Admin Rodney Posted October 21, 2013 Admin Share Posted October 21, 2013 Much easier to see what is going on in that view. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyGormezano Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 When you did your Ida and Lothario dance ( pardon me if I mis remember their names ). Did you use IK or FK for the figures or was it a combination of both? I used IK for the legs always, but I would switch between having them pivot the normal way, and pivoting on the ball of foot. I was using 2 different leg rigs: Ida has lite rig legs, Lothario was 2008 rig legs. I preferred the 2008 legs for this, and in general. I believe the arms were always FK (but not sure). I might have switched to IK when they had to stay connected to each other while swinging around. Both had lite rig arms and torso. Yes, your new video shows the moves better, and I can see it works well to the music, beat. Still: Get those shoulders moving, and some more head/neck action, and overlapping spine motion perhaps. Maybe your rig doesn't have enough neck, shoulder, spine control? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted October 28, 2013 Author Share Posted October 28, 2013 ... I used IK for the legs always, but I would switch between having them pivot the normal way, and pivoting on the ball of foot. I was using 2 different leg rigs: Ida has lite rig legs, Lothario was 2008 rig legs. I preferred the 2008 legs for this, and in general. I believe the arms were always FK (but not sure). I might have switched to IK when they had to stay connected to each other while swinging around. Both had lite rig arms and torso. Yes, your new video shows the moves better, and I can see it works well to the music, beat. Still: Get those shoulders moving, and some more head/neck action, and overlapping spine motion perhaps. Maybe your rig doesn't have enough neck, shoulder, spine control? Nancy Thank you for your reply and help. Pardon my delayed response, domestic life. Here is the latest version before any editing of curves and no face or finger work. The rig used is the 2008, still getting used to it, there are many controls as yet untouched let alone explored. The intention was to stay simple and, this dance piece is getting away from that. The music was for use with the clothes pegs. Dance_VGA.mov The splits may look fast and difficult but this was the reference, a jawdropping routine by the Nicholas brothers. There is a part were one does a 720 degree spin in 12 frames ( at least it looks that way ). If I could animate that routine I'd be in heaven !!! Nicholas_Brothers_in_Stormy_Weather.mov regards simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyGormezano Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 Here is the latest version before any editing of curves and no face or finger work. The rig used is the 2008, still getting used to it, there are many controls as yet untouched let alone explored. The intention was to stay simple and, this dance piece is getting away from that. The music was for use with the clothes pegs. Dance_VGA.mov The splits may look fast and difficult but this was the reference, a jawdropping routine by the Nicholas brothers. There is a part were one does a 720 degree spin in 12 frames ( at least it looks that way ). If I could animate that routine I'd be in heaven !!! Nicholas_Brothers_in_Stormy_Weather.mov I like that you incorporated some variation for the lead dancer. The other dancers are a little too much in sync and could use some variation, to loosen things up. Some ways to do it: You could make the dance action for each one take a slightly different amount of time in the chor (eg 135 frames for 1, 138, 140 for the others) and you could slightly change the arms, head for each of them individually just a smidge by overriding the action (for just those bones) in their respective chor action, by layering chor actions at some different ranges (hope that was clear). Might add a bit more life? As for the Nicholas Brothers reference clip - I LOVE IT! Absolutely astonding. I was aware of that clip when I was doing Lothario and Ida dance and thought "How marvelous it would be to do them", but I was having trouble capturing it from youtube at the time AND it was a long, complicated clip, with a complicated set and I was getting worn out by doing only 1 minute....They were unquestionably spectacular. And I think they did their routines in 1 take! Amazing. You are inspiring me by your posts and exercises to get cooking! I can definitely see progress in your pursuits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted October 29, 2013 Author Share Posted October 29, 2013 ... I like that you incorporated some variation for the lead dancer. The other dancers are a little too much in sync and could use some variation, to loosen things up. Some ways to do it: You could make the dance action for each one take a slightly different amount of time in the chor (eg 135 frames for 1, 138, 140 for the others) and you could slightly change the arms, head for each of them individually just a smidge by overriding the action (for just those bones) in their respective chor action, by layering chor actions at some different ranges (hope that was clear). Might add a bit more life? As for the Nicholas Brothers reference clip - I LOVE IT! Absolutely astonding. I was aware of that clip when I was doing Lothario and Ida dance and thought "How marvelous it would be to do them", but I was having trouble capturing it from youtube at the time AND it was a long, complicated clip, with a complicated set and I was getting worn out by doing only 1 minute....They were unquestionably spectacular. And I think they did their routines in 1 take! Amazing. ... Nancy Thank you for your reply. Glad you like the Nicholas brothers clip. I just sit astounded every time I watch it. If you animated it accurately people would question the speed at which the figures moved and, " how could they get up from the floor in that way..."? Rodney had suggested elsewhere that offsetting the cycle would be a good idea and I will do that, If its pursued further. The idea is to have the dancers cycle as each character takes a solo. H'mmmmmmm regards simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 1, 2013 Author Share Posted November 1, 2013 Decided that to do the full dance sequence would take too much time now and there are other things I need to learn first so, this is the current state of it and the whole will be revisited after christmas.Some work on the curves and hands/fingers but non on the face. Back to the briefs... simon Solo_Dance.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 8, 2013 Author Share Posted November 8, 2013 This weeks brief. Not sure how to polish it so any feedback very welcome. regards simon Bag.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Rodney Posted November 8, 2013 Admin Share Posted November 8, 2013 Very interesting. You've got some nice hints at weight in key places. I'm liking where you are heading with this. The one part that doesn't work for me is the last bit with kicking the bag and it then falling over. Given what we've seen up to that point it doesn't seem to me the bag would tip over with a kick like that. My thought being that the mass of weight in the bag has spread out closer to the floor and therefore the kick would only dent the bag slightly inward. I'm trying to imagine what might make the bag fall over and coming up blank. I sense that you are suggesting the bad is perhaps 1/4 as wide as it is deep. Even then I'm not sure it would topple over with a kick. You've got me curious! Edit: In looking again it seems the bag appears to leap and twist out of the man's arms whereas I believe it should (could?) slump/lower and then when it meets the greatest point of resistance against his body begin to rotate. This would make the turning/twisting/falling of the bag out of his hands happen at least 1 foot lower than where it now is. IF he is attempting to reestablish his grip on the bag by jerking it upward that would motivate the movement currently there. You would probably need an anticipatory lean forward prior to that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 9, 2013 Author Share Posted November 9, 2013 Rodney Thank you once again for your reply and help. I had thought about the bag falling over and an actor friend thought it suggested the bag was too light so, in the light of your and her observations I reworked the end this morning. Initially he was going to hurt his foot and hop up and down afterwards but thought it was time to avoid him falling over so tried this instead. Haven't addressed the bag coming out of his arms yet, some more 'exciting' roto work to do first but, the idea was that he was trying to hoist it up so as to get a better grip but the mass shifted in transition. Will get onto that later. regards simon Bag.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Rodney Posted November 9, 2013 Admin Share Posted November 9, 2013 In trying to think of a way to salvage what you have of the attempt to lift and regrip... Bag topple It seems to me that you might be able to get away with a knee coming up to assist with pushing the bag upward as he leans back. When accidentally released then it is the knee/leg that provides resistance that rolls the bag as he loses his grip. I note that you've already got one of these knee lifts just prior in his first effort to lift the bag (nice touch by the way!). A second more powerful knee raise would add progression and continue to emphasize that the bag has weight. I'll have to look at the previous take again because this current one is looking really good with regard to the initial weight as he pulls it off the shelf and it drops/slides all the way down to his knees. The (second) final kick As the first kick of the bag works really well, I'm not sure you need that second. In considering some other options one might be to have him sweep his leg in from the side and topple over/push the bag with his right (kicking) leg. Something has made it much more easy to accept the bag topple as he attempts to get a new grip on the bag. Perhaps it is me just watching the movie over and over again? If you'll pardon the pun, you are getting really close to having this one in the bag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 9, 2013 Author Share Posted November 9, 2013 Rodney Thank you once again for your help. I redid it, adding a higher knee lift and raising the first a bit. The part I like now, is where he doubles over and clenches up in frustration, after the first kick. I think I'll try a few more with the sack as, from what I've read, its a standard test they give to beginners. Might be fun to play with... regards simon Bag3.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Rodney Posted November 9, 2013 Admin Share Posted November 9, 2013 There is a nice bit of free effects you are gaining from the shadows. It almost looks like the bag drops some dust at the point he stops it's descent. I had to play the animation again to see if you'd added an effect. I'm liking this one even better and feel more of the weight. Right now there is only one thing that distracts me: There doesn't seem to be any motivation behind (or for keeping) that second set of kicks). I know that he's kicked the bag and stubbed his toe (probably even painful) and yet the two kicks still read to me as excess. I suppose we could go back to that old crutch and ask, "What is he thinking" but I suspect you are more interested in focusing on weight. As the point seems to be to emphasize that this guy has dropped the bag as soon as that is happened in are in performance territory. What is the significance, not of kicking the bag, but of dropping the bag. He can react to kicking the bag but perhaps it's more important to deal with the primary activity which is that of dropping the bag. Pure pie in the sky thinking out of hat follows: My thoughts again turn to motivation. After kicking the bag and beginning to react he could first turn and look to see if anyone has seen him drop the bag and THEN, when he thinks the coast is clear, he might again assault the bag. The first assault being an involuntary action but the second one purposeful with intention. (remember to always show the character thinking if you can!) If he were to vocalize his thoughts he might simply be saying, "...stupid bag." And to end the shot (and the whole shebang) he might then begin to crouch down as if to lift up the bag. I'm thinking somewhat in terms of if this were a scene that plays over and over again with different results each time (or as if there will be a subsequent scene where he returns to get a second bag). We don't really care at this point if we'll ever see those scenes as we are already involved with the character here. But regardless, the important thing to remember is that there was a reason he was going to get that bag in the first place. Beyond the pure exercise value of this animating this sequence, it is important to get back to that initial motivation of the character. I'm not exactly sure what his motivation is beyond "Go get a bag." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 18, 2013 Author Share Posted November 18, 2013 Rodney Thanks again for your help. I've tried to address some of those points in this weeks effort which develops on from the last one. I'm presently trying to read the Ed Hooks book, "Acting for Animators". My partner is an actor and two friends locally but is not something I have any real experience of. Have started to look into attending classes within this area but it may be awhile before enough nerve is built up to actually try it. This is the first pass at it, some of the timings need to be changed to get more weight into the bag. Any fedback more than welcome. regards simon Bag_TwoA.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Rodney Posted November 18, 2013 Admin Share Posted November 18, 2013 Interesting. My initial thoughts: He should keep one knee down on the ground when beginning to move upward. Think in terms of resistance and push/pull and wait for it... an important principle of animation; Opposing Directions. As the bag is going up (being lifted) his bulk of his effort/weight is going down (if the weight were enough to exceed the tolerance of the floor this force would penetrate the ground). Imagine a wood floorboard here and this might begin to make sense as that floor would naturally bend as it reacts to the weight. As this floor is more solid this give the guy the resistance he needs to lift the weight off the ground. But again... this is important... in order for the bag to go up the guys weight must go down. Keeping his knee in place is one thing you can use to show that he is stable and balanced and ready to continue to lift the bag off the ground. My primary concern as it is right now is that it is very slow with little texture of timing throughout. Think here in terms of Slow/Fast. Steps/Beats 1. Slow. Character takes a moment or two to contempt picking up the bag (2 beats... more if character's performance antic is exaggerated for entertainment value) 2. Fast. Bingo! With his decision made he moves immediately into action (1 beat to lean down and another to initially grab the bag) 3. Slow. Character adjusts to account for the actual weight of the bag (Note that here he is bridging the gap between what he thought he was going to do with an imaginary bag in Step 1 and what reality dictates now that he has contacted the 'real' bag. 4. Fast. Character launches upward using his upper body first until the free movement is delayed or stopped by the actual weight of the bag (this is where the chain reaction of the human body (Successive Breaking of Joints) is observed and it's why at least one knee might still be on the ground) 5. Slow. Character is now fully lifting the weight of the bag. 6. Fast. I don't see this in your current shot but the character's goal is to move or get rid of that that $#&%! heavy bag! 7. Slow. Recovery phase as he accomplishes (or does not accomplish) his task. Added: There is more than one way to approach weight and your shot suggests a shortcut in that if you consider breaking up the Symmetry of his pose (legs and arms... entire body... twinning/mirroring themselves) then the rest of the character's posturing begins to work itself out. At any rate... try to get some texture of slow and fast movement into the animation. Hope that makes sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 19, 2013 Author Share Posted November 19, 2013 Rodney Thank you very much for your feedback and helpful comments. Much appreciated. I shall try to address them today. I was conscious of twinning when doing it but it was difficult to avoid with the nature of the action. I will go back and make some adjustments in that regard. Haven't looked at the curves yet and will try to adjust the timing that way today. regards simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 19, 2013 Author Share Posted November 19, 2013 Still haven't touched the curves yet, and there are a couple of points with mesh penetration but, here is today's revisions so far. Taken out five seconds worth of keys, added some hand/finger flexing before the lift ( awaiting refinement ) and, followed Rodney's suggestion regarding the knee on initial lift. Any critical feedback welcome. simon Bag_TwoA.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Rodney Posted November 20, 2013 Admin Share Posted November 20, 2013 It's looking a bit snappier now. Perhaps that is due to cutting those extra seconds out of the sequence. I really stared at (replayed that is) the very end of the sequence where the bag leaves his hands. Something is off there but I can't quite put my finger on it. I'll take a stab at describing it and maybe the lightbulb will go on for me... There is an interesting dynamic going on in your scene because the Center of Gravity (COG) changes as the guy lifts the bag. In short, I believe the COG is lower and farter to the right that where you have it represented, particularly at the time he loses control of the bag. Right now it's as if the guy is flipping the bag up and outward as he loses control of it. Outward is okay. I could see that but upward is problematic because of the weight which you've previously established in the scene. It would be interesting to see where you might draw a series of dots on each frame (or every few frames) to show us where you think the COG is throughout. As with most things there are several approaches you could take to resolve this depending on what you want to finesse. Less work would be to reroute the trajectory of the bag downward earlier. Here the focus would be on weight dropping immediately as he loses control of the bag. Note that this would actually push his hands/arms downward because he is (trying to) lift the bag. His upper arms and body were in control of the majority of the weight but as soon as it shifts forward the forearms can no longer sustain that lift and they go downward even as the upper arm is going up. This is yet another one of those Opposing Directions opportunities in that he is pushing with a force upward but the force (weight) of the bag is going down. I should draw this over your imagery because I'm probably not conveying this correctly. I see that you've got a nice lean backward and the upper arms go upward as well... that works! Keep that! I am of the opinion that the forearms however should be advancing downward under the weight of that really heavy bag. Now there is a second approach that might allow for more lateral movement of the bag (such as you've got it now) and that is if the guy swings back and forth a few times in an attempt to keep balance. If nothing else it would provide a little motivation for the weight of the bag to move out and upward as it is now. There are some really nice tutorials on Center of Gravity online and they are definitely worth checking out: Here's one that doesn't quite catch what I'm after but it comes close: http://animationphysics.org/wp-content/upl...nceTutorial.pdf There are lots of nice examples over at http://animationphysics.org/. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 20, 2013 Author Share Posted November 20, 2013 Rodney Thank you for your feedback and helpful observations once again. Much appreciated. I will follow up the cog points later and try to correct them this evening. What I was trying for was the bag overbalancing and him overcompensating when trying to correct it which caused the bag to fall. What I should have done is use a method from the seesaw efforts a few weeks back and draw a path in the chor to animate the bag against. There is, as you say, too much forward and upward movement as it is now. Thanks for the links to the cog refs. regards simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyGormezano Posted November 20, 2013 Share Posted November 20, 2013 Nice links, Rodney! This one in particular on page 16 of the pdf is appropriate for lifting a heavy object - gives some nice key frames http://animationphysics.org/wp-content/upl...nceTutorial.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Rodney Posted November 20, 2013 Admin Share Posted November 20, 2013 Thanks for more precise pointing to the reference Nancy. Much appreciated! Here is an excellent (and short) primer on Center of Gravity from the same author behind http://animationphysics.org/ (Alejandro Garcia): zjhRxeR9GXo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 20, 2013 Author Share Posted November 20, 2013 Revised the bag fall and the movements. Still haven't touched the curves or addressed the penetration. Hoping to do that tomorrow. Rodney, thank you for the animation physics link, I have subscribed to further updates. This was done before your link with the cork. regards simonBag_TwoB.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Rodney Posted November 21, 2013 Admin Share Posted November 21, 2013 Hey, I like that. I don't think I have anything to suggest to... Okay, since this is feedback I'll postulate one thing. If the bag squashes (spreads out) just a little more at the base when it hits the floor my inner crit will be silenced and complete. Perhaps not so much on initial impact but in its final resting place. Kind of a ka-FLUMP to end the scene where the first beat is the first impact and the second the bag is exactly back in it's original place (so you've got a potential for a looping cycle here... very interesting!). Of course, to have it squash too much would suggest it might not over in the first place. I'm pretty happy with that one. But more importantly, what do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 21, 2013 Author Share Posted November 21, 2013 Hey, I like that. I don't think I have anything to suggest to... ... I'm pretty happy with that one. But more importantly, what do you think? Rodney Thank you for your feedback. I keep seeing errors of hand positions and mesh penetration at the moment so will need to address those today. With your assistance, it does look a lot better than before which I'm pleased about and, I've got an idea for a further development with the bags. Will try to sort the glitches on this one and start part three next week Following the dance attempts of the other week, there was a possibility of dancing flour/cement bags but may leave that untilDecember. regards simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 21, 2013 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 21, 2013 Hi Simon, here are some notes... SimonHeavyliftH400.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 21, 2013 Author Share Posted November 21, 2013 Hi Simon, here are some notes... SimonHeavyliftH400.mov Robert Thank you for your movie critique and help. Much appreciated. I've gone back and shifted the camera position and cog of some of the poses and will look at the ankle and wrist positions later. I had spotted the wrist problems but was not sure what was causing it? The rig used is the 2008 and it looked as though the fanbone for the wrist wasn't aligning as expected. The ankle problem was entirely operator error. I thought it might be odd but couldn't check it. The initial pose is a carry over from the previous sequence, were he drops the bag after picking it off the shelf. I had thought to do something different but it seemed more sensible to continue the theme.. The next sequence will be him using a wheelbarrow to move them away rather than try to carry them personally. There wasn't really a story outline, although it may get converted into one at a later date, as the original idea was for the figures ( Blockheads ) to be a family group of builders called ( pardon the pun ) The Building Bloxx . Thank you for your help. regards simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 21, 2013 Author Share Posted November 21, 2013 Thought it best to have a quick go at some lifts without the bag before resuming with that so, here is the first. Any critical feedback welcome. simon Kneel_lift_001.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 21, 2013 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 21, 2013 Thought it best to have a quick go at some lifts without the bag before resuming with that so, here is the first. Any critical feedback welcome. simon Kneel_lift_001.mov I definitely like the snappier pacing of that. A good opportunity for overlapping motion is to have the head lag the torso when the torso starts rising up. You could go wither way on the head. It could lead the torso, as if he is flicking it to help get his torso started, or you coudl lag it as if it's getting left behind by the torso's motion. Leaving it as a rigid extension of the spine will look... rigid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyGormezano Posted November 21, 2013 Share Posted November 21, 2013 Thought it best to have a quick go at some lifts without the bag before resuming with that so, here is the first. Kneel_lift_001.mov Yes that is snappier - And I do get some sense of momentum when he uses his arms to transition to standing. However, the thing that bothers me mostly with this exercise is that this guy starts with his knees on the ground, before he gets up (and also when he was lifting the heavy sack). Guys only? might be able to do that, maybe without something to lift, but it's quite difficult (and almost impossible for me, without using my hands to push myself off) - hurts my toes! But to do it that way and lift something heavy also? No way, I say. I would think he would start from a squat, like a weight lifter would. Never with his knees on the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markw Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Well I couldn't help but have a go at this too! Here's my quick take (it could be tweaked more) on going from a kneel to standing. This is in isolation and without any context, which would obviously effect the specifics of someone doing it. KneelToStanding.mp4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Rodney Posted November 22, 2013 Admin Share Posted November 22, 2013 However, the thing that bothers me mostly with this exercise is that this guy starts with his knees on the ground, before he gets up (and also when he was lifting the heavy sack). Good point Nancy. I'd have to check what came before again as this last clip is just the tail end of the longer sequence Simon posted before where the character contemplates/ponders for an extended period of time before crouching down to lift the bag. A suggestion back then was to lift one knee off the ground to convey the effort he'll need to lift the bag as well as break up the symmetry/twinning. I generally suggest something once and move on so it's good when others validate these core concerns. Added: Nice quick take Mark! I will say that starting from both knees down with twinning of the legs/etc. on the way up with a robot is considerably more realistic than it would be with a human. A robot might be able to get away with it. Edit: It looks like I was the one that missed a few posts. I'm behind by a few briefs! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 22, 2013 Author Share Posted November 22, 2013 Thank you. Nancy, Robert, Mark and Rodney for your replies and help. I was going to post another last night before going to bed but, managed to delete the action file at the wrong moment. So here is this morning's attempt instead. Only broad poses, no finger or facial keys. I tried to incorporate Nancy's observation regarding kneel to squat before lift and to keep the cog in the right place on the poses. Will try a few more today. regards simon Kneel_lift_002.mov This afternoon's lift Kneel_lift_003.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markw Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Hi Simon, On clip Kneel_Lift_002, In the first snapshot from it here, at the beginning I would say that you could still rotate the heals further up and forward to get a more realistic gap between feat and shins. The second snapshot is from around frame 30. This pose seems out of place as is. But if he were to have something heavy in his hands then it makes a lot more sense! However I would bring the arms back more in to the body. When people lift heavy things they tend to keep all that extra mass tight in to the body as they lift. Unless of course they want to put their backs out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 22, 2013 Author Share Posted November 22, 2013 Hi Simon, On clip Kneel_Lift_002, In the first snapshot from it here, at the beginning I would say that you could still rotate the heals further up and forward to get a more realistic gap between feat and shins. The second snapshot is from around frame 30. This pose seems out of place as is. But if he were to have something heavy in his hands then it makes a lot more sense! However I would bring the arms back more in to the body. When people lift heavy things they tend to keep all that extra mass tight in to the body as they lift. Unless of course they want to put their backs out! Mark Thank you for your reply and help. Much appreciated. I shall adjust the files this evening. I got distracted briefly this afternoon looking at some cossack dancing. The balance and dynamics involved are jawdropping. If you animated it accurately people wouldn't believe it. regards simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 22, 2013 Author Share Posted November 22, 2013 Last ones for today. Will go back to the bag tomorrow. One more variant and all four together. Any critical feedback welcome simon Kneel_lift_004.mov Kneel_lift_005.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 23, 2013 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 23, 2013 Here's something I did once that involves getting up off the ground... http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=45683 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 23, 2013 Author Share Posted November 23, 2013 Here's something I did once that involves getting up off the ground... http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=45683 Robert Thank you very much for the file. Certainly a lot snappier than mine and clear in the poses and motivation. Much to learn about posing and timing... regards simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted November 23, 2013 Hash Fellow Share Posted November 23, 2013 Of the sampler set you have in 005 I think the third one is most effective in suggesting that he is moving his mass with effort. Pursuing Nancy's suggestion about using the arms to help push up as in 003, the hands need to pick one spot to push and stay there rather than wander up the leg. Probably about mid-thigh would be a typical spot. IF they are sliding they don't look like force is getting done. They should also stay there as long as the arms can reach. Pushing the hand against the thigh is what keeps it on the leg. If the hand is leaving the leg prematurely then it appears not to have been pushing much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 25, 2013 Author Share Posted November 25, 2013 Got started on a new version of the bag lift. Thought to follow up Robert's suggestion to use a constraint to anchor the arms and hands to the bag. then animate the bag. Have constrained a null to the ends of two bones in the sack ( using a translate and orient constraints ) then tried the same thing to constrain the forearms to the Nulls. While its worked for the nulls to bag it seems to have missed for arms to nulls. Is there an accepted routinge to achieve this ? regards simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyGormezano Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 then tried the same thing to constrain the forearms to the Nulls. While its worked for the nulls to bag it seems to have missed for arms to nulls. Is there an accepted routinge to achieve this ? You probably want to have the arms in IK - and you would constrain the Hand (or IK hand controller, not sure what it's called in 2008 rig) to the null. Do not constrain the forearm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 26, 2013 Author Share Posted November 26, 2013 then tried the same thing to constrain the forearms to the Nulls. While its worked for the nulls to bag it seems to have missed for arms to nulls. Is there an accepted routinge to achieve this ? You probably want to have the arms in IK - and you would constrain the Hand (or IK hand controller, not sure what it's called in 2008 rig) to the null. Do not constrain the forearm Nancy Thank you for your reply and help. I shall try that this morning. I usually leave that turned off because it gets a bit floaty, starting to learn now though ! regards simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 26, 2013 Author Share Posted November 26, 2013 Having trouble with the final render at the moment so, while trying to sort that out, Heres a shaded version of the current state of play. I was trying for a big sneeze at the end. Any feedback welcome simon Bag_Two_B.mov With thanks to Robert, Nancy, Mark for their help in solving the render problem. Here is a quick render of the current state of play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted November 29, 2013 Author Share Posted November 29, 2013 No facial animation yet but, hope this may be the last version in terms of broad action. Any critical feedback welcome Simon This a vga from HD1080 conversion. Bag2.mov Ps With thanks to Mark for his help in getting Multiple Master working. Now I know how to do it, trying a flat shaded toon variant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted December 3, 2013 Author Share Posted December 3, 2013 This is the first pass at what will ( probably ) be the last of this little series of briefs. Theres no sound but the tyre on the barrow bursts at 03:08. Just started to notice a few things so will try to revise those later today or tomorrow. In the meantime, any critical feedback very welcome. simon Barrow.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markw Posted December 3, 2013 Share Posted December 3, 2013 You do enjoy giving your characters a hard time! Two things from me here. First the actor, well he still has those oddly flexible feet! Maybe try pointing them out more to the sides as he goes down rather than folding flat against his shins. The other is the flat tire. At the moment it looks more as though the wheal just got stuck in soft ground. Though everything prior to this would suggest a hard surface. One possible way to get a flat tire, would be to use 'Muscle Mode' in the Chor as your animating. (you may possibly need to add more Cps to the wheal first) Note which Cps need to go flat and spread out and set a Keyframe on them at the point just BEFORE the tire bursts. (in QuickTime7 that looks to be around frame 82) Now go to the final "deflation" frame (it looks to be around frame 86) and pull out and flatten the tire to taste. One general note about Muscle Mode, if you want to get back to the original mesh shape, before distorting anything set Keyframes for the same Cps at the point AFTER your animating in Muscle Mode. This "bracketing" will ensure any mesh changes are contained to where you want them. Another possibility would be to use a 'Distortion' box to flatten the tire but again you may need to add CPs fist to the model to make it convincing. I've not animated much with Distortion boxes, so others may be better able to advise about their possible use here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted December 3, 2013 Author Share Posted December 3, 2013 Mark Thank you for your reply and help. Much appreciated. Take two. Have revised the foot positions and placements and added further movement to bags. Yet to address the burst tyre. Will have a look at that tomorrow evening. No facial animation as yet. regards simon Barrow.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted December 5, 2013 Author Share Posted December 5, 2013 A final ( ?) addition to the bags and barrow theme, Was trying to remember how to use glow progressively but couldn't. Oh well. simon Prance.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esolc Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 You are beginning to tell a story!!! I believe sound is important in storytelling. Perhaps add some sound? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted December 9, 2013 Author Share Posted December 9, 2013 You are beginning to tell a story!!! I believe sound is important in storytelling. Perhaps add some sound? Esoic Thank you for your feedback. They are mainly little sketches at the moment rather than full narratives. I wanted to make sure they read visually before doing anything else to them. I'm not very good with sound ( although I would like to be ) so a friend will do the sound later. I hope they are fun to watch but the real purpose for me is to learn as much as possible about animating, in terms of posing, timing and weight. regards simon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Edmondson Posted December 11, 2013 Author Share Posted December 11, 2013 Start of this weeks brief. Any feedback welcome. He's stretching before starting to run. No facial or hand work yet. Thought there might not be enough pauses ? simon Stretch.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esolc Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 Looks good to me! Why not make some happy new years toasting? And contribute with a toasting exercise to this topic: http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=45734 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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