Just saying hi

[Walter Baker]

Let me know what ya think, did it in about 45 min one day during my lunch hour.

NevikGreeting2.mov

[robcat2075]

It's a bit chunky, but for an alien it will work.

 

The downside of the phoneme method is that the mouth is using the same shapes repeatedly which is an unnatural effect. The upside... it's fast, as you found out.

 

You can get much smaller file sizes by not choosing "Animation" as the codec for Quicktime

 

http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?s=&am...st&p=302381

 

You can also reduce the audio file portion by using a mono sound file in A:M instead of stereo.

 

Quicktime can compress audio too, but A:M doesn't give access to that yet.

[Walter Baker]

Thanks Rob

My main purpose of all I have been working on is to see if my friend that created this comic book would be interested in starting some projects. All that I have sent to the forum I have done just in this past year from knowing -O-. You and several others have been such a great help to me as I am sure to others, so I give a big heart felt THANK YOU to you and everyone.

 

Now what other method is there besides the 'phoneme method' ? More elaborate rigging?

I have been trying a little of each of the things that AM offers and still have a lot to go, such as the cloth thing, and Newton Physics, which may be a while yet.

 

This forum is great and everyone should be taking advantage of it.

[robcat2075]

You're welcome, I'm glad your enjoying A:M.

 

Now what other method is there besides the 'phoneme method' ? More elaborate rigging?

 

Yes. Basically you directly pose the lips for every sound. The minimum controls would be the jaw up/down, in/out for each corner of the mouth, and some way to curl/pucker the lips for things like "mmm" and "oo". This lets you craft shapes that fit the mood of what is being said and to make better transitions between them.

 

It is more time consuming.

 

There's a noted book called "Stop Staring" about lip synch animation. The first edition had some coverage of A:M in it, the current ones don't, but it's the animation concepts that are important rather than the specific modeling advice.

[Rodney]

Now what other method is there besides the 'phoneme method' ?

 

Something else to consider...

Depending on what you are animating the 'Puppet Method' may work well for you.

This method is what is used to articulate the mouths of puppets to the delight of people everywhere.

 

The best known example of the method is with Jim Henson's Muppets. When watching these characters no one tends to complain about the lipsync. Quite the contrary... we love watching these characters communicate with each other and us.

 

Of course when there is less movement of the mouth the language of the head and body of these characters is all the more important.

[Rodney]

If you enjoy reading about the approach to animating lipsync you may enjoy this:

 

Disney animator Eric Larsen discussed Dialogue for Animation with his animators. (Link to PDF document at www.animationmeat.com)

 

For those that don't want to follow the link he concludes his dialogue with the following observations:

 

 

Dialogue isn't sacred. Like all things creative, it can often stand a little improvement, sometimes by simply opening up space between words at a given point to give a needed emphasis to a word or maybe to allow time for a personality pause on a character which, in turn, will give an additional punch to the line. Sometimes we might want to pull words more together to help a mood and we find ourselves cutting out a frame or two between words or phrases.

Lines of dialogue will fall naturally into phrases and the tone and mood in each should tell the body what to do and how to do it. Like a well constructed sentence, making good and proper use of punctuation, we phrase our dialogue action with care and reason so that pictorially and audibly, thoughts and statements are clearly understood.

Dialogue phrasing has to have a rhythm; an overall movement not unlike a graceful gesture, having its beginning and its end, saying what it has to say in a simply planned but positive body sweep. Within it we put the accents and gestures needed to give the dramatics and personality we want. We can spoil the flow of the phrase in animation if we try to catch every word with accents. A key word or two may well be the "meat and muscle" of the phrase, allowing us to "pass through" other words that are part of the thought, but supportive in their use. The overall phrase has a message — has something to say. It's up to us to make it entertaining.

Of course if we have no control of the script or the dialogue we've got to do the best with what we have.

[Rodney]

One of the secrets of using the Dopesheet for Lipsync is the Timeline.

 

Launching the dopesheet to create lipsync is equivalent to doing about 80% of the job.

The good news... that leaves only 20% left!

The bad news... that 20% is really important... its what will really sell the lipsyncing effect.

 

 

After creating your animated lipsync with the Dopesheet crack open the Timeline and look at the channels and keyframes that have been created.

 

- Experiment with these Keyframes and channels to find the optimum settings that perfect the sync of the dialogue with the movement of the character's mouth.

 

- Try selecting all of the keyframes and changing the interpolation to Linear. (shortcut key for Peaking is P)

 

- Select a few appropriate keyframes and change the interpolation to Spline. (shortcut key for Smoothing is O)

 

(The shortcut key for snapping the Keyframe to a frame is the apostrophe)

 

Try manually adjusting the Bias of some Keyframes so that the articulation of the mouth Eases open or Eases closed.

 

Try to accentuate the key words and phrases through your adjustments.

Add new Keyframes if you must.

 

 

Then scrap that experiment and try it all over again.

In no time at all you'll develop a very fast and efficient lipsyncing workflow.

[Gerry]

Wow, "Puppet Method"! I didn't know there was a word for it. Back in 2000 when I was creating the original "Sister Mary Dracula" Flash animation, I was really sweating the lipsynch/phoneme problem, when a friend told me "forget about phonemes! You only need two mouth positions: open and closed." And he was right. It's not only a cinch, but it's much funnier (if funny is what you're going for).

 

I've noticed in some CG-animated TV spots that there's a trend toward a jerky, rough almost clay animation look. It's not just that it's cheaper to do, there's a certain charm to something that's a little rough-edged and clunky. It's nicer to look at and a relief from the overly natural, realistic approach that a lot of CG animators aspire to. It's also a good way to totally avoid the "Uncanny Valley".

[Rodney]

I think your friend's advice was spot on for 'Sister Mary'.

 

There are a lot of hooks that help our brains fill in the gaps and a healthy suspension of disbelief certainly helps too.

 

In general the more realistic the character the more accurate the lipsync will be expected to be.

 

Clear staging of the dialogue is important.

Its important that when a character is speaking there are visual clues that its person A who is talking versus person B. Taking time to establish a standard and making sure its crystal clear whose voice is being heard is important.

 

The same is true in opposite terms if you are wanting to heighten the sense of discontinuity. As we intentionly drop and manipulate the visual clues the audience will experience more of that confusion.

 

Its also good to think in terms of contrast. Where possible we should stage our shots in such a way as to direct the eye to the visual cue.

 

For instance, if you've got two characters in a shot with one talking and one giving out only non-verbal clues. The audience will easily pick up which character is 'speaking' due to that contrast alone. Then the change resounds all the more vibrantly when the roles reverse.

[Walter Baker]

WOW,

I am surprised at the response in that there is so much more to animating than I was aware of. Not just the tech. work involved but the mental reactions of people. I read over the info of 'the Uncanny Valley' and as I read it I realized that is what I felt when I watched 'i Robot' and I think of other animations I have watched that bothered me but wasn't sure why.

You guys have brought me into a depth of thought that my poor sad old mind must now absorb. LOL

My objective to create COOL STUFF like you all do.

Working on it,

gonna be there one day.

Thanks

Wally

[robcat2075]

Depending on what you are animating the 'Puppet Method' may work well for you.

 

Our first lipsynch assignment at AnimationMentor was puppet mouth. The mouth could only open and close. No "ee" or "oo" or "mm" or anything.

 

http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?s=&am...st&p=141788

[Rodney]

My objective to create COOL STUFF like you all do.

 

The principle of 'Less is More' works.

If nothing else it lays a solid foundation to build upon.

 

When we start out trying to make the next 'Star Wars' (and most of us do) inevitably we are overwhelmed by it all. It's good to start with clear, definable goals. (Working through TaoA:M helps condition us for that workflow)

 

Distill the important/essential/critical elements and stop there.

After working on something over a concentrated period of hard work take a break from it. Then look back and get a clear sense of where you are. You may need to refocus and the important/essential/critical elements or you may have already surpassed your goal.

[Rodney]

Our first lipsynch assignment at AnimationMentor was puppet mouth. The mouth could only open and close. No "ee" or "oo" or "mm" or anything.

 

http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?s=&am...st&p=141788

 

Robert illustrates a very significant point in how we learn through personal experience.

Many would scoff at the idea of doing such simple exercises first.

"I don't want to learn this stuff... open/close... open/close? I wanna work for Pixar!"

 

All of the keys to learning are important; First Learned Best Remembered, Repetition, Most Current, Questioning, Ownership etc. etc..

 

I want to attack this from a slightly different perspective though.

We really need to consider for a moment how we can help others in our own effort to learn.

 

Straight forward lessons with clearly defined objects are wonderful aids in helping others help us work through a problem, discover a new process, gain experience and learn. The more variables those that WANT to help are exposed to the less likely they'll be able to assist us in reaching our goal. The K.I.S.S. principle, 'Keep It Simple Stupid'... works.

 

The folks at Animation Mentor certainly know this.

Once the basic lesson is learned, other lessons are added in building block fashion to increase our understanding and enhance and augment our learning.

 

One of the best ways to articulate where you are and what you current know to others is to ask and answer questions. The asking helps define the goal. The answering helps lock our understanding and help us vector in and adjust the course toward ever changing longer term goals.

 

Walter started this topic out appropriately enough by asking this question:

Now what other method is there besides the 'phoneme method' ?

 

A:M's Dopesheet and the Preston Blair phoneme set is the introduction to a method combining a classic technique with modern day technology. In understanding at least the surface how that works we have a reference point from which to explore.

 

 

(This is stating the obvious for many but for those that have the need to know.)