your case as you showed it it is of course true.

 

*Fuchur*

[steve392]

That makes a handy ref ,nice idea thank's

[jason1025]

Thank you

 

Also can you update your keyframe video tutorial. It currently does not apply. Atleast for V15

[John Bigboote]

Those are 'pearls of wisdom'... I am printing it out and putting it in my book.

[robcat2075]

Thank you

 

Also can you update your keyframe video tutorial. It currently does not apply. Atleast for V15

 

 

Tell me more about what doesn't work.

[Walter Baker]

I think you should write new manual for AM, you make is so much simpler to understand.

Hey thats an idea several of you experts should do a video manual. Whoo! that would be great.

Just kiddin,

But on a more serious note, if not for all the video tuts. from you and many others I would not have gotten as far as I have now,

I do appreciate and thank you ALL for all the time and effort you have put into helping others.

[Rob_T]

I said it before in the Exercise 6 thread where we are discussing this in excruciating (LOL) detail but I thought I would thank you here as well. Thanks for the diagram. It really helped.

[Bendytoons]

Rob,

 

I think the written information is helpful and clear. I think your chart is a bit confusing. I think it would be clearer as a linear chart, one step to the next, without the branching, even though that means you would repeat most of it several times. Alternately you could lay out your branching chart in a different fashion that creates clearer distinction between the branches. Don't get me wrong, it works as is, but visually I think it could be clearer.

 

my 2c,

 

Ben

[robcat2075]

Rob,

 

I think the written information is helpful and clear. I think your chart is a bit confusing. I think it would be clearer as a linear chart, one step to the next, without the branching, even though that means you would repeat most of it several times. Alternately you could lay out your branching chart in a different fashion that creates clearer distinction between the branches. Don't get me wrong, it works as is, but visually I think it could be clearer.

 

my 2c,

 

Ben

 

I'm not convinced it's the best way to explain it either.

 

This chart shows the "what" but not the "why". My video tut is more about the "why" but people aren't getting that either.

 

This filter thing seems to be something that a lot of people aren't getting, but I'm not sure of how to state it in a generalized way that everyone can apply to themselves.

[NancyGormezano]

This chart shows the "what" but not the "why". My video tut is more about the "why" but people aren't getting that either.

 

This filter thing seems to be something that a lot of people aren't getting, but I'm not sure of how to state it in a generalized way that everyone can apply to themselves.

 

I think the diagram is wonderful - I don't know how much clearer it could get. It's a great quick reference.

 

I think the video is great as well. I generally don't like videos - because it's difficult to watch the whole thing (again) in order to find a point that one might have missed, or forgotten. I prefer written material/pictures. Videos are great for introductions to topics. Yours are terrific.

 

I believe you are running into the fact that people have different learning styles - And there is nothing you can do to for those who expect this stuff to make sense without actually trying it to see what happens, nor do some extra "thinking" about what it means.

 

If you were in a classroom situation - then one could flesh out what the confusion is by answering specific questions. Some new users might have to back up and actually need definitions for what those symbols mean (eg, "translate, scale, rotate, pose, etc"). I think it depends on from where they are starting, and how much they are willing to dig in. Some might want it all to make sense without doing any work on their own.

[MJL]

Rob,

As I said in my 'Camera Actions In Chor' post. Your keyframing tutes helped me over a major hurdle in getting control. Having two tutes did give more perspective. When I first got A:M I was expecting a more linear learning curve and step by step instructions, but Animation Master is such a deep, comprehensive, and profound program that it has to be learned in it's own way. It took a while for me, as a newbie, to understand that.

All of your tutes communicate information clearly and concisely. Nancy's right, a person just has to mess with stuff to make progress. Your tutes give us a basic starting point. Because of A:M's complexity if you were to make comprehensive tutes they would be ponderous instead of simple (Which is what us newbies need) and not nearly as penetrating.

Don't get frustrated with us. Just make more.

Thank You Robcat,

Myron

[jason1025]

Thank you

 

Also can you update your keyframe video tutorial. It currently does not apply. Atleast for V15

 

 

Tell me more about what doesn't work.

 

 

Here is the link. We discussed this but I never got a solution.

 

http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?showt...mp;#entry292993

[robcat2075]

Thank you

 

Also can you update your keyframe video tutorial. It currently does not apply. Atleast for V15

 

 

Tell me more about what doesn't work.

 

 

Here is the link. We discussed this but I never got a solution.

 

http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?showt...mp;#entry292993

 

As I recall that one was a a somewhat different issue of trying to force keyframes (with the Offset button ON) when switching from an action to keyframed action. An Issue, but I don't have V15 to do testing with.

 

Go do the keyframe test I just posted and let me know what happens.

[jason1025]

Done

[jason1025]

Your Key frame test works for mac and win on V15. Any thoughts to my problem with your video tutorial? Do I need to help you purchase V15 to get an updated video tutorial?

[Rob_T]

It is a complicated thing to express. Your diagram helped me tremedously. If I may put my two cents in as someone who just"got it";

 

if someone had shown me your diagram when I started working on keyframing and said

 

1) a channel is the grey bar and white line that appears (usually under bones if you are working with a rigged model which, this early in your training you will pretty much always be) in your timeline or Project Work Space.

 

2) Keyframes will appear, as they are made, on the white line (channel) of the corresponding bone or bones in which you created a keyframe.

 

3) A channel usually will not appear in the timeline or project work space unless a keyframe is made on that bone. Once you keyframe a bone and the channel appears that channel is "Pre-Existing."

 

4) When forcing a keyframe on multiple bones you can filter the bones that are keyframed by choosing whether they have a pre-existing channel or not. Many attributes of a model may not have channels and choosing to keyframe these attributes en masse can have unexpected consequences and is usually unnecessary.

 

5) You can also choose to filter the way a bone is selected for keyframing by using the buttons at the lower left of the A:M interphase (See image) to choose whether the bones chosen will be keyframed for scale, translation, rotation, constraints, as well as several other options that you won't be using for awhile.

 

6) Lastly you can also choose to focus the area (of the model) in which you intend to force keyframes by using the bone, the bone and the bones locally connected to it, or the entire model buttons. By selecting the model's (for example) left ankle control point you can choose to keyframe just that control point, the control point, leg and foot, or the entire model by utilizing these buttons.

 

If someone had given me this information, along with your tutorial and diagrams I would have understood much better and sooner what was going on. I still would have had the problem with the hidden control point channels popping up on me later, but I would have understood this stuff just fine. I also would have tried selecting just the hip control point and forcing keyframes on all filtered channels to see if it keyframed those hidden channels for me. As it was, the only time I ever tried using that selection was on the whole model... which cause over a thousand keyframes to be made and generally screwed the entire project for me.

 

There are lots of other things I might have tried to get around my problem if I had understood this better. As it is, I'm very grateful to the info you gave me and the efforts you have made to refine it as I can pretty much guarantee I would be lost in the woods still and stuck on lesson 2 or something without it.

[robcat2075]

The problem with this topic is that there are about five things you need to know, but no single one of them appears useful or makes sense unless you already understand the other four. None of them are particularly difficult but no matter which order you cover them in, you have to slog thru four before you get to that AHA! moment where you see that they all really do have some relation and they are all useful.

 

 

6) Lastly you can also choose to focus the area (of the model) in which you intend to force keyframes by using the bone, the bone and the bones locally connected to it, or the entire model buttons. By selecting the model's (for example) left ankle control point you can choose to keyframe just that control point, the control point, leg and foot, or the entire model by utilizing these buttons.

 

- more likely a "bone" not a "control point"

 

- the middle option, "branch" will key all children of a selected bone, not necessarily all connected bones. I never use it because in modern rigs bones that appear to be parent and child may not actually be so. Bones I might expect branch to key might not. So when need to key a whole arm or hand I explicitly multiple-select the bones I want and use the single bone filter.

[williamgaylord]

Thanks for the diagram. I found it so helpful I printed it BEFORE adding a post to this thread!

 

A lot of this stuff won't be obvious even after a few rounds of looking at it. It takes time to get enough of the pieces floating around inside your head to be able to start seeing how they relate to each other. Diagrams like this sure help, though.

 

Sometimes it takes a few episodes of dreaming about this stuff after staying up waaaaaay too late working on it. "Thanks Shaggy! I never would have seen it that way on my own. And the way you used Vernon Zehr's Terminato to demonstrate dynamic constraints was truly amazing....and Eugene's lecture on bones and Smartskins using Ezekiel's vision of dry bones really helped me make all the right connections..."