Electric Guitar (strat)

[zacktaich]

Ok, added the tuning keys (well, the back part).

 

 

Tell me what you think. I'm over 5000 patches at this point. Still very little lagging.

 

 

Zack

[zacktaich]

Ok, tuning keys done. The responses have really died here. That's ok.

 

I plan to have this all finished before I leave on Friday (surfacing and all).

 

 

 

Zack

[mtpeak2]

It looks great Zach. Looking forward to seeing it all textured. And I wish I got that much response to the things I've posted.

[zacktaich]

It looks great Zach. Looking forward to seeing it all textured. And I wish I got that much response to the things I've posted. 

 

Thanks, I think I've posted 95% of what's here .

 

Ok, here is a 360 degree turnaround of the model. Critique away.

 

Zack

guitar.zip

[zacktaich]

OK, I talked to Dan Shimmyo, resident expert on modeling and guitars, and he helped me to find some problems with the proportions (But not before questioning whether I had a girlie man's guitar and dealing with my inability to understand what he was saying, the sacrifices we make for perfection... ).

 

The basic Idea was that I needed to grab out a ruler and see that my model was not thick enough. So here I present you a chunkier, more natural Strat.

 

Questions, comments welcome. Please

 

Zack

 

(attachment: guitar00.mov)

guitar00.zip

[zacktaich]

Except for some little plates on the back, modeling for the guitar is finished. I even added some material to the headstock.

 

Questions, comments, critiques welcomed.

 

Zack

 

5,904 patches. With the plates it should be just over 6000 in the end.

[robcat2075]

That's quite spiffy looking!

 

Now... how about a guy to play it?

[mediaho]

Except for some little plates on the back, modeling for the guitar is finished. I even added some material to the headstock.

 

Questions, comments, critiques welcomed.

 

Zack

 

5,904 patches. With the plates it should be just over 6000 in the end.

Awesome model! Just a few nit-picky observations:

 

* There are 3 pickups but no pickup selector switch!

* The strings just disappear at the tuning pegs. There's usually some left over, sticking out.

* The pick guard on the shorter "horn" (on the body) should be a little sharper and closer to the actual body shape

* In fact, both "horns" should be a little pointier, I think.

* I can't see in the animation if the body has that slope by where the (right-handed player's) right elbow would be.

* It's very clean! I like my guit-fiddles to be road-worn.

 

Great job!

[zacktaich]

* There are 3 pickups but no pickup selector switch!

Heh, I noticed this after I modeled the pickguard, and I didn't know how exactly to cut the whole. I considered using booleans, although I hear they're a big render hit. For now I think I'll just make it black, and model the selector switch just to go through it.

 

* The strings just disappear at the tuning pegs. There's usually some left over, sticking out.

 

Yup, I just layed down the strings to check my placement and such. They will be wrapped around a few times then have about 1-2 inches hanging out.

 

* The pick guard on the shorter "horn" (on the body) should be a little sharper and closer to the actual body shape

* In fact, both "horns" should be a little pointier, I think.

Yup, been struggling with this recently. Splines do not make it easy... Rest assured I will continue to tweak this. Good eyes .

 

* I can't see in the animation if the body has that slope by where the (right-handed player's) right elbow would be.

 

That's right! I completely left that out. well I don't think it's impossible to fix, in fact, it might be quite easy.

 

edit: I was very lucky in that the topology was laid out in a way that made it a very quick fix. Consider it done.

 

Thanks.

 

Zack

 

ps the headstock material is really bothering me. I'm moving on to surfacing now.

[zacktaich]

That's quite spiffy looking!

 

Now... how about a guy to play it?

 

Thanks! Well unfortunately, modeling a human to play would get in the way of modeling the Ferrari Enzo..

 

just kidding.

 

It will probably be a low run free model for a while. So basically people will have to contact me by email to get it. It keeps it from being put uncredited in peoples work. Maybe then someone will do the animation for it

 

Zack

[Guest mrsl13]

Looks super cool....I almost asked for a movie of the strat then noticed your other posts........dare I ask for a larger view in jpg? not sure how large the forum will alow though.

Now I wish I hadn't sold mine...

 

Mike

[zacktaich]

Looks super cool....I almost asked for a movie of the strat then noticed your other posts........dare I ask for a larger view in jpg? not sure how large the forum will alow though.

Now I wish I hadn't sold mine...

 

Mike

 

Thanks.

 

653*1280 too small for you, eh?

 

I'll see what I can do.

 

Zack

[mediaho]

It will probably be a low run free model for a while. So basically people will have to contact me by email to get it. It keeps it from being put uncredited in peoples work. Maybe then someone will do the animation for it

That would be awesome. Something for my Crow model to play!

[Guest mrsl13]

Well guess what, I went back to look at your pics and noticed that when I leave my curser over the image there is this arrowed box in the lower right hand corner that if clicked expanded the image...so never mind on the larger pic..LOL

 

Still looks so cool small or larger image..

 

Mike

[zacktaich]

Well guess what, I went back to look at your pics and noticed that when I leave my curser over the image there is this arrowed box in the lower right hand corner that if clicked expanded the image...so never mind on the larger pic..LOL

 

Still looks so cool small or larger image..

 

Mike

 

This is why I hate IE. Mozilla Firefox handles it much better. If you click once on the shrunken image it expands, if you click it again it shrinks. Very nice.

 

On another forum, whose name I cannot mention, I was told about problems with the textures. Joe W said that I would basically have to scratch the materials if I wanted to take it to the next step. I want to take the next step with this model, so I'm going to give it my best. Unfortunately I know next to nothing about texturing, especially when it comes to mechanical stuff, I think I could handle organic texturing much better .

 

I think I'm going to keep the material on the neck, it's very similar to the one I have. More similar than anything I could ever do in photoshop. But the headstock has got to go. I'm going to apply an ambience map to everything reflective.

 

So... my first question is, how do you apply an environment map? And do I then have to make the objects reflective? or is it handled automatically?

[zacktaich]

HOLY SHNIKEYS!!!

 

I never noticed how much good lighting could do... (oh, I modeled the scene around it too, super basic)

[shaunf]

Very nice work Zack! Thats an elegant looking guitar!

[zacktaich]

Very nice work Zack! Thats an elegant looking guitar!

 

Thanks, now for my own notes (and taken from previous commentors):

 

-the tuning keys should be turned

-the floor is a wee bit reflective

-judging by the reflections, the guitar doesn't quite hit the ground

-the strings will come out the top a bit more

-material on headstock will be added

-wall is flat, needs bump map to simulate, you know... that bumpy stuff

-environment map on body needs to be less opaque

-decals needed on tone and volume knobs

-still no pickup selector, sorry mediaho!

 

Anything I missed?

 

Zack

[zacktaich]

I fixed a few things:

 

-the floor is a wee bit reflective

Changed the settings here a bit

 

-the tuning keys should be turned

bingo.

 

-environment map on body needs to be less opaque

Yup.

 

-judging by the reflections, the guitar doesn't quite hit the ground

It does now.

 

-the strings will come out the top a bit more

Played around with this for a while, couldn't get it to work so I just took it back off. I'll work on it again later.

 

 

Zack

[mtpeak2]

It's looking great Zach. The one thing that bothers me most is the dark stripes in the floor. It reminds me of an outdoor deck.

[HeadlessBill]

Looks really, really good. Far better than my guitar. My only comment is that it needs a strap.

 

I like the final image. The room it's in looks a little stark. Maybe bits of other guitar paraphenalia added to complete the composition.

[zacktaich]

It's looking great Zach. The one thing that bothers me most is the dark stripes in the floor. It reminds me of an outdoor deck.

Yeah, this bothered me a bit too. I have now some more wood choices, but until then I tried squeezing it down a bit and it wasn't bad.

 

Looks really, really good. Far better than my guitar. My only comment is that it needs a strap. 

 

Thanks, I don't know about that though.... Your guitar is really high quality. It does need a strap, that's right. Well that's now added to my long to-do list (some of those to-do's will probably be never done...).

 

I like the final image. The room it's in looks a little stark. Maybe bits of other guitar paraphenalia added to complete the composition.

 

Thanks. I agree. Any ideas of what should be added? I like it a little bit stark, but it could definitely use something.

Some Ideas:

 

An Amp

A pick (possibly in between the strings)

A strap

Some Music

Head phones

Whammy bar, just laying around

A cord

 

Zack

[Pengy]

Great job Zack,it's always interesting to see the way a project progresses. As far as adding things what to you have around your own guitar?

[tobinjim]

Good looking guitar, Zack! Perhaps a little definition of wood grain would give a touch of realism.

 

But I do have to say it looks so perfect I'd expect to see those little styrofoam balls adhering due to static electricity... it obviously just came out of the packaging. So alongside the amp, through in the box, plastic wrap, styrofoam and the white gloves you wore unpacking it to keep finger prints off!

 

That way you can lay the strap on the floor because "some assembly required"

[mediaho]

Looking awesome! Every time I see it I have to pick up my guitar and play. There are a couple things I can't see from the image. Could you post an arcticPigs version? That's much better than a 360 Quicktime.

[zacktaich]

Great job Zack,it's always interesting to see the way a project progresses. As far as adding things what to you have around your own guitar?

A pop quiz! And I'm so unprepared... Well right this moment it's near my monitor, keyboard, mouse, and speakers, but somehow I don't think that's fitting for this piece.

 

Usually I have it on a stand (I don't think I'm gonna model that) and it's near to a practice amp, a few miscellaneous cords, a few pics, extra string packets, an electric tuner with it's battery hanging out (it's one of those batteries that has the little outside connector wires..), my strap, a capo (mainly used on my acoustic, an ovation 'celebrity'), and the least used item of them all: the pitch pipe.

 

Good looking guitar, Zack! Perhaps a little definition of wood grain would give a touch of realism.

 

Do you think applying the decals as bump maps would give the definition you're looking for? I think it would help place the specular highlights properly.

 

Looking awesome! Every time I see it I have to pick up my guitar and play. There are a couple things I can't see from the image. Could you post an arcticPigs version? That's much better than a 360 Quicktime.

 

I'll see what I can do. I had trouble installing the viewer, and I couldn't see any of the files, even after the fifth time viewing, so I never installed the plug in. But maybe I'll make one even if I can't see it.

 

What exactly would you like to see more of, if you told me I could maybe make a few images or some sort of turnaround to illustrate whatever you would like to see.

 

 

I was having trouble with antialising, even after 36 passes(!) my problem was finally fixed when I learned to set blur to 0, although I still had to do a little shrinking in post.

[mooncaine]

Well, I'm back after a long hiatus, and what do I find on my first day back in the forums but this superb modeling of a Strat, the very thing that had been driving me crazy off & on for over a year. You should see my poor attempts to get a good model of a Strat or Tele body.

 

Hoby Jeebus, what a great job you've done! You're inspiring me at just the right moment -- as I begin to find time to once again work on my own art and on my own short.

 

My humble offer of assistance:

 

Here's a link to some nice pics of guitars that have been intentionally worn and stained to look like vintage guitars -- I think it might be a great reference site for pics of good wear and stains. Hope it helps in some small way. They call this kind of work 'relicing', from the word 'relic', but it looks weird the way they spell it -- you'd think it rhymes with 'icing' but instead it rhymes with 'picking'.

 

Also, if you care, I have a book all about how to properly date a Stratocaster [awright, Vern, no wise cracks outta you, mister]. It has all the info on what year of Strat has what size of dots on the fingerboard, what kind of decal, etc. If you need scans from it or references from it, I'll be glad to help if I can. PM me if so.

 

James Poulakos

[zacktaich]

Well, I'm back after a long hiatus, and what do I find on my first day back in the forums but this superb modeling of a Strat, the very thing that had been driving me crazy off & on for over a year. You should see my poor attempts to get a good model of a Strat or Tele body.

 

Hoby Jeebus, what a great job you've done! You're inspiring me at just the right moment -- as I begin to find time to once again work on my own art and on my own short.

Thanks! I look forward to hearing more about this short.

 

 

 

My humble offer of assistance:

 

Here's a link to some nice pics of guitars that have been intentionally worn and stained to look like vintage guitars -- I think it might be a great reference site for pics of good wear and stains. Hope it helps in some small way. They call this kind of work 'relicing', from the word 'relic', but it looks weird the way they spell it -- you'd think it rhymes with 'icing' but instead it rhymes with 'picking'.

 

Also, if you care, I have a book all about how to properly date a Stratocaster [awright, Vern, no wise cracks outta you, mister]. It has all the info on what year of Strat has what size of dots on the fingerboard, what kind of decal, etc. If you need scans from it or references from it, I'll be glad to help if I can. PM me if so.

 

This sounds really interesting. I'm probably not going to do this, I like the look of a nice clean guitar (and I'm modeling this after my own). I had never heard of this practice before, and I enjoyed looking over all the pictures on the website. Thanks!

 

Zack

[mooncaine]

Anything I missed?

 

Zack

Didn't see if anyone mentioned this, but here's a really nitpicky thing you might not care about: the neck's too wide at the nut for most Strats. Fenders tend to have narrow fingerboards anyway, and the vast majority of Strats are narrower at the nut than at the heel where the body joins the neck. Only a small number of Strat models offer wide necks, and even those taper a bit from heel to nut. I also see you didn't choose to model a string tree or two for the peghead, which is yet another really minor thing.

 

I LOVE this.

[zacktaich]

Didn't see if anyone mentioned this, but here's a really nitpicky thing you might not care about: the neck's too wide at the nut for most Strats. Fenders tend to have narrow fingerboards anyway, and the vast majority of Strats are narrower at the nut than at the heel where the body joins the neck. Only a small number of Strat models offer wide necks, and even those taper a bit from heel to nut.

I thought I did that a bit.. but I'll emphasize it more.

 

I also see you didn't choose to model a string tree or two for the peghead, which is yet another really minor thing.

 

They're there! They didn't make it into the 360, but in the two final images you should see them. Make sure you're seeing the images full size, they're rather large, and both IE and Mozilla Firefox tend to shrink them.

 

I LOVE this.

 

Thanks again.

 

Zack

[tobinjim]

Good looking guitar, Zack! Perhaps a little definition of wood grain would give a touch of realism.

 

Do you think applying the decals as bump maps would give the definition you're looking for? I think it would help place the specular highlights properly.

Hi Zack,

 

First I should be more clear: At the top of the neck the area that is the color of puddy is what I was referring too. If that's a blonde wood, some grain there would give the detail that says "real" -- much like the simulated grain in the darker wood of the main neck facia (fret board? I'm not a musician).

 

A bump map wouldn't be expected, at least as far as I know. What I have seen of such guitars is that they tend to have a very high gloss finish applied and buffed to a brilliant shine. As an amatuer woodworker I can tell you that visually it's quite obvious when the shine and luster is coming from above the underlying wood, and that detail is what tells our eye we're seeing the real deal. You know from handling raw wood that it's anything but shiny, and from seeing a dining room table (ancient Pledge commercials come to mind) that "furniture" is highly polished but the wood grain is distinct below.

 

And while I'm on this soapbox, don't let wood grain wrap around three or more edges without significantly changing the width of the grain lines. Mother Nature doesn't do this, so you shouldn't either. In a department store, "furniture" that has veneer on it will have the same grain on the top and the sides, and the lack of end-grain is a dead give away of the quality of furniture you're buying. I'll bet a close examination of your guitar will reveal the same grain patterns.

 

Keep up the great work!

[zacktaich]

First I should be more clear: At the top of the neck the area that is the color of puddy is what I was referring too. If that's a blonde wood, some grain there would give the detail that says "real" -- much like the simulated grain in the darker wood of the main neck facia (fret board? I'm not a musician).

 

A bump map wouldn't be expected, at least as far as I know. What I have seen of such guitars is that they tend to have a very high gloss finish applied and buffed to a brilliant shine. As an amatuer woodworker I can tell you that visually it's quite obvious when the shine and luster is coming from above the underlying wood, and that detail is what tells our eye we're seeing the real deal. You know from handling raw wood that it's anything but shiny, and from seeing a dining room table (ancient Pledge commercials come to mind) that "furniture" is highly polished but the wood grain is distinct below.

 

And while I'm on this soapbox, don't let wood grain wrap around three or more edges without significantly changing the width of the grain lines. Mother Nature doesn't do this, so you shouldn't either. In a department store, "furniture" that has veneer on it will have the same grain on the top and the sides, and the lack of end-grain is a dead give away of the quality of furniture you're buying. I'll bet a close examination of your guitar will reveal the same grain patterns.

 

Ha! I thought you were talking about the floor!

 

Yeah, there is no material really there yet. Thanks for the tips!

[mediaho]

I'll see what I can do. I had trouble installing the viewer, and I couldn't see any of the files, even after the fifth time viewing, so I never installed the plug in. But maybe I'll make one even if I can't see it.

 

What exactly would you like to see more of, if you told me I could maybe make a few images or some sort of turnaround to illustrate whatever you would like to see.

Mainly, I can't get a good feel for the body shape - it's very black. There are some definite slopes in a strat body (at least mine). I mentioned the slope by the right elbow on the front but also on the back by about where your gut is, it's indented as well although more rounded. At that point, the side of the body is only about 1/2"-3/4".

 

Also, are there fret dots on the side of neck? I can't see them.

 

Believe me, these things are very nitpicky and I wouldn't even suggest them if you hadn't done such a great job already.

[Guest mrsl13]

Hey just for my amusement Id like to see the Strat body more relective of things around it..I use to stare at myself for hours in my Strat...just kidding...only minutes if I ever where to be exact....Smile

 

Great job,and thanks for putting up with me.

 

Mike

[Rodney]

I thought I remembered reading a request for your guitar rendered out via Arctic Pigs..... looked through the posts and didn't find it... knew it had to be there.... so looked again... and there it was.... a request from Ed Lynch!

 

I second that request... This would look awesome in Arctic Pigs format.

Hope you can experiment with it and get it to load for you.

 

Hurry back from vaction!!! You have more splining to do!

[zacktaich]

I would love to do that, unfortunately I never downloaded the beta because the plugin wouldn't work for me. I guess someone else could do it.. Rodney, I could send you the .mdl if you would like to volunteer .

 

Based on the suggestions of JoeW I redid the lighting. The point being to get rid of the "flatness" of the image by using shadows to define form and high lights to define the feature. Unfortunately, I believe it still lacks highlights, but it's a start. It's nowhere near finished, but as I'm leaving (again) tomorrow (this time for Portland, OR) I decided to post a milestone.

 

There are a whole bunch of lights, the bright side is that it now has excellent antialiasing. The unfortunate part is that it's still lacking definition, and it now looks a bit washed out.

 

[mooncaine]

One thing that might help the white plastic bits: make sure that no colours you specify are "pure" [as in 255/255/255, or 100% of R,G or B]. That's yet another tip I picked up from Bill Young's Mastering Materials series, and again I recommend it highly because, whether you want to master materials or not, you'll encounter dozens of such juicy tips while watching them.

 

Bill says we should never use a completely pure colour in our 3D because there are no such completely pure colours in life. This leads us to subconsciously assess a 3D image with a pure colour in it as somehow unrealistic without our realizing what's bothering us about the image.

 

If the Strat you're modeling has any age to it at all, the white will have probably yellowed, or maybe even greened a tiny bit.

[zacktaich]

Update:

 

bought Jeremy Birn's [ d i g i t a l ] Lighting & Rendering. I highly recommend it. Updated the lighting.

 

The headstock still looks like crud. Need to texture it.. but it's really tough to unwrap.

 

[zacktaich]

No comments?

[HeadlessBill]

The new lighting definately make the guitar look more dimensional. The guitar still looks good though, it's looked good from the get-go. Overall, the items in the image need to be grunged up a bit and the guitar looks lonely. Anything you add to the scene doesn't necesarrily (sp?) need to be seen completely, but enough to hint what it is. Remember the image extends beyond the edges of the image itself. Am I making any sense?

 

Again, the guitar itself looks really, really good.

[robcat2075]

Getting those edges highlighted really helped.

 

Overall, the items in the image need to be grunged up a bit and the guitar looks lonely.

How about a roach clip, an ashtray and an empty 20/20 bottle?

[zacktaich]

Anything you add to the scene doesn't necesarrily (sp?) need to be seen completely, but enough to hint what it is. Remember the image extends beyond the edges of the image itself. Am I making any sense?

Yes.

 

Again, the guitar itself looks really, really good.

 

Thanks!

 

Getting those edges highlighted really helped.

 

How about a roach clip, an ashtray and an empty 20/20 bottle?

 

I think I'll stick with a chair, extra strings, and either an amp or a tuner. Thanks for the suggestions.

 

I'll be back to work on this soon, after 3(+) weeks away.

[zacktaich]

 

Headstock texture

[zacktaich]

 

Funny lil' blooper. Reflectivity set way too high.

[-TC-]

Wow, really nice guitars Zach. Great Work.

[zacktaich]

Thanks.

 

comments? crits?

[zacktaich]

 

Added soft shadows.

[zacktaich]

 

Added a new strat. Render times aren't bad...

[mediaho]

Awesome job. I really love how this is coming along. I'd love to see what it looks like with some kind of radiosity or Sky Light rig. A couple nit-picky points:

 

The reflections seem way too high and too sharp. If you're using version 11, definitely check out Reflective blend, Reflective filter, and Soft Reflections.

 

Also, I can't believe I didn't notice this but ever since someone in another forum pointed it out, I can't help but to see it. The spacing of the first fret is way too close to the nut.

 

There seems to be a little bump in the elbow bevel. I can tell that's probably a very difficult area to get smooth. One thing about those reflections - they can tell more about the surface integrity than the surface itself can. That's why I never use 'em.

[zacktaich]

 

Fixed as much as I could.

 

I won't be able to post for a while. But C&C are highly appreciated. I think this is getting towards being finished. I actually like the simplicity of the scene.