itsjustme

As a disclaimer, I am not a representative for Hash, just a user of AM. Here is the "New Users" page that might answer questions that I don't. There is the ability to use Dope Sheets that you can see in the video tutorial called "Can You Say That" located on this page. Personally, I think doing the lip sync by hand is faster and better. The Squetch Rig has a set of controllers called FACE that are based on "visemes", which is outlined in the book Stop Staring by Jason Osipa (very good book). There is an example rigged character called "Squetchy Sam" on the Wiki page for the rig that you can download and use. This year it came with a physical version of the Technical Reference, there is an online version of The Art of Animation Master that has a hard copy of the content of the video tutorials I mentioned, there's these forums (if you have a question, you should get an answer relatively quickly), there are the Tech Talks, here is a pretty extensive list of tutorials, there is the beginnings of an AM Features Wiki and a lot of other links you'll find throughout these forums. That would be better answered by a Hash representative. 3DPainter There is presently a community project that is a feature length film...TWO (TinWoodman of Oz). That depends on the individual...how easy is it to draw? AM can import objects from other software, but only as props or converted to the AM model file. If it is converted, you would have to do a lot of cleaning up. AM is not a polygon-based application...the packages you list are polygon-based, so it's harder to go from or to them from AM. I hope that was helpful...you didn't need to post your questions more than once though.

I'm the same as always, Rusty...irritating, mostly.

So, to answer your original question, you are better off going back to the installation action. Trying to go into bones mode and adjusting the bones manually can be very time consuming and errors could be made. Mark is right. Sorry about the side trip on my part.

I'll take a look at it late tonight, Rusty.

Using a number like "1.0" turned out to be more confusing than using the date when I was initially working on the rig. What I've been doing is only releasing what I think is a stable version and naming it using the date is was released. If there are problems with that release, I try to correct them as quickly as possible and use the date the fix is released in the name to differentiate it from the previous problem version. With so many updates, you would get numbers like "1.04.56" or something else pretty crazy. I don't want to do a feature freeze because I want the new capabilities available as soon as possible...it also makes it easier for me to manage with all of the updates released, in case someone adds or modifies something and wants to get it put in (if we're all working from the same base, it makes it much easier). As for the rig being stable...there are at least two updates being worked on at the moment. The current version is stable (as far as I know), but there are more upgrades possible (some you asked about, Rusty). Sorry if that's what happened, Rusty...this stuff is loosely related to your original question, it's an attempt to answer/solve it. A smart move, that's what you should do. Yikes! Why would ever want to do that???? Its the same rig, the same model...???? It was the first step in the experiment. If there are changes to the rig, this method could possibly allow the plugin to adjust the weighting to compensate for changes in the geometry bones. Sorry if this became a hijack of your thread, Rusty. Discussions and experiments like these are sometimes necessary to devise a better mouse trap...I'll go back to what I was working on before this started.

Okay, I figured I should post the results of my experiments with Steffen Gross' Transfer_AW plugin in case anyone else wants to try some things. What I was trying to do was to transfer the weighting from a rigged model to an unrigged version of the same model. I kept getting some strange weighting that I couldn't explain. Things like a point with the weighting between three bones being, for example, 200, -100, -100...which was strange. The fix was silly and obvious (aren't they always), it was that both the "lo-res" and "hi-res" geometry were the same exact size. The assumption made by the plugin is that they aren't exactly the same size because the "lo-res" version would normally be made using fewer splines...and I'm not doing that here. Here's what I did in steps: 1. First, I opened Squetchy Sam, which is already rigged, made a group that contained the entire character (excluding the FACE interface) and named it "lo-res". Then, I saved that version of the model with "lo-res" in the name. 2. I kept that version of Sam open, changed the "lo-res" group name to "hi-res", deleted all of the Poses, Pose sliders, Smartskins (the Smartskins should probably be left in place, I deleted them for this test though), bones and geometry for the FACE controls and saved this as a new model named "hi-res". 3. I then closed that Project to clear everything out, opened the "lo-res" version of the model, selected the "lo-res" group and scaled the mesh using the "Properties" menu to 101% on the 'X', 'Y' and 'Z' axes. 4. At this point, I imported the "hi-res" unrigged version of Sam, right mouse clicked on the name of the model in the PWS, selected "Plug-ins/Wizards/Transfer_AW", set the "Lores cp's for each hires cp" to "1", the "Smooth with hires cp's" to "1" and the "Smooth factor" to "0" and hit "OK". 5. To finish up, select the "lo-res" group, delete the associated mesh and extra groups and save the model out under a new name. This did a pretty good job of getting things into the general ballpark except for the really tight places, like between the fingers near the base and some stuff in the face. There are things that would make it better, like using "exclusion" groups...which I didn't do for this test. To make an exclusion group, you wait until you have the "hi-res" model imported, make a group that includes both the "lo-res" and "hi-res" versions of the model (like selecting the right foot for both at the same time) and name the group with "exclusion" in it's name...like "right_leg exclusion". This may or may not get used for situations like this, but it helped me understand how the plugin works...which could help in a number of other situations. That's it for my play time today.

I've had that happen occasionally, Rusty. When it does happen, I select the bone and change the rotation values to "0"...that usually makes the compensate settings change. It's the same thing, done backwards to the way it is normally done. If the compensates change during the movement of the slider, you will get that movement when moving the slider when animating, so it's not what you want. Hope that helps.

You are tireless, Mark! Thanks for all of your (constant) hard work!

'It' being the reset compensate step. It will determine how much effort I put into my invention for myself. As far as all the ideas flying back and forth, all the ones I can get my head around (most) sound great. Starting with a weighted template you can 'stamp' on your model (if you want) is a great idea! The text editor find/replace is unfortunate -- I don't mind, do it all the time but, it's borderline for some users. It knocks me down that Windows doesn't come with something like grep or awk that will process/find/replace text! Yeah I'm an old UNIX dude. Cheers, Rusty I can't give you a definitive answer on the automating of the resetting of compensates, Rusty. I know that there were two different efforts toward that goal, but their status is unknown to me. I'm not a programmer (and don't want to be), or I would make the attempt myself. Both the efforts I heard about were being done in the spare time that those people had, so, there is no promise when or if it will ever get done. You know the saying (I assume), "You can have it fast, cheap or good...pick two". I don't have a problem waiting for "cheap and good".

Sure, it's possible...I haven't tried it, but I'm sure it's possible with identical meshes.

Falloff would work too...it may be the best way to go. I don't think the spline layout has to be the same for the proxy method, at least not from what I can tell. I haven't done enough experiments yet to determine how well it would work. The documentation I read was promising though. I know that Transfer_AW can designate groups as non-bending, for something that is supposed to be made of metal for instance, or a large group of scales or whatever...if I remember correctly, there's a way to do that with falloff as well though.

The list is pretty long, lots of people were and still are involved. I made a list in the original "Squetchy Thom" thread that thanked everyone that I could think of up to that point. Bullheaded I've been called...and a lot of other things not safe for television. Thanks for tipping the scale the other way a little, Paul.

I guess this wouldn't be an option? To me, this makes the most sense. A posable geometry bone rig can be used to install the bones (these bones would have the parenting name in them to reparent into the control rig). After exporting the model, you would assign cps, weight and smartskin. After all that is done, you save a copy in a safe place for future updates. Now you open a copy of this model and import the control installation rig, open a new action and turn on the installation constraints pose and export. Reopen the model and run the install rig plug-in to reparent the rig. You still have a copy of the model with the geometry bones only (with cps assigned and weighted already), if there are new updates to the rig or you want to reposition the geometry bones, you can just import the control installation rig and turn on the installation pose in an action. If the recompensating process becomes a thing of the past, this would be quite easy. Absolutely, I wouldn't rule anything out. It makes a lot of sense, bordering on genius really. To add to that, if there were a lo-res proxy included with the geometry bones installation, the Transfer_AW plugin could make roughing them in a lot faster the first time through. Sorry I neglected to respond to that idea, Mark...in gathering my thoughts, things got jumbled a little in my head and it shook loose. I'll have to get something to strap my head together...there's a lot of junk rattling around in there.

Okay, here's what I think about future installations...Transfer_AW is going to be a big help. First, I'm working under the assumption that the compensates will be automatically reset eventually...I don't know how far along that is in development. So, that is one of the time consuming things that will (hopefully) disappear. Second, to speed up the weighting, all that is needed is a generic weighted model to use as a lo-res proxy...I can modify Squetchy Sam for that purpose. Then, if that modified Sam is part of the installation rigs, the proxy will be approximately in the right position on the character you're rigging to do a decent job of transferring the weighting. After running the InstallRig plugin and the resetting of compensates (which, eventually will be automated, I hope), you would run the Transfer_AW plugin to rough-in the weighting. For the roughing-in, I would only do the broad strokes, leaving out the face weighting since that is going to be more specific. For Rusty's present problem, there's going to have to be a little more tweaking. Here's what I think might work. Instead of deleting all of the bones from the originally weighted model, select the mesh, copy it and paste it with bones into the new model. That will bring all of the "geom" bones with it and rename them with a "2" on the end. Run the "Transfer_AW" plugin, delete the old mesh, delete all of the "geom2" bones, save the model and close AM. Then, open the model in a text editor and do a "search and replace" to change all "geom2" references to "geom" and re-save the file. It makes sense in my head, but I haven't tried it. Mark's suggestion might be the way to go for when there is a rig update though: @Paul: But then it would cost money, wouldn't it? Since it's a community designed rig, I don't think it would be right to charge anything for it. If someone makes a program that eases installation and sells that, then that would be fine, but the rig itself can't really be sold...in my mind, at least. At this point, it is still harder to install than TSM, absolutely true. Eventually, it might get that easy, but it takes time...especially for free. It started off extremely difficult to install, is now moderately difficult (in my mind) and will eventually (with any luck) become easy enough for a new user...at least that's the goal. LOL! Yes, that happens when trying to be all things to all people...just trying to make sure that the things the rig can't do is as few as possible. I realize it is off-putting to some people...nothing is stopping anyone from stripping out the things they feel they don't need, using another rig or making their own rig. I have isolated and stripped out sections when it has been requested and maintain a separate standalone version of the FACE controllers along with a few add-ons that could be adapted to any rig if necessary. I'm like you, Rusty...I want all of those toys in a rig I'm using. I think that covers everything...if I missed something, let me know.

David, Hey, I can put a Rubik's Cube together in under 60 seconds (great party trick) but right now I'm feeling a bit stupid here. I've read all the documentation on Transfer_AW and WeightMover and... I do not see how this can be done. You must see some creative avenue or approach that I don't. I see a plug-in that uses 2 sets of mesh overlaid in one model with one rig and it transfers the assignments of one mesh to the rig to the other mesh. How would you use this to transfer old model (the mesh, rig and assignments) to a new new model (the mesh and a new rig)? Hey, I'm hoping to hear myself say "Wow! I didn't think of that!". Cheers, Rusty Now you did it, Rusty ....I went and started experimenting with this. I haven't gotten it to work 100% yet, but, I'm pretty sure it can happen. I'll need another evening of messing with it to see if I can get past the problem I'm having at this point...I've run out of play time for today. What I did was to take Squetchy Sam, strip out the Poses, bones and Smartskins, made some "hi-res" named groups and saved this as a "hi-res" version of the model. I then re-opened Squetchy Sam and made the same named groups, but with "lo-res" in there instead and saved that out as the "lo-res" version of the model. Then, I opened the "lo-res" model, imported the "hi-res" model and ran the "Transfer_AW" plugin with all the settings set to "1". After the plugin ran, the CP's looked strange (I think that's normal), so I saved the model with "combined" in the name, closed AM, re-opened AM and reloaded the "combined" model. It appeared to assign the correct bones for the most part, but I got some strange percentages on this initial attempt. I'll have to do some more experiments to figure out how to correct them. I'll pick it up again tomorrow and let you know if I find out what I've been doing wrong. Hope that helps, Rusty.

I haven't had to SmartSkin any of those areas with this rig...does the shrinking you're referring to show up in Squetchy Sam, Ken? I know the kind of shrinking you mean, but I'm pretty sure it can be cured with weighting (and I don't think Sam has the problem, if I'm remembering correctly). If we need more fan bones, they can be added pretty easily. You can paint yourself into a corner with SmartSkinning if you're not careful. The legs could benefit from some muscle contraction like the biceps...that could help the knees if there is a shrinking problem. It's one of the things on my list when I get time. This week I've been trying to make the bones rig for the face easier to install...still a few more things to do on that. If you do end up SmartSkinning, put the limb you're working on in FK and use the control rig to move it like Mark suggested (unhiding the "geom" bones using the Pose). Hope that helps.

Like the weave of the fabric? You can make a simple gray scale image for that (I just smear noise using a directional blur and make it seamless, I'll attach an example)...right mouse click on a group and add the image to it, then adjust the number of repeats of the pattern, set it to seamless and change the type to a bump, displacement or whatever else it needs. For standard decaling, Rusty Williamson has a tutorial here and Will Sutton has a tutorial here. Then there is 3DPainter. Hope that helps. --------------------------- EDIT --------------------------- Jim Talbot also has some texturing tutorials here (his site had changed since the last time I checked...fixed now).

Since there isn't a lo-res proxy, the CP Weighting transfer would be 1:1...try setting the "lores CP's for each hires CP" to "1", then set the "smoothing" and number of passes as low as it will go ("0" if it will allow it). It makes sense in my head, but I haven't tried it. If I get some time I'll do an experiment. Hope that helps, Rusty.

The easiest way to fix it would be to go back to your saved Action and fix it there, then finish off the installation. If you are unable to do that, then you would have to unhide all the bones in the model in order to move things around and then reset all of your compensates. You can do it either way, but the one that has the least amount of possible problems is going back to the installation Action. Hope that helps, Rusty.

That's a lot better, Mark! Very nice ear. Something I didn't notice before is that the lower lip isn't rounded, it's kind of a cliff...a little nudging things around would fix it (if you decided to, it might be a deliberate design choice...if so, ignore me).

Forty dollars would be in the range of the average good tutorial's price...I've paid thirty and fifty dollars before. My opinion is that the cheaper you make it, the more you will sell, so that would make your profit about the same as if you sold it for more. If you can make it about the amount that a person would have on them in any given day, it could be an "impulse buy". ------------------- EDIT ------------------- To save yourself some overhead, you could make it a download or you could use the Data CD that you can sell on Cafe Press.

Nice, Michael!

I've got a few questions, but no definitive answer at this point. First, what rig are you using? Second, did you turn on a Pose inside another Pose or move some control bones within a Pose? If that is the case, you would have to hunt for that and get rid of it. Third, are your targets in the right places for the legs, arms, spine, etc? Fourth, are there any compensates that you forgot to reset? At this point, it could be any of those reasons, several others or a combination of all of them. Without seeing the rig, it's harder to tell. Hope that helps.

You can unhide all of the bones in the model by holding down the shift key and unhiding the topmost bone in the hierarchy, then select each bone in the thumbs one at a time and set the rotation or you could uhide them the same way, delete all of the thumb bones, drag in the thumb bones from the installation model (not the Posable version), position them and run the InstallRig plugin or you could use the saved Action from when you initially installed the rig using the Posable installation, make the thumb adjustments and then run the InstallRig plugin and re-finish the installation from there. Hope that helps, Ken. -------------------- EDIT -------------------- Or, you could use the same Action you saved from the initial install of the Posable installation, re-position the thumbs, export it as if you were doing a typical installation (but don't run the InstallRig plugin yet), unhide all of the bones in the installation with the messed up thumbs, delete all of the thumb bones, drag in the thumb bones from the corrected installation and then run the InstallRig plugin. Make sense?

I agree, the top one is better. Nice modeling, Mark! The only crit from me would be the ear attachment...it looks stuck on there instead of being part of the head mesh.