Slipin Lizard

Very nice work on both characters. I like the way you've raised the fonts and graphics on the school emblem to add a subtle look of depth. Nice job!

If you run into any problems using the font wizard, let me know. I've used if for corporate logo work, and sometimes the font wizard doesn't do the greatest job with creating patches/splines. It depends on the font. If you get any weird results, I can probably help you out as I've been through it myself.

You bought a legitmate version of Hash's Animation Master and it didn't come with the font wizard plugin?

I can't continue without a clear conscience so I have to fess up. Stian asked me over to his house this weekend. We spent a lot time building this car from a kit he bought at the modeling store, and then worked our butts of to powder-coat it to get that white render look... if you look carefully you can spot some of the drips... Stian, it has to end... the trip to the boat show (all that photoshop to get the background out), the toy cars I got for my kids and put on our new wood floor (he made me refinish a part of my flooring so that he could show a new "render"), the digital cameras... no more... Yes your work is great, yes its depressing, please post something crappy for a change so we can all feel better... oh, and by the way, I just noticed after all this time the NASCAR model you made me has your website "sponsor decal" on it. That was great, I really got a kick out of that. Keep up the good work! Cal

Just some thoughts on marketing. I spoke with a producer down in LA and though we were talking about documentaries a comment he made might be relevant here. He said that as far as marketing your idea the WORST thing you could do was have a complete, finished product (whaaa?). His take was that if you have your product all complete, and then go to shop it, you'll get offered very little for it because if it doesn't get bought up, what are you going to do with it? Apparently its very rare that projects done on spec actually break even, never mind make money. He said the best way to get an idea sold was to do a no longer than 6 minute short, almost like a mini movie trailer to pitch the idea and present the overall feel of the project. This gives you something tangilble to show that the work is yours, and gives prospective producers a clear idea of what it is you are going for. Again, we were talking about docs, but I think you could do the same with this project. Just make your short like you were going to but really leave it hanging so people are aching to see what happens. If you really had the idea to make a full length feature, you could just do a series of scenes and then pitch your over all story.

Ryan, Animation Master's spline modeling is almost counter-intuitive if you're coming from a box modeling program like Wing 3D. I started with Maya, and found AM difficult to learn as far as the modeling went. There were a number of things that I did that made modeling in AM much easier, and that changed my mind to the opinion that AM is a better, easier way of modeling: -I focused on nothing but modeling for a while. Just tried to make simple, clean models. -I bought a book by David Rogers called "Animation Master: 2002, A Complete Guide". The first few chapters about modeling are excellent, and contained information that I wished I'd known when I first started. -I got the Anzovin "Quick Start 2" CD. Again, info here was great. You asked how do you select the spline inbetween the CP's... did you know you can click a CP, and then by pressing tab cycle through the different splines on each side of the CP? Makes it a lot easier somtimes. Tons of good info on that CD. -I practiced modeling, and found like Vern says, that as I got to be a better modeler, the program seemed less "broken". -I looked at some of the primitives that come with the program, and copied them until I understood how they were made. When people come to AM from another program, particularly one that is based on box modeling, they often struggle a bit because patch modeling is so different. Once they get used to AM though, they are usually pretty happy. Go to the showcase forum and check out some of the work that gets displayed there. Finally, just a reminder that this is a community forum, and people like to help each other out. I think Vern was trying to help you, and you kinda went on about how great Wing3D is and then shut him down ("this discussion is over"). This is a forum where we like to tread a little more lightly, so go easy, ok? Make the commitment to understanding how patch modeling works, and I'll bet you'll never want to use anything else.

Man, this is one long thread. Just went through the whole thing, your work looks great. That last shot with the grab & kick looks terrific. I read through your concerns about production. You're actually thinking like a producer, and realizing that your ablity to output material is finite. I think this is because you are working on your own. You work so far shows that you have the ability to perform at a professional level. You might want to start thinking about making the move to working in a team environment, either as a professional or just for fun. I really feel for what you were talking about, the "1 sec per day" dilemma. But you have to remember that high quality animations, especially ones of any length, are usually done by a team. It's easy to convince yourself that you should be able to do it all on your own, after all, its just sitting down at a computer and doing the work. But if you want to see a big project realized, you're going to have to take it to the next level and work with a production team. Look at the guy that did "Sky Captain and the World of Tommorow" or whatever it was. He got the green light to do that movie after showing a little 5 minute CG short that he did. If you've got a great story to tell (and it looks like you do), then don't let the ligistics stand in your way. Your work looks so good, people could mistake it for something that was done by a team of professionals. But the amount of singular effort required is daunting. If your passion is to get your project and characters brought to life then DIVIDE and CONQUER! Working in a team environment is so rewarding, and you'll benefit by other peoples input. Don't try and do it all yourself. Put together what you've got, add dialogue and ambient audio, show it to someone who can get the ball rolling in a BIG way and see what happens. You know, the industry is starving for HD content, so that's just one of a number of avenues you could try.

Yeah Ben, I guess its not that big of a deal as they're right, Eggprops puts up their new models that are for sale too, so it wasn't fair that I was singling you out, sorry. I think it might be cool to make a forum rather than "Showcase" where you and others could put your models up specifically for sale. Rather than have it were people enter comments, make it more a listing so that you can see what is available. That way people wouldn't have to look all over the web for AM models, and they'd have a way of directly contacting the modeler. The only hesitation I have will all this and the comment "your time and energy should be worth a little kickback" is like I said earlier, please, if you haven't, go check out Alias's website. All the good features are locked out, and you have to subscribe to access the information. Alias tries to make a buck from every aspect of their software. In one of the forums, a guy was explaining how to fix a common but tricky extrusion problem. An Alias adminstrator jumped into the fray, and told the guy to make a tutorial and then they would sell it to their "gold" customers. That was about the time I started looking for different software. I'm not saying I totally opposed to selling models, there's a real need for that and it can benefit everyone. I just urge caution though, to keep in mind that its great to have the open sharing that currently exits. Still think a seperate "Models for Sale" would be good, so long as the quality is really high. I did buy an Eggprops model of the Albertasuar skeleton, which was incredibly detailed, and fully rigged. Its very well done. Your gun model fits into that category.

That's a really nice model, Ben, but I must admit I have mixed feelings about your post. It's great to see fine examples of work done in Animation Master, don't get me wrong, but your intent with the weblink seems to be to drum up sales for your model. The Hash forum is very much a community of members helping members, and there is an openess and sharing that takes place that is rare these days. Not only are you selling your model, but its pretty darn expensive too ($50!). I think its better to post things that you want feedback on, or you're willing to share without charge, or talk to Hash about getting you're own forum area like Anzovin does. It would just be too easy for the Showcase Forum to turn into a vending area with everyone saying "here's my new model to buy". A lot of AM users submitted models to Hash for free, that Hash then gathered together and posted free to all AM users. If you want to see the antithesis of Hash's philosophy, check out Alias's website (Maya etc), where you're either a "bronze" "silver" or "gold" user depending on how much you're willing to pay per month. Just my two cents worth... great model though!

Seana, thanks for your response. I was wondering if you could maybe out line how you got comfortable with TSM2. What elements of rigging and using bones do I need to understand so that I can get using the plugin effectively. Right now, I have a lot of weird stuff going on. Mainly, I went through the first tutorial where they rig a simple human character. I followed the steps to the letter, but my rig didn't work anything like the one in the tutorial. I've tried redoing it and either nothing happens when I move bones, accept the bones themselves may or may not move out of place (and yes I have the TSM2 constraints turned on) or my character will move, but distort horribly, with CP's being left behind or warped in all kinds of crazy directions. This is the first thing I've received from Anzovin that I haven't been thrilled with. The Quick Start tutorial disc and Cristin McKee's "Animate!" series have been awesome. My sentiments are the same as yours about rigging, but I just would like some direction, if possible, on what to focus on so I can understand how to gain the benefits of TSM2.

Dude, if you think my first post was a "rant' then you're really over reacting. I was sincerely interested to hear how he made out with TSM2. You guys seem very worked up about any critism of TSM2. If anyone's hijacked this post, its you guys who seem to be going "oh hey, no way are we're going let someone get away with making negative comments about TSM2!!". Since my original question was directed to either you or Robert, I'm wondering who is really hijacking and ranting here? As for Weightmover, I was just part of the CD package that TSM2 came with, along with the tutorials. But ok, TSM2 is awesome and I should just shut up and agree. I wonder though, if its so great, why is there a whole thread dedicated to problems people are having with it? I think that using the Hash rig and Smart Skin is a better option. That's my opinion sorry if that seems to offend you.

There's a saying out there... "it's reach over extends it's grasp" or something like that, and that's what I get from watching your trailier. You're bringing together a lot of different elements, and much could still use refinement. Some of it is hitting much closer to the mark than other parts. I mainly find the actors to be really stiff, the worst part being the three girls walking together. Their upper bodies are hardly moving at all, and their so in sync it just looks off. On a positive note though, the wagon scenes are all quite nice, and look pretty polished. I think you would really benefit from Crisitn McKee's "Animate!" CD from Anzovin Studios. Some of the motion you've used looks like the key frames were not eased well, giving a stiff look to movement. I commend you for attempting such a large and ambitous project, and you'll have to decide how much you want to rework parts of it, or (what I think is better) just take what you learn from this project and make the next one that much better. I think a good litmus test for any animation is wether or not the viewer is engaged by the story, or is more distracted by technical issues. Remember though, many of the animations out there are produced by a team of animators, where one person is responsible for animation just one character, so don't get discouraged, its a good effort.

Robert, you seem on the attack. All I'm saying is that there are users out there (you seem to be one of them) that sing praises about the simplicity of using the TSM2 rig. You're right, I'm new, haven't used a lot of different rigs, and I'm just trying to learn. However, I haven't found that purchasing the TSM2 helped at all. It seems to be a complicated procedure, and the results are less than satisfactory. I didn't find the tutorial that came with TSM2 helpful. My model didn't move the way the guy's in the tutorial did. I also purchased "Weightmover" to try and help with the smart skin process, but to me, Hash's smart skin seems simpler to use that Anzovin's "Weightmover" (now just build a simplified geometry of your complex mesh... this is supposed to be easier??). I didn't order TSM2 with the intention of slamming it. I have ordered their instructional CD's and they're great. It just seems that TSM2 is not that easy to use. Certainly to my mind they could do a more informative video. Why don't they go through the whole process properly, and show how they smart skin their character instead of saying "we'll just choose auto assign so you get the idea..." I guess I'll be one of those animators producing bad animations such as the ones that have been produced over the last 20 years as you say. But if someone is going to sell me a product, and then just say "hey, the way to learn is just tons and tons of experimentation" then please, don't ever go into chainsaw sales. I feel that the Anzovin website certainly doesn't pitch the TSM2 with "buy our software, after tons of experimentation, you'll see, its great!". I also know that I'm not the only one who has bought the TSM2 and found it difficult to use. They can say "too bad" or try to address the problem by improving the product or the instructions that come with it. But don't blame me for having an opinion about a product I bought in good faith.

Sorry, I don't know what the problem is. But hey, how are you finding TSM2? I'm still fairly new to AM, at least to the rigging part of it (I spent most of my time learning to model). I bought the TSM2 disc, but really don't see what all the fuss is about. The results I'm getting lead me to believe its probably more straight forward just to build a rig from scratch. I didn't find the TSM2 initial tutorial much help (my results were nothing like their's) and it all seems pretty confusing. Any advice on getting started with TSM2? The other Anzovin discs I ordered were great (Quick Start, Cristin's "Animate!").

Yep, that's it, found it. Thanks Luckbat. I'll quit asking stupid questions and get down to work now. Thanks for your help everyone!

Yeah, that does help... but even better, here's another one: Do either of you know how I access the electronic manual for TSM2? I'm on a windows platform. When I installed TSM2, the manual opened and I read the first part, then closed it and watched the first tutorial mov. Since then I can't figure out how you get the manual back, I've searched all my folders and can't find it. Talk about a learning process... Where are the Star Trek computers that can read my mind and follow verbal instructions?

Thanks man! Geez, don't know how I missed that one, though yeah, I think in the tutorial it's already on, so he doesn't do that step. I sure hope I can learn to rig with this thing, I sprung for the 3 disc "Animate!" set too in an effort to better learn AM. I'll let you know how it goes, thanks again!

Ok, I'm still pretty new at AM but I have done some very basic rigging in a few different tutorials. I've been focusing on modeling the most. I'm working on a PC platform with AM 11.1. So I decided to go all out and buy the TSM2 disc with the tutorials and stuff. I installed TSM2 and it comes up as a plug in with no issues. Next I followed along on the "basics" mov tutorial. All went well and I mirrored the tutorial step for step, right up to and including hitting the "rig" button to rig everything. The tutorial guy goes on to open an action window and show how the model is now rigged by bending and posing it. I open a new action window, and the bones do nothing. I know this seems whinny, but it just seems like this keeps happening as I try to learn 3D animation. There just seem to be so many little things that are supposed to work but don't. This is kind of getting to be the straw that broke the camels back. I realize the information I'm giving is somewhat limited, but does anyone have an idea of what might be wrong? I'm really close to just admiting that 3D animation just isn't for me, or worse yet going back to Maya! (ha ha).

Stian, your work is awesome, regardless of how long you've been at it. I think you could hang with the best of them so get that reel out there. Your "glitch" is actually a very simple fix, and a common mistake. Check in your timeline, and you should find that where you meant to do a cross fade from the still clip of the video cameras to the study area scene, the transition is backwards. So what ends up happening is you crossfade back to your cameras, and the jump to your study desk scene. I use Premiere, and when I get that there is just a little arrow in the transition that points to the direction the clips are transitioning to (which clip is transitioning into the other), and I'll find that I have the clip that is just begining transitioning into the clip that is just ending, which gives me the exact same result you have there. Don't know how it works in Pinnacle, but I bet its the same problem. Keep up the good work, and hey I might have some more work for you begining in the new year. Cal.

Something else came to mind watching it a second time. When you're under water, the scene looks really clear, and its easy to forget that you are indeed underwater. I think if you included something in the background (like seaweed, or a fish, or shipwreck) that was partially obscured by the density of the water, it would really help finish the animation off and sell the idea that you're underwater. You know how you can see things faraway in the water because of the "murk"? You might want to look at "Finding Nemo". I know that they spent a lot of time just looking at what real underwater scenes look like, and then settled on a stylized version.

Ahh, ok, that makes sense. Yeah, no need for music in something like that, and no need to worry about the mic cable either. I thought the video was meant to be a "calling card" type piece. My mistake. Yeah, isn't the Meteor video nice? They actually had people trying to find out where they got the soundtrack. I'm sure its just some royalty free music, but wow, it just makes the whole piece. I started with Maya, and then at NAB I saw the demonstration of Animation Master, and decided to give it a go. Strangely enough, I haven't been as productive with my 3D work since moving away from Maya, and yet I like AM more. However, the models I've made with AM are more refined and were easier to produce than what it would have been required in Maya. Maya is much more oriented to a multi-person work flow, but its still a pretty cool program. By the way, my name is Cal Johnson. I didn't realize the long term ramifications of using my normal "Slipin Lizard" intenet handle when I joined the Hash community.

Why not music for this venue? Ok, you say that at the begining that if someone can dream it up, you can make it, so I'm taking it that you're trying to move out of just the accident re-creation stuff and take on a broader scope of projects? Why don't you check out this link, its for Meteor Inc, and see how they put together their demo for 3D work: http://www.alias.com/glb/eng/community/mov...?itemId=2400013 You have to click on the Quicktime Logo in the movie window to get the movie to play. When you watch it, notice how there is a really great soundtrack throughout that really keeps the energy of the piece up. Great video is always good, but just because you're making a coporate demonstration piece doesn't mean you should avoid adding a good sound track to keep things dull. This video is going to be the first impression that potential clients will have about your company and your work. In my opinion, this is most crucial moment to take care of those little details and put your best foot forward.

That was great! Truly inspirational! I'm going to clean both bathrooms today! Seriously though, its great to see a really finished, polished piece like that. Great camera movement and compostion. Like the little dolly and zoom you put in there on the shampoo CU. Great work!

Nice over all feel. I too agree you can't quite read the logo that well at that bottom. The water looks really good. One thing I notice and I've seen it before in other water renderings is that there is not nearly enough depth compressing the water in the distance. What I mean is, as your camera looks out across the ocean, the ripples and waves look the same size. This to me really gives the impression that I am looking at a big vertical wall of water rather than a large, horizontal body of water. I don't know at all how you fix this but if you could then I think it would help sell the scale of your opening shot. Nice turtle by the way!

The animation work looks great, and yes, sweet job on the green screen. You've got a nice looking video there... a couple of suggestions: -tuck your mic cable under your shirt next time. Just run it underneath and out the front, clipping the mic some where in the v on the front of the shirt. You speak well. You seem relaxed and confindent, easy to understand. Add a little background music though, just to keep the energy up. Is the part we see just the opening to a larger demo? Looks nice though. What format did you shoot you stand up in?