my 4th head

[pancho simpson]

this is a redone version of my jane model from a couple of months ago, i had some free time during spring break so i decided to spend a few hrs redoing this model. the original pic of my friend is at

 

http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?act=A...e=post&id=65979

 

any crits would be greatly appreciated, thanx in adv.

 

Pancho oh and BTW, no she is not my girlfriend, she is merely my friend who is a girl!

[Tony]

That looks great, i cant critique cuz i cant yet successfully model a head but i know its hard work and what youve done looks sweet

[pancho simpson]

thanx Tony, although heads are tough work, A:M really makes the process smooth once u get the hang of it. I love A:M!

 

Oh and try colin freeman's tutes, they really helped me learn the workings of modeling.

[pancho simpson]

does anyone have any crits? pleeeease

[agep]

This looks like a nice splinejob!! keep us updated a bit long neck, but its probably unfinished i guess

[pancho simpson]

thanx, surprisingly, her neck IS that long. Weird huh? Anyway i'm following a roto but i'll certainly keep tweaking, thanx again

[JoshB]

Sorry didn't see this until just now.

 

If you plan to animate this head I think you might have a couple of problem areas.

 

Green--the eyebrow movement that most humans do with cause the hook you have there to become more noticeable. I would actually continue the spline around. I will only add a few more patches to your model and will give you more control of textures in the UV mapper (if you go that route). Also, it will reduce the size of the 5 pointers you have in the middle of the brow (red).

 

Red--when people furrow their brow it will have a tendency to fold over itself in a sort of sweeping motion. I would add a spline from the eye into the brow so it is easier to achieve this effect. Also, the hook you have at the top of the nose will, again, become more noticeable when/if your character does this.

 

Blue--I usually recommend 3 splines where the laugh lines are because when your character smile only having two may not give you the control of the shape you will need to keep the fold smooth.

 

Also, I know people with long necks so I know it is possible (Uma Thurman when she stands with her head straight up). However, it is the shoulder muscle which makes people seem to have shorter necks. Anatomically the chin hits this muscle at its connection to the neck--usually. But, noone is "anatomically" correct. I would like to see the rotoscope you are working from, because, it doesn't read as natural for this model.

 

J

[Mr. Jaqe]

Pancho oh and BTW, no she is not my girlfriend, she is merely my friend who is a girl!

Riiiiiiiiiiiiight, suuuuure, boys can be just friends with girls... Ahuh and Santa lives next door I agree with Stian, the neck is a a little long, but you already got that, so don't really have any more critiq to give. Of course, you're two ears short, but I guess you knew that too. Of course, Josh pointed out all the pro details, which I wouldn't have noticed in a billion years.

[pancho simpson]

thanx a bunch Josh that's really gonna save me some time later on . The rotos are on that link, however, i'll post a new WIP with the new mesh overlain on te rotos, thanx again. Mr.Jage, i didn't think that i needed to model ears since they're hard to AND Jane's hair covers her hair!

[Mr. Jaqe]

"A lesson in life, young grasshoppa, someone has always done what you are about to do before you and put it on the net for free, so go and cheat them for the cash and download it." -Master Tenji. Master Tenji is a wise man... I have no idea who he is, but he's right, William already put an ear out on the forum for bypassers to download, so I, like many others, did. Just look in the "Difficult Bodyparts" topic and you'll have a fully model'd ear.

[JoshB]

I would also recommend retaking your rotos if it isn't too difficult. When you take a rotoscope shot you want to get any non-essential information out of the way. Ask "Jane" (if that is her real name) to put her hair in a ponytail held in the middle of the back of her cranium. This will give you the curve of the skull and the nape of the neck without the hair being in the way. Also, when taking the rotos try to end them just below the collarbone.

 

J

[pancho simpson]

ummm..yes, her real name is Jane. And i'll do that next time Josh but i hesitate to ask her for a new pic, (mostly bc of the weird looks i've been getting lately)LOL! But i don't it'll detract from my model since i'll add hair later. Thanx for you commetns tho.

[JoshB]

Yeah whenever I ask a girl to model for me it takes about three hours to explain. When I'm out model hunting I find myself taking my sketchbook and mini-portfolio with me--just so I can say NO REALLY! You should see what happens when I ask guys .

 

When I take roto shots I usually get a bunch just for reference. I'll take the basics (the ones I use for the actual rotos in my 3D app)--hair slicked back (firmly attached to the head) or in a ponytail. Then I'll get a close-up of the ear. Then if I'm feeling particular sadistic various facial expressions. And, if I want to go semi-photoreal I'll take a front on, three-quarter, and side shot (again). Then in PS smooth them all together to make a texture map. Eventually I will get around to making a lot more stuff in AM, and stuff that I can post (my models are really shy) to show you what I mean.

 

Maybe I'll make myself. Hmmmmm....great....yet ANOTHER project.

 

J

[pancho simpson]

yep, when everyone else think ur creepy and won't give u personal pix u can alwas count on ur self (usually, LOL) man,jane was actually my 3rd try, my 1st two friends were all like oh i'm not photogenic BUT they are!!! sigh!

[Mr. Jaqe]

Modeling yourself is... kinda spooky and you loose a lot of self confidence. I tried once, but I kep thinking "is my nose really that big?", "dang, I need a haircut..." and "oookaaaay, no more candy for you, mr!".

 

...

 

...

 

...

 

Ok, so I was just kidding. I tried modeling myself once though, but let's just say that holding your camera with your right hand while holding back your hair with your left ain't exactly the ideal way of taking rotos.

[pancho simpson]

Modeling yourself is... kinda spooky and you loose a lot of self confidence. I tried once, but I kep thinking "is my nose really that big?", "dang, I need a haircut..." and "oookaaaay, no more candy for you, mr!".

amen to that! As humans, we're all naturally self confident and more demanding of ourselves and our bodies than we are of other people's (usually). Wow, from modeling to human nature, ya know i could never talk about this w/ my friends at school!

[Mr. Jaqe]

ya know i could never talk about this w/ my friends at school! 

Hear, hear! "Joakim, why are you so tired?" "I was modeling last night and I had a hard time quitting." "Are you adicted on play doh?" "No foo', I mean ANIMATION modeling!" "oh... so how's the work comming?" "Well, Im having some problems getting the person to look more atamocal... atomaca... atama... human looking." "ah... ok.... .... well..." And the days goes by

[pancho simpson]

see, i get the -Oh my god, how do u have time to do ur animation thingy and still have a better GPA than me?- ughh, or the -hey would that job pay enough for you when ur older?- aghhhh

[Mr. Jaqe]

I generally find that I don't really HAVE the time to spend time with AM, but my avg. grade is still alot higher than others Man, people hate me... I barely do schoolwork and still get good grades. Sheesh, Im lazy as heck, that may be why I don't get so much time with AM. Nah, must be school

 

But hey, so I don't wander totally off topic, any updates on that Jane of yours?

[pancho simpson]

seriously! i mean i just can't not get that 4.166666 Gpa, i can't, it'd destroy y ego but people also hate me bc i jsut get things very quickly, however, i haven't gotten as much couch time as i would like seeing as how i'm in the IB program (looks good on college app but nearly kills u in High school)

[JoshB]

I'm just going to throw myself into this a little bit further.

 

I've been doing the college trip for about 3 years now. Deans list every quarter yadda yadda. Being an art major in college sucks. It's a time sucking vortex of doom. For instance, last quarter I was taking sculpture, woodcarving, and Western Civilization. So, I had to make 3 sculptures in plaster. Three sculptures in wood (one of which had a minimum scale of 3X4X5--and I drive an Elantra--the logistics on that sucked)--in a little over 8 weeks. And, I had to be able to keep in tact the last 4000 years of western civilization. Now, add to that I'm currently working on my Zero project in AM--when I get a nice splash render done I'll post it. I've decided to practice my human modeling skills by doing some stills. Which in turn is going to aid me in making my Hades and Persephone project. Now I'm in painting (which I hate to paint to begin with) we have in class assignments and a homework painting due every week. And, photo II in which each assignment must have four prints to be critiqued of which there are three assignments. And, I'm taking Greek and Roman Culture--so again last 4000 years of man shoved into my memory banks. Oh did I mention I work as well--a little over 23 hours a week. The two studios classes are 3.5 hours each twice a week and the culture class is another 2 twice a week. Now throw into the fire--I love to help/teach people--so me and this forum are REAL good friends. So, my most hated question of all time from the people I meet.

 

So, what do you do in your spare time?

 

J

[pancho simpson]

ha! thanks josh, u sure as hell amde me feel better about my life!

[Mr. Jaqe]

I'm just going to throw myself into this a little bit further.

 

I've been doing the college trip for about 3 years now. Deans list every quarter yadda yadda. Being an art major in college sucks. It's a time sucking vortex of doom. For instance, last quarter I was taking sculpture, woodcarving, and Western Civilization. So, I had to make 3 sculptures in plaster. Three sculptures in wood (one of which had a minimum scale of 3X4X5--and I drive an Elantra--the logistics on that sucked)--in a little over 8 weeks. And, I had to be able to keep in tact the last 4000 years of western civilization. Now, add to that I'm currently working on my Zero project in AM--when I get a nice splash render done I'll post it. I've decided to practice my human modeling skills by doing some stills. Which in turn is going to aid me in making my Hades and Persephone project. Now I'm in painting (which I hate to paint to begin with) we have in class assignments and a homework painting due every week. And, photo II in which each assignment must have four prints to be critiqued of which there are three assignments. And, I'm taking Greek and Roman Culture--so again last 4000 years of man shoved into my memory banks. Oh did I mention I work as well--a little over 23 hours a week. The two studios classes are 3.5 hours each twice a week and the culture class is another 2 twice a week. Now throw into the fire--I love to help/teach people--so me and this forum are REAL good friends. So, my most hated question of all time from the people I meet.

 

So, what do you do in your spare time?

 

J

 

I know Im tired... I know Im VERY tired... I know Im overtired... Actually, Im just very shi** feeling atm, but... HAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAH... ... hihihiiiih... good one. I actually fell off my chair, that happends a lot arround 4-5 AM. And I got two tests tomorrow... why ain't I in bed? because I love this forum, the people in it and lastly, I love AM. I have a vauge feeling of how you have it, I know two people taking... well, they take just about what you take and they also do art as major. Hm... coincidence? I think NOT! This is a job foooor... not me! Anyways, school takes time, yes, but think of all the spare time you'll get when you grow up! When you turn 66 you don't have to work any more! : P

[JoshB]

WAAAAAAIIIIITTTTT!!!!!

 

Almost forgot--and, I'm rebuilding my website to include some more of my digitally altered photography.

 

There I think that's it...

 

Maybe...

 

Possibly...

 

...

 

J

[Mr. Jaqe]

"And in recent new: we're turning back to the R&R, so let's stop whining and let's see some more of Jane!" had to do a news-break, I want to see more of Jane! (now that sounded kinda... well... umm... I'll just... go take my hamster out of the oven).

[Newbert_Zero]

id like to see an update. its looking good so far.

[pancho simpson]

hey what's goin' on with the forums, it's really quirky on my end, i get sql errors!!!! i have the wires but i can't post them. I only got here by hitting the history button on IE!!!

[pancho simpson]

ok so i can fast reply but that's about it! HELP!!!!

[pancho simpson]

testing...

[Dhar]

Yeah, I got the error thing too, which I took as a sign to animate instead of vegitate in front of the forum screen.

 

Hey, great head modeling, keep it up!

[.:shortdog:.]

"And in recent new: we're turning back to the R&R, so let's stop whining and let's see some more of Jane!" had to do a news-break, I want to see more of Jane! (now that sounded kinda... well... umm... I'll just... go take my hamster out of the oven).

 

uber-lol!

[pancho simpson]

"And in recent new: we're turning back to the R&R, so let's stop whining and let's see some more of Jane!" had to do a news-break, I want to see more of Jane! (now that sounded kinda... well... umm... I'll just... go take my hamster out of the oven).

ok, so i finally got some time to edit my jane model as per josh´s suggestions, i could not however add the 3 laugh lines while keeping correct and smooth splines, i´ll work on this later. Anyway, here´s a jane wire with rotoscope and fixed brow. Hey, how come the stitch tool gives me weird artifacts when i shift cps around, i mean it´s great for adding splines while maintaining curvature but it´s pretty weak for post editing.

 

Oh and i almost forgot, don´t tell Mr. Jaqe that i posted this, his little comment unnerved me a bit,

[Mr. Jaqe]

She's pretty. Asked her out yet? I do have some critiq though. Her neck is too long, she doesn't really have that long a neck and her forehead is a little lower. You followed the hair instead of her scalp. That's about it, The End.

 

EDIT: btw, I'm cranky because Im tired

[pancho simpson]

She's pretty. Asked her out yet? I do have some critiq though. Her neck is too long, she doesn't really have that long a neck and her forehead is a little lower.

yeah, um i have a thing about going out with some one that i know has the ability to beat me up (hell it's true). Oh and do you mean her brow is lower on her or my model? Thanx fro the crits.

 

PS. see, i heard u rant about being called mr. jage so i typed mr. jaqe, is that right?

[Mr. Jaqe]

Oh and do you mean her brow is lower on her or my model?

Yes, her whole forehead is kinda pushed up half a centimeter or maaaaybe one.

 

PS. see, i heard u rant about being called mr. jage so i typed mr. jaqe, is that right?

No biggie, I only comment it from time to time. I personally copy/paste names Im unsure about.

[pancho simpson]

yep, i see what you mean about the neck now

[pancho simpson]

oh and does anyone have any hair tips 'cause i've tried it and it was challenging to say the least. (colin freeman's skull cap method and v11 hair) It's been really hard to style her hair.

[JoshB]

Apologize to Jane for me--I drew on her face. And, just because she can beat you up--doesn't mean she will--just play nice. Anyway:

 

The green line is where your first complete Eye Spline ring should be. Image she is wearing goggles and the outermost ring should be where her eyebrows are. I think that's what Jage was saying.

 

The blue line is where I'm estimating her neck and shoulders should be. Given where her left shoulder is. How it is angled. The color shift in the hair. And, the fact she's a girl. Also, given the curvy natuve of her face it would seem that her neck might be slightly thicker than what you have.

 

Red: The chin is not recessed far enough. Which leads me to believe that the nape of the neck is not far enough back. This means you will need to increase the mesh density in the front part of the neck. Which could also prove beneficial as it will decrease the size of the five point patches connecting the skull to the neck.

 

Good job lining them up though. And, the shots themselves are wonderful. Good posture. Straght. Just wish that hair wasn't there.

 

As for the hair question--I have no idea. Still playing around with that concept.

 

J

 

edit: helps to put the right picture in don't it?

[pancho simpson]

thax again or the comments jos ad mr.jaqe, and yeah, i was also surprised at how well jane understood what i wanted in terms of a roto.i'll fix the nck 2day seing as how i've got very little hw thi weekend and i won goin to my friend's party. Bye!

[williamgaylord]

Nice work! Especially if you make the adjustments suggested so far.

 

If you need ears, I've made two models available...one regular, one pointy. If you want to try making your own, I've also posted a picture of a sample mesh you can use as a template.

 

Ears

 

Bill Gaylord

[pancho simpson]

thanx will, i won't do ears (hair'll cover 'em) ut i have downloaded ur mesh template already for future ref.