Question About Spline Direction

[AMSpector]

Hi,

 

After much trial and error I managed to complete the face portion of the Cooper tutorial... using an alternate subject. In the tutorial, the initial central spline was only carried down to the bottom of the upper lip, so by the time I finished the face half, the central spline was not continuous. Using "Shift + }" I could see that it traveled up the center spline, around the outer face (is this normal?), but stopped at the bottom lip. I tried unsuccessfully to make it continuous. Anyway, I could not get Copy/Flip/Attach to work (read some really good posts about it though), so I copied, pasted then manually broke and connected the splines from the new half to the original. It seems OK, but the central spline, at the top and bottom, has creases which could cause problems as I work to complete the head. I've tried breaking and reconnecting the splines adjacent to it in hopes that I could make it behave, but something in my model is off.

 

Is there a way to change the direction or flow of a spline? Would that help in my case?

 

Thanx.

 

 

Here is the project file:

Project3d.prj

 

 

Edit: I forgot to mention that I must have began modeling facing the wrong direction, because I had to switch the left and right perspective to match the Rotoscope. Couldn't figure out how to resolve that.

[Caroline]

Just a quick look.

 

To see the spline, click halfway between two points on the spline, and press the comma , key. This pic is the result on the centre spline:

 

You can see that the outside spline around the edge is included, and should not be.

 

Use K to break the spline, then A to add to a spline.

 

This one is a bit tricky though. Press the A key, and click the control point. Before clicking to add the next point, move the cursor to see which spline is affected. If it is the wrong one, put a dummy point as in this picture:

 

After adding these two dummy points, the spline across the top can be attached correctly. The dummy points can then be deleted.

 

Same with the point under the chin.

 

The mouth should not be on the same spline as the centre spline either (see first pic).

 

Other than those, I can't see any obvious spline errors.

[AMSpector]

...The mouth should not be on the same spline as the center spline either (see first pic).

 

I guess I need to study the tutorial a little more closely because in the next section I'm going to be asked to delete one half of the face; I should have resolved my Copy/Flip/Attach issue head on. Maybe I can test the half in mirror mode?

 

Thanks for your help Caroline, I was able to separate the outside spline from the center, next I'll work on separating the mouth.

[phatso]

You are SAVING multiple versions aren't you? So if you screw something up you can go back to a pre-screwed version? I had to learn that the hard way.

 

Caroline, did you move?

[Caroline]

I should have resolved my Copy/Flip/Attach issue

I think this is an important skill to master - it really does save a lot of frustration. Also the skill of repeatedly doing it, so you can see how your model is working (ie do a C/F/A, model a bit more, delete one half and do another C/F/A).

 

I find Mirror Mode works, but only for small movements of CPs after the C/F/A has been done. Like when you are refining the final positions of CPs.

 

Caroline, did you move?

Huh? Are you stalking me? Have you seen all the junk slowly and unwillingly leaving my house? I am moving next March. If you get here before then, you can stay for a while, as long as you are able to move large pieces of furniture.

[jirard]

I would like to add something

You dont have to keep using copy flip attach when testing to see how a model looks. The reason being is that you will have to continuously keep breaking the splines when you delete the other half of the model cuz u dont like the way its turning out.

 

 

If you left click and drag over the half of the model u want to check and copy and paste then right click and flip along the x axis then position you will see what adjustments need to be made. I dont use the copy flip attach to much unless I think the model is almost done.

 

[AMSpector]

You are SAVING multiple versions aren't you?

 

Oh yes, I learned that years ago with my Photoshop designs. I always start with something like "Name1", and then work my way through the alphabet until I think it deserves to go to the next number. There are dozens of versions leading up to "Project3d".

 

 

... You dont have to keep using copy flip attach when testing to see how a model looks. The reason being is that you will have to continuously keep breaking the splines when you delete the other half of the model cuz u dont like the way its turning out.

 

Makes perfect sense. Your characters are great BTW.

[Caroline]

That is a good idea, Jirard, and I will give that a go next model.

 

The way I do C/F/A, I don't have to break splines - if you copy the left half, then delete the whole model, then paste the copied bit, there's no breaking needed. However, my method is not possible if you have any rigging or weighting done.

 

(This is what I do:

1. In Front view, click the central spline.

2. Press the comma , key to select the whole spline.

3. On the top toolbar, click on Show Manipulator Properties.

4. Click the Scale manipulator.

5. Change the X scale to 0% - this aligns along the x axis.

6. Select the left half of the model up to and including the central spline.

7. Press Ctrl C to copy.

8. Press Ctrl A to select all

9. Press Delete to delete all.

10. Press Ctrl V to paste.

11. Shift click the middle spline.

12. Right click and Copy/Flip/Attach.)

[jirard]

That is a good idea, Jirard, and I will give that a go next model.

 

The way I do C/F/A, I don't have to break splines - if you copy the left half, then delete the whole model, then paste the copied bit, there's no breaking needed. However, my method is not possible if you have any rigging or weighting done.

 

(This is what I do:

1. In Front view, click the central spline.

2. Press the comma , key to select the whole spline.

3. On the top toolbar, click on Show Manipulator Properties.

4. Click the Scale manipulator.

5. Change the X scale to 0% - this aligns along the x axis.

6. Select the left half of the model up to and including the central spline.

7. Press Ctrl C to copy.

8. Press Ctrl A to select all

9. Press Delete to delete all.

10. Press Ctrl V to paste.

11. Shift click the middle spline.

12. Right click and Copy/Flip/Attach.)

 

 

I've been doing it the hard way haha

Thanks

[jirard]

You are SAVING multiple versions aren't you?

 

Oh yes, I learned that years ago with my Photoshop designs. I always start with something like "Name1", and then work my way through the alphabet until I think it deserves to go to the next number. There are dozens of versions leading up to "Project3d".

 

 

... You dont have to keep using copy flip attach when testing to see how a model looks. The reason being is that you will have to continuously keep breaking the splines when you delete the other half of the model cuz u dont like the way its turning out.

 

Makes perfect sense. Your characters are great BTW.

 

Thanks

Here is the model if you want to check it out.

lady.mdl

[AMSpector]

Thanks

Here is the model if you want to check it out.

Very nice! Thanks.

 

OK, I've split the model in half again, but I still cannot get it to C/F/A. Either I'm an idiot, or there is something wrong with the model. I'm going with option 2... Could there be a setting in A:M that I might have changed that affects this command?

 

Here is the new half:

Project3d_Half1.prj

[KenH]

Your centre line wasn't exactly on the Y axis (look at the properties). The easiest way to do it is to select the centre line, set the pivot X to 0. Then scale in the X to 0. Here it is done.

Project3d_Half1.prj

[AMSpector]

Your centre line wasn't exactly on the Y axis (look at the properties). The easiest way to do it is to select the centre line, set the pivot X to 0. Then scale in the X to 0. Here it is done.

Well, aside from the pivot issue (which I missed), I was not group selecting my half-model, then shift-selecting a CP on the center spline. After reading robcat2075's reply to a previous C/F/A issue, I knew it was option 1 for me...

 

The half is replicating and attaching fine now, thanks for your help.

[Gerry]

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