prison cell

[tbenefi33]

Hello everybody I'm working on a prison cell I got the jail cell done and I've made 4 copy of the cell

when I copy all 4 at the same time it takes a long time to past them was wondering why does it take so long copy and past or do I have to copy and past a single jail cell ?

[Luuk Steitner]

If you're copying models with lots of splines and CPs A:M can get slow at copy and paste. You will also notice it will take longer to load your project file. This is why I always try to keep the spline count as low as possible. One time I had to wait for 20 minutes when I copied parts of a large model...

If you want to use the same model more then once in your chor, it's best to place several shortcuts to the same model in the chor in stead of putting them all in one model.

[tbenefi33]

I redone the jail cell I got les cp that help out a buch the copy and past was lot shorter. I made cell block, cell doors, and cell items differn't I added a gray metal to the cell door and when I brought them into the cell block it to became gray metal how do I keep it from doing that ?

 

[Luuk Steitner]

You have applied the material directly to the model. If you apply it to a group, only that group is affected by the material.

[tbenefi33]

Was just wondering what type back ground would yall recamend for the prison set up there gonna be cell all the way down the walkway and on the other side as well. It set up simular to Alcatraz. but at 1/2 scale.

 

[tbenefi33]

I'm still working on the prison sort of look like Alcatraz.

 

 

[tbenefi33]

Now I know how yall fell sitting at the dest the desk a long hr's working in the choreograph is there a way to copy and past in the choreograph instead importing the same model a buch on times. I got a little ways to go but getting there .

 

 

[Luuk Steitner]

Now I know how yall fell sitting at the dest the desk a long hr's working in the choreograph is there a way to copy and past in the choreograph instead importing the same model a buch on times. I got a little ways to go but getting there .

 

As far as I know you can't copy and paste in the chor. Your scene is looking good so far. Keep us posted on your progress.

[tbenefi33]

I took a short break here this weekend and finaly finished the first floor of the B block and C block of the prison.

 

[AMkyle]

wow!!!!!!! i love that. it is really cool. sadly i want be making anything that good for a long time, i just got animation master this christmas, and im still learning a lot of stuff. i cant even model basic stuff like a basic cude very well yet!!!!! heh but i love your prison. Also do you knnow where i could get some extra help im mmodeling besides the manual.

[tbenefi33]

I done search on basic tutorial in the forum her the link may help you get started welcome aboard.

 

http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?act=S...deling+tutorial

 

http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?act=S...ite=%2Btutorial

 

 

youtube may also have some animation mation master tutorials.

[tbenefi33]

Well I'm still working on the prison about done with the first floor of the prison just finished d block or solitary confinment now I have to make 2 more floor of each cell block. I may chage the floor to square concereat looking block that the way they looked in the movie Escape from Alcatraz.

 

 

 

Wonder how long this is going to take to render....LOL

[tbenefi33]

I was working on a new model the back wall cell door leading to the dinning hall area and I made a mistake in the model and when I hit ctrl z to go back and fix the problem an error message came up

click ok for got what it said but I save the model after the error message went away. I then went into

the choreograph for some reason all the cell came up like this ? Wonder if yall have that error message in v15.

 

 

 

Oh well guess have to start back over on some of the cell block.

[tbenefi33]

Hay I for got I can do a system restore up to this point that will save a lot time

[tbenefi33]

Well after losing my choreograph I just restarted a new one this time around a made the a little lighter color green like in the movie escape from alcatraz and you can see the bricks a little better. This time

I started a new model imported a cell into the new model and from there copy and paste the cell and made a cell block and saved it as a model That help out the choreograph better.

 

 

oh yah I'll probley change the red on the board holding the railing cause it's sappose to be on the end only have to decale it or 3d paint it.

[ypoissant]

Well after losing my choreograph I just restarted a new one

To avoid that in the future, always save your project with incremental names "project001.prj", "Project002.prj", etc. Do the same for your model files BTW.

 

This time I started a new model imported a cell into the new model and from there copy and paste the cell and made a cell block and saved it as a model That help out the choreograph better.

For something like that, I would have a model of one cell only. Then I would assemble a cell block in an action and then I would assemble the prison in the choreography using the action. This way, if you ever have to change your cell, the job will be easier. Plus, the model file is smaller and more manageable.

[c-wheeler]

I once modeled a short cell stretch based on Alcatraz, with the toilet, bed - all the furniture. When I came to assemble them in the cho, I "discovered"(I should really have checked first) that the 2nd cell was a mirror immage of the first, so it wouldnt fit together properly. At the time I couldnt think of a way to assemble it (flip) in the cho. I had to add an extra mirrored cell in the model file first. The bars and mechanism were seperate models.

 

 

There is an automated project saver that will save incremated backups (001,002 etc each time you save your project file.

[tbenefi33]

That looks awsome c-wheeler.

 

How do you assemble the prison in the choreography using the action do you drage the action into the choreograph ?

[tbenefi33]

I got the second floor of the prison up I got a add the over hang and a few hand railing then the third floor.

 

[ypoissant]

That looks awsome c-wheeler.

 

How do you assemble the prison in the choreography using the action do you drage the action into the choreograph ?

When you create the action, you select the cell model (see note below) as the base model. Then you add new action objects which is the cell model again. You position the new cell next to the first one. Then add a new action object cell again, etc. In the documenation, look for "Action object".

 

In choreography, you drop the base object in choreography and then you drop the action onto the object shortcut in the choreography.

 

 

Note: Personally, I prefer to create an empty model and use the empty model as a base model for the action where I wuld add the cells.

[tbenefi33]

Was working on the 3 rd floor still need to add railing on the 2 nd floor. On the 3rd floor the prison had concreat columns and in between the columns they had a widow. Does these columns look a little to big are need to scale they down a little bit ?

 

 

When done the camera view is going to be manily on the first floor walking to the cell look up a little bit then back down.

[tbenefi33]

Now I'm starting to get the hang of this but I'm steal learning though.

Here the back side of B and C block.

 

[ruscular]

I wonder if that could be a new feature for Hash, to only show spline that are visible to the camera during Cho setup?

[tbenefi33]

How can you make the spline not visible in the cho setup ?

[tbenefi33]

worked on the roof part of prison they had like a steel vent or something over the glass.

 

 

I need to make the prison dark how can I get the dark effect like night time look to it. Only a few light are going to be on in some of the cells and few on the top.

[tbenefi33]

I add the cealing and the cealing light on every other column. What would be the best way to add dark rolling clouds on top of the roof where the bars are. To get night time stormy effect to it.

 

[c-wheeler]

One quick-ish way would be to:-

 

1) Make a flat plane that would sit above the skylights

2) Get a piece of video that shows the effect you want- bearing in mind copyright etc.

3) Convert the film to a useable format

4) Decal the flat plane with the immage sequence/animation

 

Everything else is just lighting

 

Chris

[tbenefi33]

I've been messing around with the lighting and also looking for a cloudy video. Think I'll go out side and film off the back porch its kind of cloudy and been raining here. Here the look I've been trying to get how can I make the room dark like this ?

 

[tbenefi33]

Well if evry thing fells all way read the manual I forgot about how to do the light went back to the book

the first one chorus line show you how to delete some of the light and add new light and rename the lights. Here what I came up with. Add a few more detale in the back part of the prison and next the characters. Slowly getting there.

 

[tbenefi33]

Still messing with the lighting about got it right thinking about add some some smoke down the hall like some body smoking. Take a break from this and work on the characters.

 

Thank you guys from helping me out on this, hope to have an animated scene soon

 

[tbenefi33]

Yall think the lighting is just about right add more or less also was thinking about add some smoke down the hall way like say when you got a bunch of prisoner smoking it builds up.

 

 

oh yah what would be a good usuable film format ?

[ypoissant]

It is all very black. I kind of liked the way your prison model was being developped but now I wonder why you went into all this trouble for an image where we see only a couple white spots in a large black sea? Have you considered just roughly modeling the structure of the prison except for the few cells that need to be lit? It would dramatically cut down on the choreo size and help streamline your manipulation and rendering of it.

[tbenefi33]

I wanted to see how close I could get it to look like that in the movie.

I'll try the roughing the model size.

[tbenefi33]

After looking at it your right looks better the old way so I decided to light it up but it got that hopital feel look to it.

 

 

 

 

In order for me to get the light this color just change the light color ?

 

[tbenefi33]

I made a few changes with the lighting trying to get right effect also made a change in the back wall at the end of the cell block I made the cell door regular size for some reason I thought they where bigger.

Think I'll start on the charcter next.

 

[c-wheeler]

I can make a guess at what you were trying to achieve, but I think you are getting "low light" confused with "no light" The key is to balance the scene with light and dark, so the light areas are light, and the dark areas are well....visible but dark.

Lighting is a very tricky thing to do well, but if you go slow, I think you can get the effect you want.What I think you need is some "bounce"

 

I would suggest you go back to your original lights.The ones with just the bulbs in.

Then make a single light object, a klieg with a wide cone angle- about 160 degrees and plenty of width softness have the intensity at about 20%, but be prepared to play around with these figures.Under options>cast shadows make it z-buffered.Call it bounce.

Then in the cho. drop this onto the floor of the hallway, pointing up at the ceiling. Make sure the fall off is long enough to reach the ceiling and change the colour to the colour of the floor say a sort of brownish - this replicates the light from the floor that hits the ceiling. What you want is to barely light the darkest corner of the ceiling in a sort of brown. Dont try to do all the hall at once, and be prepared to play with the settings youve made. Experimentation is the key.

Use the same method to light each of the walls, but give the wall bounce a greenish tinge. Once youve set up the inside, you can add a light from outside pointing to the right wall to simulate the moonlight. Make this a little blue. Internal lights can be set up to simulate interior cell lighting, or to highlight specific features, such as the bars.Turn the z buffering to ray-trace in the final render.

 

Hope this helps,

Chris

[tbenefi33]

I tryed messing with the number it got it brownish color and I kep messing the rim light and add a few cealing light bulbs. Think I for got to add the 160* this is what came up the reflection of the roof top bars showed up

 

 

 

Here two pics of the effect what I'm realing to get the guards brings a prisoner in at night time, and walks down the hall way to his cell. The first one show lighting through the roof top bars. That where the background video will come into play.

 

[tbenefi33]

I'm still messing with the number I place the rim light above the cells pointed down at the floor and I add a few new light where the cealing light bulbs are the ends ones are a light blushish c olor think I set the number high I wanted a glow look probley have to tweek it a little bit but about got the effect I'm looking

for. Yall are right about the light being trickey you have to play with them a while befor you get the hang of it and each time you do a differnt color on a light it can through it off big time. I'm about done with my set few tweeks but now its time to work on the characters.

 

 

[MattWBradbury]

Have you tried using area lights? Basically, an area light is a bulb light in the middle of a room set at a fairly low intensity to try and give the feeling of bounced lighting. I rendered out an image using radiosity, and match the area lights up with the radiosity render, and the results looked pretty good.

 

Here was the original radiosity render:

 

Photons are bouncing off all of the geometry in the scene to reproduce real life lighting conditions.

 

Here's the scene with only the point lights on:

 

You can't see any of the areas that aren't being directly hit by the light.

 

Here's the scene with both the point lights and area lights:

 

The room's form comes into view, and it makes it look a little more believable. The lighting is a bit different, but further tweaking of the light intensities would get you a look very close to that of the radiosity render.

 

Here is a picture of the light setup:

 

The area lights not directly under the point lights are set to half the normal intensity to match the radiosity results.

[tbenefi33]

Ah that looks cool I'll give that one a try thank you.

[tbenefi33]

Here a final render with the set up you had but at the lights the next one I'm doing one in the middle.

 

 

[MattWBradbury]

I suggest changing the type of light inside of the light on the cieling to a klieg pointing downwards. It looks like there is too much light up there. You may also want to make the scene a little brighter. Something like this would be good:

 

[tbenefi33]

How do you set the radiosity render ?

[tbenefi33]

After messing around with the number and setting up the light in the middle I about got the effect I'm looking for Thanks a lot for helping me yall are awsome group of animator. I'm probley gonna take a short break from this and work on the characters a little bit.

 

[MattWBradbury]

To set radiosity, go into the Choreography settings and turn it on. Right click on your Choreography and select Calculate Radiosity. Radiosity takes a bit of time to render, and even more time to render, so be patient with that feature. There is a lot more to know about it, but I will let you know if you decided to get that far.

 

You may want to increase the intensity on the point lights. It looks a little odd having the area lights almost as bright as the main lights. You may also want to set the ambiance intensity of the bulbs in those fixtures to 100%.

[c-wheeler]

I like using kliegs because I can control colour bounce effect quickly.I know its cheating, but conisider.....

 

If everything is lit by a series of white area bulbs, then the light you observe -the colour of something-has no change of tint whatever the incident light source(floor,ceiling, walls or skylight) is.-As I see it the reason why immage based lighting can be so effective.So a white box would apear to be the same colour wherever its put in the cell block.In the case of a room all the same colour, it doesnt matter so much, but the walls here are a little red and greenish, the floor a sort of greyish,ceiling whiteish and the light from outside is a little blueish.So the white box on the floor would apear to be a little blue, a box on the wall would apear a little redish, etc etc. I think of it as faking the Cornell box

 

If I was lighting this scene I would try to reproduce Mattts radiosity using both coloured spots and area lights.

http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?act=a...st&id=34287

 

I would also add one or two small yellowish(If the film is white balanced for indoor spots then lower temperature bulbs appear yellowish) area lights in the cells as if there was a small light in there.And maybe pick up the bars on one or two of the cells

From looking at this :-http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?act=attach&type=post&id=34258

I can see that the area near the camera is lit with a reddish light, making it more hospitable, whereas the area at the end of the coridor is a cold blue, making it more threataning.This can be done by changing the colour of the lights themselves(whatever you use)

 

Maybe a combination of methods works better. I like kliegs because I can easily moove away from "real" lighting to "emotional" lighting.If I get asked to throw a little more shadow or make something stand out, I can do so fairly easily. I gues it comes down to what you like.

 

Chris

[tbenefi33]

I took a short break from the prison and started working on the Guard Dog its a pit bull.

 

 

I haven't done the lower jaw the mouth gonna open close.

 

I'm still tweeking the prison.

[tbenefi33]

I was messing around with Fl Studio with the speech sound how yall think about this one. I'm trying to get the right sound to fit the prison scene. Its saying ( Welcome to hell )

 

Welcome_To_Hell.wav

[tbenefi33]

Still messing with the pit bull I tryed to get the briddel color going but need a lot of tweeking going on I thought about adding hair but they real short hair. Oh yah I used 3d paint for the model still learning it.

 

 

 

I'll probely will change the color back to buckskin color I didn't know you can set the decal image that helps out a lot.

 

How in the world would you rig the bones up on a dog.

 

I"m guessing 2 or 3 bones for each leg

up and lower mouth

both eyes

may be 2 in the neck

the foot.

[c-wheeler]

Check out some of the quad models - I think there was a dog freebie somewhere.

You could adapt the horse rig -just by draging the bones into your mesh, and then the relationships. Course you would have to adjust compensates and bone positionsa(not in that order) as well.

I would love a squetch dog rig - Is there one?

I would say the bones you suggest are the minimum you need.

 

 

Chris