heyvern

Holy cow! Is that OUR Rich Jackson? Proud member of MAAM? The forum member better known as Entity? this guy: Rich have you been holding out on us? -vern

Reflections, bumps, massive patch count, movement, huge gigantic massive resolution.... did you use any materials on that? 200 hours sounds about right. It is only about... 8 days running non stop, 2 minutes at 30 fps would be about 430 frames each day.. about 18 frames per hour. it might go faster as time goes on. You could render a few frames at a time when you aren't using the computer. Seriously though if you dropped the resolution to only what you absolutely need... maybe a little less... you could cut that render time waaaaaay down.... it really DOES depend on the target audience, web, standard DVD, film, HD-DVD etc etc. -vern

I think the concept with this tool is not matching movements to an audio file. That is harder than doing lip sync animation by hand. If you ever listen to DVD commentaries "looping" dialog in a movie is a pain in the arse and the actors really hate it. You should record the actors voice while video taping and use that audio along with the tracking information to do the lip sync. -vern

Pricing for something like this is a tough one. One thing you have to look at is not how much AM costs by comparison but how much work this tool by itself will save you. Think about the hours and hours... and hours... of work that could be saved by using this tool. The value of this adds value to AM. The total perceived value of both might even be more than the actual price. I think the 3D painter tool for AM is around the same price isn't it? If you needed to do truckloads of lip syncing in a short time... this could save you bundles. It depends of course on what you put value on, time or money? If your time isn't worth so much then the price is a bigger factor. If however you are a hobbyist animator (with a wife and kids) with limited time to spend on your creations... then the cost might not seem like so much. As I get older... I find that my time is more valuable. This is really exciting. I don't think $150 is over the top... I would prefer $99 but that's splitting hairs. This tool opens up a world of possibilities for a lot of people who either don't have the time or skills or resources to do a lot of lip syncing. Another thing this can do is provide the ability to SHARE bvh lip sync files or just simple head and face expressions. (you could even stick those dots on other movie clips of actors). -vern

When using BVH for body motion that was a pain for me to set up. I forget who it was but someone did a really excellent tutorial on that a while back. I would think with this system setting up the "BVH rig" should be a bit easier. We won't have to deal with IK and differences in limb length etc. -vern

This is pretty cool. I want to get it just so I can forget to take the dots off my face when I go to the local WAWA for coffee. I know I would forget. I could see this turn into some new kind of fashion statement. People wearing white dots in public, in different colors. Seriously though if this turns out as kick arse as the potential demonstrated so far I can see low budget productions snapping up AM just to have access to it. I know that I bought AM originally for the features available at such a low price. Keep the price low and people will be all over it like flies on... uh... a glazed donut in the parking lot of the WAWA. On a side note... I always wondered about certain complaints regarding mo-capped facial movements, specifically "exaggeration". Every time I've seen this sort of thing done in big productions the main complain I and others have is how the "regular" motion of a "real" face is lacking in emotion and subdued and wondered if there wouldn't be a way to just "add" in exaggeration to the rig... like using a slider of some kind to increase the motion on extremes? Maybe you are already planning for this. As for the jittering... couldn't that be fixed in AM? Reducing channels by baking the action or something? -vern

I apologize Jentham2000. I shouldn't have been so antagonistic. You just have to realize that on forums like this we see so many "do something for a t-shirt or credit" posts that some of us get jaded and start to lump them all into the same category. As you may already realize even as a new user animation isn't easy. On another software forum I am a member of we are so much more harsh and sarcastic towards these types of posts I think we actually make some people cry (we hope so anyway). Keep in mind that "I am negative, apparently hate Apple and I talk too much." (See my post in "off topic"). -------- p.s. You may want to look at the construction of your web site. Several text areas and images overlap on the home page and interfere with reading. There are some spacing issues on sub pages but not as bad. This is a problem with FireFox, Netscape and Safari (those are the only ones I tested it with besides IE which looks perfectly okay). It is probably inconsistency in CSS display on different browsers. Or possibly some IE exclusive tags that comes from using Front Page. You set "leftmargin=60" (IE only) and "marginwidth=0" which is for everything else. So you aren't getting any margin spacing on other browsers besides IE. If you don't care about other browsers then I wouldn't worry about. Just an FYI. It's what I do so I notice these things. -vern

You say your web site has national exposure? Do you get money out of it? If you are "selling" something and you make money from a "purchase" and a "commercial" will help with that then there IS some money to be shared along WITH the "exposure" gained by the artist. You don't need any "tracking" to pay something. Actually, How many people interested in your site would need an animator? Someone wanting "exposure" would be better off putting their work on youtube or a similar site geared to promoting CONTENT. Much larger audience and a larger potential for feedback plus total control over what the artist is creating. I create banner ads using gifs or flash and even the tiny, short animations make me a few hundred bucks. And those clients CAN track the click throughs to determine if the ad is working. So the commercial you want only appears on your web site? You are advertising... for a site... on the same site you are advertising? You aren't going to advertise in other places? You may want to spend a little bit of money and create ads to be placed on other sites. Or offer another similar site a reciprocal link. Well... at least you got your web site listed here. -vern

Not quite... a cookie cut decal on a single patch is not "flexible". You couldn't "add" CPs to alter the shape. It would still have only 4 or 5 CPs to make a legal patch. I see what you mean though. Actually I did two versions of the same "flat" animated character once. One used cookie cut decals and the other used "filled" patches imported from AI. The "patch" version was harder to create but had much more flexibility in animating. The AI import works... okay for this technique... but there is a bit of clean up required. Anyway... don't want to hijack this thread too much. We should probably drop this discussion before someone drops it for us. ---- Back to the original discussion... DL, have you thought of using "long hair" splines to create custom strokes?? This idea just popped into my head. You could apply hair to a single spline around a shape to create a custom stroke with variable tapering widths (keyed hair properties) and all kinds of colors!!! This was the one thing I was stuck on. How to create "2D" strokes!!! This could even create a sort of "sketchy" look to the stroke. Holy cow... I may have to try this myself now. -vern

I too understand it would be quite unusual to have this feature in a 3D application like AM but I have some ideas that might make it "easier" to do (no feature is "easy" of course. ). For instance this would not apply if the mesh is not completely "flat". No 3D distortion so no need to account for any changes in the direction of normals. Each "surface" would have just "one" direction, one "face", one single "patch"... 90 degrees from the surface. This would be applied like a 5pt patch. Select a closed spline and apply. Anyway... it is a dream... just a dream... I have a dream. I think this feature would kick some freaking arse though. -vern

It definately sounds like you are using the "pure" option. You want the... er... other one... the gray option whatever it is called. The pure option is... icky. There is 3D stuff I've seen that has that look. I've never cared for that type. Side Note Years and years ago I shot photos at my sisters wedding in 3D. The actual photos were shot on slide film, developed, cut and put in special mounts with a battery powered stereo lighted viewer, but I also scanned and photoshopped some of these shots to be printed for the 3D wedding album I gave to them. I had to carefully tweak the colors in photoshop to get them to match the red blue glasses and to also adjust the "grayscale" so they had enough contrast. I generally like to render stereo from AM as two separate full color images so I have total control over the "depth" and contrast using photoshop. Sliding one "layer" in photoshop left or right changes how far out of the "frame" 3D objects stick out. You can do this in AM of course but it is faster and more flexible doing it "by hand" in my opinion. I even have a 3D template in Photoshop with the hue saturation and levels adjustment layers in place so I just drop them on to new images. I don't like full color anaglyph, I aways convert to "gray" and colorize. -vern

I have been trying to convince Martin that AM could be a kick arse 2D drawing/animation tool if only it had a "no patch" fill option for shapes that are never "3D"... like... a special fill option that didn't require legal patches of any kind just a closed shape. Like an "infinite" 5 pt patch tool. I often dream of this feature late at night when I'm lonely. I think how wonderful it would be. We could spend long hours staring longingly at each other over the computer, talking about new exciting projects while watching 30 Rock on the internet. I would tell this new feature how wonderful it is and ask where has it been all my life. Finally I cry myself to sleep when I realize it is only a dream. .... Uh... er... Oh crap! did I say that out loud? -vern

These are fantastic! What an inspiration. It's funny... a loooong time ago (2003? ) I did something sort of like this using imported Illlustrator files... of course I animated them like "2D" and never thought about doing this in AM specifically as 2D artwork. Would be very interested to see the wire frames to get a better idea of your technique. -vern

This is a long shot but... Is that image above a final render or a screen grab of the shaded preview? Another thing to try is to look at the stamps applied to the patches. Select the patches in that spot and use the "Remove Decals" thingy. Expand that list of decals and If you know which decal/stamp whatever, is the "orange" you could remove it just from that patch... if that is what is causing it. -vern

hatchet job on the splines: You only have that 5 point patch under the eye which could cause trouble. Probably a better way to do it. -vern

First off I would eliminate the hooks at the corner of the mouth. You have two hooks that could connect as a continuous spline eliminating some of the creasing. Another thing you could do is to extrude a row or two of splines off of that last spline of the mouth. Then you could move that spline row with the 3 point patch up even higher on the face so it isn't in an area that moves as much. You may even be able to remove some of the splines on the face above the mouth... since you are adding more splines from the mouth area. You might even find a better place to "hide" the 3 pointer. to be honest you could "start over" and use the continuous mouth spline extruded up and over to create the head. No 3 pointers and no 5 pointers since you could hide the "side holes" inside the huge eyes. -vern

I have done this with A:M a few times using Apple's QTVR development kit: (The link for the VR object is on the right side of the page) VR camera Monarch chrysalis Unfortunately I haven't been able to track down the project file I used for the "object". The camera object is the more complex version since it has X and Y rotation. Basically I followed the directions for Apples QTVR software which I purchased ages ago. I don't even know if it still exists. I set up a choreography with the model object in the center. I then keyed the object/model rotation so each 360 degree rotation on the Y rotated a specific amount on the X to create "rows" as dictated by the QTVR software. I then imported this into QTVR to create the object file. I set the AM project to 1 fps and all the key frames to linear interpolation. Then I set the key frames so I got the exact number of frames needed for QTVR. You could either save these frames as an image sequence (recommended) or a QT movie. My version of QTVR doesn't support the latest versions of QT so image sequence would be my choice. I suppose if there are any other tools for doing QTVR it would need a similar set up. Once you have this setup in an AM choreography it is a simple matter to swap out shortcuts for use with any other model. QTVR Panoramas are trickier actually. You need to account for camera focal length and distance for distortion etc etc. I only purchased QTVR for the object VR capabilities. I didn't do much with the panorama aspect. -vern

As John has pointed out there may be "issues" with the latest version and booleans. This may have something to do with it. I don't have the latest version so I can't verify this. Another option is to use more splines in the cutter. You have two gigantic 3 point patches right on the ends. Try adding a few more splines to see if that helps. Just a guess. Another option would be to make sure the normals are facing out on the boolean cutter shape. -vern

I am a bit confused about the "accidental distortion" when spinning. Aren't you using bones to spin? You aren't trying to select points to spin the cube are you? Groups can be tricky buggers. Sometimes you have to add more splines or points to a group than seems necessary. Sometimes it is literally IMPOSSIBLE to create a "single" group for one surface "property" like the frame. For instance the frame "group" must also include the splines from each edge of just the "photo group". Also you have an issue with the fact that the photo square group is only a single patch. Imagine a checker board grid. You want every other patch to be a color. You can't do this properly with just two groups. It won't work with only two groups because selecting "every other" patch just selects the whole darn grid!!!! You end up with two groups with all the patch selected. You would have to have several different groups spaced apart so they don't share the exact same points. I don't know if the model you are using would cause this issue but I think it might since the frame group encompasses the whole model. You would need several different frame groups for it to work since the "face" groups where the "photos" would go have only one patch. Another problem may be happening when deleting and creating and changing groups like this. The display will not always update immediately. Sometimes you have to save the file or refresh the view to see the changes. I find I have to switch back and forth in the preview (shaded to wire and back) to see any changes to groups when I remove them or add points etc. Hope this helps. Ask me for more specifics or wait for someone who is better at explaining it than me. -vern

It looks FANTASTIC but there is one sort of big problem I have with it even more important than the displacement... Whenever I see the image of a dipping strawberry or any thing similar in TV commercials there is one thing that sticks in my head, one little detail that stands out when it isn't there, it is how the "line" of chocolate "coverage" on the strawberry is perfectly aligned with the surface of the chocolate being dipped into as it is pulled out. In your sample that really bugged me. When the strawberry comes out of the chocolate there is a small bit of "naked" strawberry before we see the coverage line. In my mind I expect to see the coverage start imediately after it is pulled out. There should be a chocolate coating perfectly aligned with the surface of the chocolate. This seems like a small detail but without the illusion is destroyed. Other than that it looks very well done and all the other things like displacement or even dripping could be ignored. -vern

Here is how booleans work: The box is a simple 6 patch box. The "holes" are lathed closed shapes. You can see that the shapes go into and through the box to create indentations and holes. -vern

It seems pretty clear to me. Are you certain you understand the steps? You can read them over and over but if you don't understand why you are doing something or how it works any tiny mistake will just be a strange unknown frustration. For instance I know exactly what those "face steps" in the tutorial are for and how they work. I've done it many times before so I understand the process. It involves boolean cutters and assigning points to bones. If you are a very new user this might be a bit tricky. Also I don't think the boolean cutters show up in preview although I could be wrong about that... I can't quite remember. Have you tested with a quick final render to be sure the boolean cutters are working? What is happening is the face elements are extruded and closed into "solid" shapes. These are then placed so that they poke through the surface of the pumpkin like a giant "cookie cutter" that pokes holes in the shape of the face shape. Then the face shape/s are turned into "boolean cutters" by assigning those points to a bone that has the boolean cutter checked in its properties. The face as a boolean would be "invisible" but would cut a hole through any surface it intersects. The face surface properties are then "transfered" to the surface it is "cutting". So the edges of the holes would have the surface properties of the boolean cutter (the face) and the rest of the pumpkin would keep its own surface properties. IMPORTANT! A boolean shape MUST be completely closed. You can't leave any of the "ends" open. It must be completely and totally closed. For instance you can't use a simple extruded cylinder and scale the end splines real tiny so it "looks" closed. You have to "cap" the ends. You can't use a sphere primitive either. The ends aren't closed. There are tiny holes at each end. The shape used as a boolean must be closed. You can't have any splines that "dead end". All splines must connect to create a closed patch. Sometimes this is harder than it sounds. I would read up on boolean cutters and experiment with something very very simple first then return to this project. -vern

You could draw it in AM (or in Adobe Illustrator and import), use surface properties with 100% ambient and no spec or diffuse shading and then apply constraints to it so it always faces the camera (or not depending on your needs). There are also some custom fonts out there that have "thought" or "speech" balloons that could be used with the text import plugin. This way they come in already created with legal filled patches. Of course you would need to apply the "contents" as decals but at least you don't have to worry about alphas on the TGA's. This technique could give you more options. You could animate the thought balloon "popping" up or do some squash and stretch etc to make it more "exciting". Just my 2 cents. -vern

I think you are right. I just watched "Death Proof" and I must have had that "Kill Bill" look in my head from the extras DVD. OUCH!!!!!! DAGNABIT!!! I just got mustache hairs caught in the pull tab of my Red Bull can... oh man that hurts. -vern

Just goofing with the uniform. Also... I think this will be my "hero pose". Since I can't actually dance (raised by Mennonites) it will frighten and embarrass my opponents giving me an edge. -vern