nixie Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 Hello fellow hashers, I'm working on a feathered charactor and cant decide how to best modal him for animation, Ive attempted it a couple of times but im not sure how best to do it. Like for example should I make the beak as two seperate parts? Im just sat here looking at a blank screen! ive got that mental block and I just cant shift it! check the attached picture for the design of Orfeg the budgie. Cheers - Chris Nix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modernhorse Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 Chris - Great design drawings. As for your questions ... Start modeling! Sorry that wasn't helpful. No really, do you have a story in mind for this fella? How about some planned animations? Flush these things out and that will help you decide how to model it. Will he speak or squawwk ? The answer will decide how you model that beak. Will it fly ? That will help you decide how to model the wings. Will it pick things up? That will also help your decision process. Hope that helps. You're off to a great start with your concepts drawings. Doug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRToonMike Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 I would start with the beak. And look at how beaks 'work' in live Budgies (Parakeets?). Do you have one as a pet? If not, go to a pet store where they sell 'em and look at how they move and such. For instance, when Budgies move their head, it looks like just the head moves and there's no obvious turning or twisting between the head and rest of the body. Info like this can help in modeling. Also by looking at the way they open their beak can help. Budgies and 'keets have a tongue that ends in a point. The upperbeak is pretty much "locked" in place with the skull and the lower beak has a lot of mobility. Like with the head turn, there's no obvious change to the surrounding area of the mouth of the bird. there ya go, you don't need to make the lower beak a part of the head mesh. Just make sure that the feathers around the beak cover any area that could reveal your construction. and the group of feathers around the lower beak/side of mouth, sometimes puff out like a cheek. Nice little thing that could help with making expressions. Doug is totally right when he said to figure out what you want the bird to do. The more complete your storyboards the better idea you'll get of what's going to be required of the model itself. In my case, I have a Grylii-type character (Grylii is the term I've heard that referers to characters who's head is its body -- like Killer Bean, the California Rasins and those M&M dudes), and I want this character to have expressive eyes and eyebrows. I started off with more-or-less reality based eyes (round, etc) and the problem with that was it made the eyes indent too much or buldge out too much from the face. When I flattened the eye-sphere a bit and tweaked the eyelids, it worked better. I wouldn't have any idea why the 'perfect sphere-eyes' wouldn't work if I didn't have the story board that gave me a "heads up" so to speak. hth mike r. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixie Posted December 15, 2003 Author Share Posted December 15, 2003 Doug - True but im finding it easier said than done! I will work on it and come back later with something that I can show! And I agree with you about planning in advance. Mike thanks for the advice, I might go for a more rubber beak to get speech in there and as for feathers, is the new hair system capable of doing something like this?- individually textured? I would love to have feathers that i could controll and animate etc Thankyou both for your response, il get back soon with something more 'solid' Regards - Chris Nix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modernhorse Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 Chris - Will Sutton posted a bird with feathers recently and it looks outstanding, so I think the answer to your question is a resounding yes. Maybe Will can post the pic as an answer in this post as I can't remember where I saw it. *edit* I found that post on CGTalk. Scroll down to Will's post re: Feather Test. Will Sutton's Birdie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 I would model the beak all as one part with the body-> -keeping in mind the way the beak moves the mesh behind it. -if you don't like it, then you can just detach the beak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixie Posted December 15, 2003 Author Share Posted December 15, 2003 Thanks phil I think that will be best, Im attempting a 'rubberised' look to the beak, take a look, - so far I have a few holes to fill up and its looking a bit wobbly, there are far too many splines in this - I think ive jumped a little too far into the deep end but sometimes that seems to work! Oh well any pointers well apriciated Tar! - Chris Nix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 It's starting out pretty good, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zacktaich Posted December 15, 2003 Share Posted December 15, 2003 It looks like a lathe/tweak technique. What was your technique? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixie Posted December 16, 2003 Author Share Posted December 16, 2003 erm well it was a kind of draw rond the rotoscope front and back, then add a couple of cross sections and go from there, probably why it's so bumpy, Il try and connect the beak and polish whats here, thanks all for your input Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted December 16, 2003 Share Posted December 16, 2003 I like to make a rough, then start removing any splines that i can do without. I think Jim mentioned something about using square patches to help smooth a model. I've been having some good results with that method. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragtag Posted December 16, 2003 Share Posted December 16, 2003 Hi, You can probably do with lots less patches, about 1/2 to 1/3 of what you've got there. It will make it easier to get the model smooth, and to adjust it's shape if you need to (make facial expression for instance). Not to mention, faster to render, animate and rig. Secondly, I believe the patches at the lower corner of the eye and the top corners (the ones where the circular eye shape joins the square spline pattern), are going to make creases or edges when rendered. Try using 5 point patches instead in these places. The character looks cool, looking forward to seeing it finished. Are you planning on using v11 hair/feathers? Ragnar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRToonMike Posted December 16, 2003 Share Posted December 16, 2003 The wireframe is looking good. One thing that I've found helpful in getting rid of bumps is to select two (or three) spline rings, in your case the bottom two of the bird's body. Hide the rest of the model, and then from the top view and sides smooth out the rings. when that's done Then show the rest of the model, select the topmost ring you just worked on and the spline ring above that. Hide the rest except for those two rings. Smooth the top one and leave the bottom one alone. Rinse, lather, repeat. This may be time-consuming, but I've found that it's quite effective (at least in my world ). Used this method to smooth out the contours in a characters hips and belly and it really helped. Oh, it works for either horizontal or vertical spline rings. Think there's a number of threads about hair/feathers in the Alpha forum here, very good stuff. mike r. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkLimit Posted December 16, 2003 Share Posted December 16, 2003 very cool concept art for the bird, now I believe that a birds beak should drive the whole structure of it's face. Now with your model it looks like the beak is just pasted on; is this the look your after? And I agree you can get a more smooth mesh if you cut down on the amount of CPS you got there.... Looks good so far I look forward to more updates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixie Posted December 16, 2003 Author Share Posted December 16, 2003 Well I agree Darklimit, I want the beak to be part of the modal, but for now its seperate. Il weld it later if I can!Can anyone see any obvoius mistakes, I tried 5-point patches and ther are a couple of hooks where I joined the wings, And what are these square patches Phil? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixie Posted December 16, 2003 Author Share Posted December 16, 2003 omg! just yook a wee trip to the alpha discussions and saw some amazing stuff! Ive gotta get this finished so I can feather him up! Well done Hash! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixie Posted December 18, 2003 Author Share Posted December 18, 2003 Right, Here is Orfeg the budgie so far, given him wings and feet, attached the beak and textured him thanks to Jtalbotski's vid tute, hes pretty much done now, needs some smoothing and rigging but other than that I'm a happy birdie! Thanks for kickstarting me, all I'd ever done before was a sack tutorial but this taught me alot about splines. Thanks again - Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTalbotski Posted December 18, 2003 Share Posted December 18, 2003 He's a wonderful character! Nice work. And I'm glad you were able to use the tutorial. Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaryin Posted December 18, 2003 Share Posted December 18, 2003 Nice little Budgie there. Congratulations on finishing your first character. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixie Posted December 18, 2003 Author Share Posted December 18, 2003 Tanks Jim and Zaryin! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zandoriastudios Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 I don't think your mesh is too dense, except in the chest. You can use hooks to go from an area of dense geometry to one that isn't. But I think that yor model is coming out great! If the bird is going to be able to turn his head at all, you need to add a couple of rings of splines between the shoulders and head, otherwise you are going to have problems. The beak being a different mesh from the body isn't a problem, you can assign the points to the head bone or to a "beak" bone that is a child bone of the head so that it will inherit the motion of the head. Version 11 hair does make good feathers, and you can add an image to the hair to give them a more realistic look. There is a thread on the alpha forum that will give you some ideas. or you may wait to do that once V11 becomes the release version sometime next year, if you don't want to risk using pre-release software. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRToonMike Posted December 25, 2003 Share Posted December 25, 2003 Great budgie! He has character and I get an impression of his personality (or the voices in my head are louder than usual ). It'll be fun to see how you move the bird! mike r. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixie Posted January 1, 2004 Author Share Posted January 1, 2004 I have rigged my budgie (if somewhat shoddily!) I didnt use fan bones and smartskins which I hear can remove the troubles of extreme creasing - also his left eye has messed itself up a little but im not really too bothered about this; prob just needs re-texturing. thanks people and Will, I tried v11 alpha and feathers but didnt think they looked appropriate for him, render times were extreme too! I even made quick phenomes and made a quick animation actually very proud of what ive achieved in such a short time - a credit to AM I guess! thanks everyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaryin Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 Let me just say that I suck at rigging. Anyone who can finish did a good job to me . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cronos Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 this small friend has charisma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixie Posted February 9, 2004 Author Share Posted February 9, 2004 just thought I'd update with a little pic, I could really do with some help on rigging and lighting. Anyone know of some useful tutorials on rigging from scratch? ( whats the difference between FK & IK) also good lighting tutes would be much apriciated. - I tried the skylight tute on Yves'site but just got confused! so anyway heres the scene so far! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nixie Posted February 9, 2004 Author Share Posted February 9, 2004 oh and heres a mutipass - He wasnt too happy in the cage so he kicked the door down! Is there a way of getting render as lines to render shaded? Thanks hash crew! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.