Ilidrake Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 I've started on a new model last night. Unfortunatly, I don't have internet access at home, just work so I don't have any images.......yet. My question regards hair (see Topic Title) I've avoided modeling hair forever, simply because I suck at it....of course if I had taken the time to try it and practice it I wouldn't suck at it. Anyway, I'm starting to play around with it and the question is should I use helmet hair...or wait until my copy of AM v12 or 13, which ever the latest is, comes in to use the new hair system (should only be a couple more days). I'll be monitoring this post all day so any feedback would be greatly appreciated. By the way, does anyone have any good tuts on modeling helmet hair or is it just one of those things you play with until you find a look you like? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEKOSEI Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 I have tried making helmet hair, and I didn't do too bad a job if you ask me. I needed a fairly fast rendering hair in a hurry for my first big project a year ago, so I had to go with modeled hair. Now, I didn't try to get the look of what can be seen in Square's CG. That stuff looks like it's got layers and layers of mapping to get it to look like round hair. Here's the quick and easy hair I made for that project. [attachmentid=17768] Nothing more then making a few shapes, and copying and pasting them then assiging bones to them randomly. Then there was my attempt at a more helmet hair. [attachmentid=17769] Didn't spend nearly enough time with it to get rid of that spidery look of her bangs. XD And finally and example of particle hair. [attachmentid=17770] Unfortunalty all my turorials on hair seem to be broken links... hmm... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilidrake Posted June 28, 2006 Author Share Posted June 28, 2006 That particle hair looks fantastic! Wow! I'm not going for the Final Fantasy look (not enough horse power under my computer) I just want it to look as good as what you've got there with the particles. Did you use the new combing feature to shape it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEKOSEI Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Combing to get it in the right spot the rest was done by adjusting the hair control points. especially on the longer sideburns. That was also made using three colors of emiters hence why it looks so much like real hair. Unfortunatly particle hair takes a massive chunk of horsepower if you have shadows turned on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilidrake Posted June 28, 2006 Author Share Posted June 28, 2006 What about render time? I would imagine there is an extreme increase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_black_mage Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 depends on the detal, don't for get you can shande the shape of hair too, and also chage the color were ever you want. the one if the same as the bottom one, but with diffrent hair color.the wings were done useing hair too. Rendertime: 1min [attachmentid=17780] this one was my first real test with hair & toon rendering Render time:30 secs [attachmentid=17781] the render time on these wasn't bad at all, but i think adding ore useinf images for hair can increase render time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEKOSEI Posted June 29, 2006 Share Posted June 29, 2006 Alright, just to show you an example: These were rendered on a Laptop 2.8 Ghz with 900 megs of ram. Rendered at the same resolution, both with shadows and reflections turned on, one pass only. Without particle hair: [attachmentid=17801] Rendertime: 6 minutes 1 second. With particle hair: [attachmentid=17800] Rendertime: 29 minutes 36 seconds. Yes, particle hair is a pretty decent hit on rendertime. Hair density values: (Each section of hair has 3 hair emitters to get the three tone color of the hair) Hair on the back of her head: 35, 35, 25 Bangs: 35, 35, 25 Sideburns: 18.75, 18.75, 12.25 Finding a good set of values that covers the head enough, yet doesn't kill your rendertime is quite important. This is something I figured out just by working on the project this image is for, so I learned that only a few days ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_black_mage Posted June 29, 2006 Share Posted June 29, 2006 well yeah diffinatly the fact that you use mutiple hair groups in just one part and others for othe hair areas can drasticly increse render time. on mines i only use 2 on the head(one for a small baling section) and only 3 hair materials on the other only useng 1 hair material on each spot(but the one part on the head). also the density was low ranging from 1 to 4(only using 1% of it on some parts). the more hair spots and density means more render time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilidrake Posted June 30, 2006 Author Share Posted June 30, 2006 6 versus 29.......well, I've had the chance to play with helmet hair a bit more. Not really that hard...just a pain to shape the stuff the way you want. My copy of AM12 came in today so I'll have all the new nifty tools for hair. Soon as I get something done on my new character I'll post for everyone's opinion. Thanks again guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
case Posted July 1, 2006 Share Posted July 1, 2006 wow nice hair came out great i must say but one thing the slits in the neck what are they for anyway nice modeling keep us posted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEKOSEI Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 Those slits are gills, she's part shark. But this isn't my thread, and I don't want to thread-jack Ilidrake's characters. Work on the image I posted is being shown here: http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=22529 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viper GTX2.0 Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 Alright, just to show you an example: These were rendered on a Laptop 2.8 Ghz with 900 megs of ram. Rendered at the same resolution, both with shadows and reflections turned on, one pass only. Without particle hair: [attachmentid=17801] Rendertime: 6 minutes 1 second. With particle hair: [attachmentid=17800] Rendertime: 29 minutes 36 seconds. Yes, particle hair is a pretty decent hit on rendertime. Hair density values: (Each section of hair has 3 hair emitters to get the three tone color of the hair) Hair on the back of her head: 35, 35, 25 Bangs: 35, 35, 25 Sideburns: 18.75, 18.75, 12.25 Finding a good set of values that covers the head enough, yet doesn't kill your rendertime is quite important. This is something I figured out just by working on the project this image is for, so I learned that only a few days ago. OK well this is off topic. The car has nice look shine and reflix could u tell me the propertie of the body colur?o ya and rims plz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEKOSEI Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 See my project for your answer: http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=22529 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilidrake Posted July 5, 2006 Author Share Posted July 5, 2006 Got my version of 13 in last week so I've had about 4 days to play with all the goodies. The particle hair is extremly awesome! One question though, when you add say 4 control points to the brush-lines I can only manipulate the outside point. Is this correct or is there someway to manipulate all the points? By the way, great render. As soon as I get finished with my knight model I'll post a few picks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilidrake Posted July 5, 2006 Author Share Posted July 5, 2006 couldn't wait. Here's a render of what I have so far. Let me know what you think. The right hand is textured because I'm playing around with some of the new materials and some of the Dark Tree textures. Also, I've been having trouble getting the copy/flip/attach to work correctly. I select the center splines, 0 them on the x-axis and then select the whole model and c/f/a, but instead it creates a copy above the model. Am I the only one having this problem. I had to manually attach the head together. Thus the concentrated line in the center of the face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEKOSEI Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 The model is looking great! Yeah, I only had c/f/a work properly once for me, and I've never figured out how I got it to work. And I swear I'm doing it correctly according to the help file. Using the brush, yes you can only manipulate the end control point. If you use the arrow then you can manipulate a control point anywhere on the hair controller. But in versions 11 and 12 hair did crazy things when you did that (bunched up) so it was tough to get an actual hair style. I've not tried v13 hair controlling yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilidrake Posted July 5, 2006 Author Share Posted July 5, 2006 Hmmmm, I been looking around and it seems there are quite a few people who are having the c/f/a problem. Oh well, no biggie. I hope to have him finished by the end of the week, but no guarentees. Thanks for the comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_black_mage Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 lol every one has that problem every once in a while, i do anyway. i always had to move every singele spline to point were when i'd zoom in it would still be smackdab on that line Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilidrake Posted July 6, 2006 Author Share Posted July 6, 2006 K...think I figured it out. You simply need to move the axis manipulator to the center of the face. I placed it on the end of the nose, lined up in the x and y coord, c/f/a and presto! smooth connection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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