Licensing idea for subscriptions

[pixelplucker]

One of the big drawbacks for me with the subscription with AM is I am stuck on one machine. For myself I often work more on my laptop and only use my desktop when I really need to. Mainly because I have shoulder problems and reaching up with my Cintiq becomes an issue quickly.

 

I have 1 program that is subscription based and limited to one computer BUT they use a user account where I can sign in and instantly authorize the machine I am using to use the software. This though not a perfect option gives me the flexibility to work from either machine.

 

Possible to implement this with AM?

[robcat2075]

I'm sure it's possible but I imagine it would mean a more expensive subscription price.

 

 

Mainly because I have shoulder problems and reaching up with my Cintiq becomes an issue quickly.

 

Something I found very useful with my Cintiq is a chair at my desk that is adjustable height so i can be over my Cintiq instead of in front of it.

Alternate idea... get a cheap stool of suitable height that you can quickly switch out with your desk chair when you want to draw on your Cintiq.

 

I presume your Cintiq already has the stand that lets you flatten it out quickly.

[pixelplucker]

I use an ergotron arm that helps a lot but leaning over from a stool won't help since I have a really bad back, had fractured it a few years back. Old age sux

 

As far as cost my sub on that software is approx 20 less than AM sub would be.

Software is my auto tracer from Graphic Powers www.graphicpowers.com

[Rodney]

It's an option worth exploring.
I'm not sure what their software activation suite allows.

20 less than AM sub

From the site:

$15 /mo. billed monthly or $10 /mo. billed annually

Either you are paying a lot more for A:M that I think you are or those folks are giving you a very nice discount over the advertised price.

Edit: if you were a user of Imagaro Z when the program changed hands and became graphics tracer I see that you did get a sizeable lifetime discount. That 50% discount would make the math work (somewhat) but I don't think that can count as the true cost of the product.

All current users can use our great upgrade offer when they start subscribing to Graphic Tracer. You will receive a coupon code by e-mail giving you a 50% discount forever, as long as you stay a user.

 

[robcat2075]

Sorry to hear about your back injuries!

[pixelplucker]

I was a long time user of Imagaro and do take advantage of the discount but I highly doubt they are giving the product away.

I am not sure if their copy protection is a 3rd party product or something they had developed. There doesn't seem to be much difference between how theirs works and how AM works other than when a user wants to change which machine they choose to use they need to go online to their account and transfer. This works by simply being on the machine they choose to use and login and choose transfer.

 

I assume this is generating a new lic file of some sorts for that particular machine.

If I try to launch the program on another or previous machine I need to login and transfer again. I assume the program talks back to the licensing server at start up.

 

Ideally I think this would help many users of AM simply because it is much like the cd version. This could offer flexibility. I could ask the Graphic Powers people what they use and explain if you guys want.

 

As far as the back, old injury, too much standing or sitting and bad weather doesn't help.I don't take any pain meds, not my thing so I tough it out.

[robcat2075]

Find out. What are the costs. If it's something they licensed, is there a cost per user? Do they maintain a server for this themselves or contract that out?

[Rodney]

I could ask the Graphic Powers people what they use and explain if you guys want.

 

If they will share the info that'd be great.

It's generally not going to be good practice to give out that kind of information because not knowing what type of security is an extra level of security that keeps folks honest.

But usually this isn't secret. It's just not wise from a security standpoint to share it.

Someone who wants it that bad will find the information.

I think I know what activation management software they use but... not my info to give.**

 

It's possible that Hash Inc might be ready to move to another activation methodology either now or in the future.

If it makes good sense to make the move given all factors involved, they will.

If not, they'll put that idea back on the shelf.

 

Keep in mind that no one here needs to know this stuff other than for the purpose of our curiosity and considering what we might have to use to activate A:M in the future if anything should change. We are easily convinced.

It is Jason and the powers that be at Hash Inc that need the information so they can make informed decisions.

It is their decision to make.

 

 

Disclaimer: If Hash Inc decides to make licensing more restrictive than it currently is I reserve the right to be very irritated.

 

 

**If the licensing software is what I think it is the capability you propose is not an option without incurring more expense. That expense would need to be passed on to the users.

[robcat2075]

One problem with moving to a new licensing scheme is that all of our old versions use the current one and won't be able to migrate.

 

Hash would have to continue to maintain the old system just so we could use old versions when we need to. That would be uneconomical for them.

[Rodney]

One problem with moving to a new licensing scheme is that all of our old versions use the current one and won't be able to migrate.

That would depend on what software provider they use.

If they are using what I think they are that might not be the case.

 

 

Here are some general guidelines:

• You can always use a newer version with an older server
• You can always use a newer version of license server with an older client
• You can, of course, always use the same version of application and license server.

While there are certainly no guarantees in this guessing game that second bullet point would likely have us covered.

There are a lot of assumptions here... such as sticking with the same company.

Moving to a different license manager could be expected to break stuff.

But that's where you maintain the old, add the new and wait until all the users under the old scheme expire.

[Rodney]

Wondering out loud..

 

How many folks would pay $99 a year for the ability to move Animation:Master around from computer to computer (i.e. activate and deactivate A:M as the need arises to move the license just by logging in to a website and adjusting the license)?

 

I'm not suggesting this would be feasible (or even particularly possible) and very likely it would not but I still cannot help but wonder.... would that be worth an additional $20 per year?

[largento]

What about a kind of (mini) volume discount? If you buy one license at full price, you can buy a second for half-price or something?

 

I pretty much stick to my desktop and don't have a laptop (at least a working one), but I can see how this would be good for people who do go back and forth. Sure, it's not getting the second one free, but you're not having to pay full price for the second one.

 

I would think that would just be something that could setup with the Hash store.

[detbear]

If it were possible, a "Floating" license would be ideal. With most other apps, that only requires internet access to boot the program up. So

that you can work on any computer as long as the software is installed on that system. If I'm not mistaken, this is called a "Floating" license by

a bunch of App companies. They normally offer several purchase options. The software can only be used by one person or computer at a time.

However, it can be used on as many computers as you have it installed on giving you the ability to work on a laptop, home, office, etc.

 

Unfortunately this requires a different set up than A:M currently runs. So I doubt it will ever happen.

[pixelplucker]

Steve over at Graphic Powers said he would love to help. He also happens to be a Animation Master owner.

The idea where the users handle their own licensing I think would eliminate some of the tech support issues with the master lic issue some people run into. This is also good if someone's machine crapped out and they needed to jump to another machine they would not have an extended downtime.

 

Rob email me your email, I seemed to have lost it and I can forward Steve's info to you and Jason. Who knows maybe it won't break the bank and for myself 99 a year isn't a big deal either with that flexibility.

[Rodney]

Perhaps for $99 that would include a second seat.

The gain then would be in that activation and management of licenses would be cheaper because the users would do that.

 

This does beg the question however, let's say I have one seat...

Hash Inc goes to the proposed scheme and for $99 offers a second seat and the ability to move the license to any two machines.

All well and good thus far.

But now I think... I sure would like to put A:M on that other laptop so my kid would stop interrupting me and they could just use that laptop to create their own A:M things.

Do I purchase a second $99 set of seats?

I don't think there is currently an option (via Hash Inc store) for quickly adding seats in this way.

 

As 'access is in the license' I think the solution is fairly straightforward.

Having Steve at Graphic Powers communicate how they get it done to Jason will help immensely.

And I think they are both geographically close to each other in the Portland area.

 

So what we have in the wishing well at this moment in time might be:

 

$79 one seat locked to a single computer

$99 two seats with license managed via login

Additional seats to be negotiated.

 

This would get us back very close to how we operated back in the CD days but without being reliant on the CD for authentication of licensing.

 

I'm I keeping up thus far?

[pixelplucker]

$79 for single machine locked license or floating license for $99-$120? I wouldn't mind paying up to $120 for the flexibility of AM being licensed to me and not a particular machine.

Though the way Graphic Tracer works it seems to be less work for the developer to keep track of licensing and the task is left to the user to maintain their subscription. I see quite a bit of licensing issues popping up here and Jason has to babysit that task and sometimes with a few day delays. If floating was the only option in the store would the saving of labor and licensing babysitting be worth the switch to a new distribution of subs?

[Rodney]

If floating was the only option in the store would the saving of labor and licensing babysitting be worth the switch to a new distribution of subs?

 

I'll play your game.

Sure, of course it'd be worth it.

 

Actually, the only way we will know if the powers that be estimate it to be worthy it is if/when they implement it.

 

For what it is worth, in my estimation moving to the next tier in licensing activation has better than a 50/50 chance.

Someone behind the scenes with an eye on the bottom line would have to crunch the numbers to make that determination.

[nemyax]

pixelplucker

It looks like what you want is for A:M to go on Steam.

[pixelplucker]

Couple people suggested a Steam distribution but that fell on deaf ears. I did get a response back from Jason about a floating license and his reply was:

"We have looked into that and a USB key with the software. At the time we looked into it everything needed for that was not really feasible they way our software works now. But this maybe something we address soon. Most likely it would be the USB key like before."

[Rodney]

For what it may be worth, I would not want a USB key solution.

Having said that, I suppose that would depend on what came with the license.

[pixelplucker]

USB keys I think are pretty expensive in comparison to a software floating license I would guess.

[Vong]

USB keys are a thing of the past. More and more companies are trying to ditch hardware based keys.

 

Foundry currently has standard MODO license setup as a login based system. You install the software and then login from the software using your Foundry account credentials. It allows you to login from up to 2 machines at the same time. If you want to login from a third machine, you need to deactivate one of the machines from your Foundry account on their website.

 

Foundry's system also lets you keep a copy of your credit card info online, so that the maintenance or subscription can auto-renew, without you having to do anything other than make sure the CC info is current.

 

There's always the LW and old MODO way of licensing... Use the license file and when starting the program, check to see if the program is already running on the current network. If it is, then you don't allow the instance that was just launched to run and throw up an error screen informing the user that the software is already running. (Good for if you only want to allow the user to run the software on one machine at a time.) If it's not running elsewhere on the network, then the software launches and the user goes about their business.