Vash Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 I've been working on a face-criticism with proportion is needed because I've been working without a rotoscope or a tutorial. Small crease points may be dense and random becuase of stray and largly cross sectioned splines. Wireframe and shaded are posted conglomerously. gif.bmp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pixelmech Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 Hey vash, Good start, faces are tough. You need to work with SOME kind of rotoscope with a face, or its nigh impossible to get right. The face is very flat because of that. You also have a few spline junctions with 5 splines going through an intersection. I would go and rework those to start. But if I were you, I would go and do Colins face tutorial. Use his rotoscopes and it will teach you a lot. Just doing that you will find out how to minimize the creasing and so forth. There is a real process to doing a face you kind of have to follow to at least some extent. Hang in there tho - face is gotta be the toughest thing to do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vash Posted February 13, 2005 Author Share Posted February 13, 2005 I did colin's tutorial. Once. Sort of. Kind of. A little bit. Anyway, thanks for the comment. In those places where there are 5 cplines running into 1 cp, they are most likely two five point patches next to each other, and five point patches can't take like that. Thank you for the reference and help, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hutch Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 The places where you have to many splines meeting at a control point are circled below (one side only). The top of the nose looks like it needs some help too. Any time you end a spline where two others cross is probably not going to work very well. That is what I have circled and what I think pixelmech was referring to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottj3d Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 Try working on only half of the face then copying it and flipping and attaching once you have the shape the way you like it. Look at other peoples meshes and see how they run their splines as a guide.(particularly the nostril and bridge of the nose) If you're not using the shortcuts to the views start getting used to them(be sure numlock is on). It'll be 2nd nature before you know it. It looks a bit flat yet but using the 5 key on the numeric pad will get you on top of that in a hurry. Hooks are also a good thing to practice. I remember my first face. It was so dense you could use it as a net to catch mosquitos and I modelled it the way you are(whole). It was much easier working on half then copying it. Yours is much lighter. I never could get copy/flip/attach to work for me so I still do it manually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vash Posted February 13, 2005 Author Share Posted February 13, 2005 Thank you for all of the replies. Hutch, the areas you circled were splines that I had to insert because they were to close to other five point patches. If I could delete those succesfully I would. Scott, C/F/A doesn't work for me very well either. The views on the keypad are already second nature to me. You'll also notice the insane amount of hooks and five point patches in my model. Also in the points Hutch circled, I'd like to know how I can relieve these areas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted February 13, 2005 Hash Fellow Share Posted February 13, 2005 Anytime you make spline intersections like the ones Hutch has circled a warning light should go off. Stop and find another way to connect your splines. I drew some new splines in the problem areas that Hutch identified. a "5" shows a new five point patch. where you see a spline dead end into another spline without a red CP... that's a hook. The "?" might be a legitimate 5 point patch but you should really break it into two 4-pointers by extending the nose spline i circled in yellow through the middle of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottj3d Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 If I am not wrong this is a hook. And I'm not seeing any. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottj3d Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 Garcon beat me to it but here is another variation of what he said. A you can disconnect and work it up through to the eyelid following the green dots or use a hook as he demonstrated. B you can delete and make a 5 pointer. I'll see if I can find a good wireframe of the nose bridge for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuep Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 I would suggest that you start over. Keep it simple and bring in a head that has been done and have it beside your work to have as a reference. Of course rotoscopes work to but this may help you with the splinage and prespective and then you can go from rotos later. hope this helps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottj3d Posted February 13, 2005 Share Posted February 13, 2005 Here is a wireframe from my 3rd face. It's not the best (talk about an insane ammount of hooks) but demonstrates how the bridge of the nose "can" be done and a similar hook to the one Garcon demonstrated. The mesh is still heavy I am told for animation and I'm sure you can find much better here if you look around. Thats how I found out the best way at the time for me to run the splines. Faces are not easy that's for sure. Anf from what I have read recently the 5 pointers aren't such a problem as they used to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vash Posted February 13, 2005 Author Share Posted February 13, 2005 Thank you for all the replies everyone! I followed robcats suggestion and increased the number of hooks pertaining. Here is the new, smooth, leaner, meaner mask/face/thing. I don't know where to go from here though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hash Fellow robcat2075 Posted February 14, 2005 Hash Fellow Share Posted February 14, 2005 Much better!. There may be something going on under the nose, but we'll sidestep that. The next big issue is the flatness of the face as a whole. real faces bend WAY back. Go to a mirror and tilt your head way up and way down and see the line that your jaw or your mouth or your cheeks make as they reach along the side of your face. Run your hand along them. Are you able to follow them just by moving your hand from side to side? No! Are they flat? No way! We look at our front view in a mirror every day but never stop to consider the real shape of it. And after you do this first face, you'll probably take what you've learned and make a whole new bette one next time out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vash Posted February 14, 2005 Author Share Posted February 14, 2005 Okay. I stretched out the face a little, and decided to start working on an ear. But when I tried to use magnet mode, a box, that's right, a box appeared over the cp instead of a sphere of influence. I don't know why but I can't seem to use magnet mode. I don't know what to do now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottj3d Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 I dont use magnet mode myself. The simpler the better. Try (i know it sounds rough) cutting the mask in half. From the front #2 view select the row of cp's at the outer edge of the face(Circled in blue in the pic , name them as a group in the pws), hit #5view wile the box is still surrounding the selected cp's or if it is not select them in the pws then drag them towards the rear, do the same for the next group and work your way in. You can extrude the outer ones and use the same process as well to form your head. Then it's just a matter of tweaking the shape. Nevermind A and B in the pic it's the same one I modified earlier. Have fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vash Posted February 14, 2005 Author Share Posted February 14, 2005 I need to use the magnet tool for the ear. I already stretched the face back. Thank you for the help though. ( Nice angel you got there. Now he needs to brutely kill someone.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottj3d Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 ( Nice angel you got there. Now he needs to brutely kill someone.) An army of dark warriors. At least once he gets through uh...physical therapy.Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gonzo3d Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 You have a good start.. Depending on your desired style, you may want to consider the masses of a face. Typically the head shape is a lot more rounded than what you have. If you have access to a library check out Bridgemans guide to drawing from life - lots of massing. It will help you interpret basic forms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisThom Posted February 14, 2005 Share Posted February 14, 2005 If you make the eyes even more sqinty it'll look just like Renée Zellweger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vash Posted February 15, 2005 Author Share Posted February 15, 2005 Pff! Are they that squinty! Sheese! Oh yeah the magnet tool isn't working all that happens when I click on a cp is is a spall 2d box forms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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