Roger

Ok, I have attached the foot, so now I have the foot attached to the leg and the hand attached to the arm. One problem.......I've got the foot attached so that the big toe is on the outside instead of on the inside, so I think I am going to have to go back and detach it, then mirror it and reattach so that when I do a copy/flip/attach it comes out looking right instead of arse-backwords. doh.

OK.... Here are 2 wireframes....side view and 3/4 view: [attachmentid=18867][attachmentid=18868]

I will post a wireframe as soon as I fix some of the issues I am having with creasing. Its looking better, the very back of the heel is going to look a little odd since it has a bunch of splines all converging at one point where I closed off a hole, but I am not too worried about that spot since I really don't think its going to be visible most of the time. I am anxious to get the whole model put together and start rigging it so I can see what its going to look like and maybe start doing some animation tests. Roger

Ok..... I took a break from modelling for several days because I had some home repairs/ maintenance that needed tending to. Anyway, I have tweaked the foot.....I made the arch a little more pronounced, and fixed the top so that it slopes up more. I also tweaked the ball and heel of the foot, so that they would look better. I may add claws to the toes. Any suggestions on making claws? I'm thinking just lathing a cone shape. The only other thing that I am noticing that still needs fixing maybe is moving the other toes down so the bottoms match with where the bottom of the big toe hits. Otherwise, it will look kind of wierd if I leave it the way that it is now. If anyone has any comments/criticisms to make, feel free. Thanks Roger[attachmentid=18855][attachmentid=18856]

This is why, at the risk of being a PITA, I start new threads of I am wanting to know about a new model for the same project. I figure few people are going to go into the thread and find this all the way at the end. Does anybody have any crits or advice to offer on the foot? I'll wait another day or so before I post it as its own thread, I'm really not sure what forum etiquette is in re: to that. later Roger

Ok, update on the dragon project. Rather than start a new thread, I just decided to post stuff about the foot in this one. In the future I guess I am going to have to give my threads names which are a little more all-encompassing. Anyway, here it is: [attachmentid=18567][attachmentid=18568][attachmentid=18569] My thoughts are that the ball of the foot is a little funky and that I will need to tweak it, but otherwise it looks ok to me. Rather than start over from scratch modelling a foot I just took that hand that I had made and modified that, it doesn't look too bad. Hopefully tonight I will also get some work done on the head, attaching the eyes and the horns and whatnot and sticking it on his neck. I haven't decided whether I want to have an animatable mouth or if I am just happy with a snout for now. let me know what you think. Roger

Its one of the darktree simbionts. They are now included in v13, but I downloaded these a while back. They have several varieties of shaders available for free download....about 4 or 5 dozen, I think. They sell a product that allows you to create your own packaged shaders for lightwave, am, 3ds, maya, etc. Roger

I guess this didn't merit creating a new thread, I'll keep future posts to the original thread since it gets bumped to the top of the list anyway. Sorry for the confusion.

er.... feel free to let me know what you think Roger

Ok.... Those of you that were following the other thread, I thought I would post the results of all my spline tweaking. after I had fixed the arm, I had noticed that the leg was jacked up too, so I fixed that. There's still a *tiny* glitch at the back of the leg, but the clay shader mostly hides it. I have attached a couple screenshots, I think you will agree that it looks much much better. Roger [attachmentid=18517][attachmentid=18518][attachmentid=18523]

Couldn't sleep. Got up, looked at the model..... I realized that what I had been doing to get those peaked points is that I was holding down shift while connecting the control point.....doh.... anyway I am doing a test render now and I will probably have to go break a bunch of patches and reattach them but I think that that is what was keeping it from looking smooth. thanks for jogging the memory. Roger booyah. that's what did the trick. I am too tired to screw with this now, but I will hit the offending splines tomorrow and post a good clear shot. Thanks again. Roger

Here's the thing, though, I've tried selecting those bastiches and hitting the O key and nothing happens.........they stay peaked looking. Soooooo I am not sure what is up with that. Any clues what I could be doing wrong? Roger

Scott, I could try the extrude from a new ring thing, but my new geometry doesn't look anywhere near as bad as the old. I don't have multiple splines going into the same point anymore. It still looks a touch funky because I haven't tweaked/adjusted all the cp's yet but its a million times better than what it was. All patches are quad with I think the exception of 2 5 pointers, and all splines are continuous. I'm not quite sure why there would be any residual funkiness, it looks good to me. I can post a wireframe image, with the rest of the arm hidden (so only the socket is visible) but I think you would agree that its better. I need to go to the gym again, but I will try to post a wireframe later tonight. thanks again everyone for your suggestions and help, it looks much better. I will have to wait and see how it animates, but I think it will be ok. Roger ok I lied here is the wireframe: [attachmentid=18485] and there are actually 4 5pt patches, but you will see that the existing patches are all kosher etc. There may be a few minor tweaks I can do but I think this is about the limits of my patience. I am eager to start doing some other things.....

No, it wasn't a bug.......I didn't know there was a "make five pt patch" button. So, once I corrected some things and learned how to use that.........things started to look a lot better. I don't think I got things perfect, but I do think that the current screenshot I have looks much better. The clay shader I have hides some of the goofy artifacts that are visible in a plain render. Anyway, let me know if this is an improvement. There is one little bit on the front side of the arm that could stand to be tweaked, and I think the underarm is a touch funky (not really a concern--I don't plain on having it visible much) but it looks scads better. Eric2575 thanks again for your assistance. [attachmentid=18476] and another: [attachmentid=18477] BTW I spent the last 4 hours working on this damn arm, I am about ready to go have a beer or blow some stuff up in Quake 4. I think you gentlemen will agree though that that is substantially improved from the other day. LOL

That was exactly the kind of answer I was hoping NOT to hear...... Anyway I am using v12.od

Ok, Here is a wider shot with more of the patches visible. I can assure you there are no hooks in the armpit area, and all the patches down there are 4 pointers. I tried selecting the holes of the 5 pt patch, deselecting and reselecting but I must be doing something wrong because it stays open. First I select them, hit the lock button, and then deselect them. Then I reselect them. Nada. Roger[attachmentid=18468]

How about this then? Ignore the geometry on the left......I detached some points and haven't fixed it yet. I extended that one spline clear down to point A.........and that 5 point patch STILL won't close. There are no other hooks near that patch, so I don't know whats going on. Do you have an idea what may be keeping it from closing?[attachmentid=18466]

Ok, I am battling with this thing again today. I know what constitutes a valid four point patch, and I think I'm getting the hang of using continuous splines, and I know why 3 point patches are bad..... However, I have what I believe to be valid 5 point patches here, and I am not sure why they are not closing off. Anyone have any ideas? Thanks in advance Roger[attachmentid=18464]

Sorry, I was so burnt out from yesterday that I quit around 8pm last night, and I just got back from the gym so I haven't done much with it yet. I hope that I will have a completed model up today. If I futz with the arm for an hour and I don't get any further, I will get it to look as good as I can and just press forward. I'm glad to see that you're interested.

I'm beat for now. I think this is as close as I'm going to get it. I'll leave it this way for now, take a break, do the giraffe tutorial, and then come back to it. Maybe I will re-render the original with the clay shader, see what it looks like and if its not too bad I will stick with that one. thanks to everyone that gave suggestions, I seem to be either not getting something or something is not working quite right. I'll give it another go tomorrow maybe.

Eric tried that already, didn't work. however, I'm trying something else and it seems to be working. crosses fingers I will post it if I can get it straightened out. hmmm ok I think I am making progress.......I may still have creases in the arm pits but that's not bad compared to how it was.

Ok......I think this is about as close as I'm going to get. Might it not be a better idea to start over from an earlier version, before I attached the arm, and make the circular hole out of a continuous spline, reconnect it to the body, and then attach the arm to that? I think that might be the way to go. Just as I get one area ironed out, another seems to need fixing. Its getting a little tedious. I will save my progress so far, and try modifying the hole, to see if that helps. Here is a screenshot of what I have so far, with a clay material applied. [attachmentid=18419][attachmentid=18420] I think things look better, but given the faceting around the arm I think I have the right idea.

I don't think this is quite it yet, but if it weren't for the peaked or faceted look, I think this would be pretty close. What do you think? I am not quite sure why its doing that. I'll take a look at the tutorial. [attachmentid=18416][attachmentid=18417] Ok, I think I just about have it now. I'm cleaning up some more spots, I'll post in a bit.

For this particular one I would add the points to each spline as I go across - dot, dot, dot, connecting all the splines together and leaving the trailing edges. Then deleting the trailing edges. I would not try to hook this, although I think you can hook up to four (or is it 3?), I would not do it in this case, especially if there will be any further modelling 'out" from the flat edge. Ok, I did the first thing you said----it worked perfectly. Thanks. I was going to start pulling my hair out soon. I will just have to make a note of that. This is just one of those things that I need to stick on a 3x5 card and keep it near the computer, so if I forget I can refer back to it-----until its automatic. Thanks again. BTW, I'm not sure I'm going to use this foot, I will probably modify the hand but I felt it was important to know why it was happening. Thanks.

Yeah, that's pretty much it. Are you making the crossing spline in add-lock mode, or do you just create one long spline, with cp's at the appropriate spots, and THEN start hooking it in? Or, just one spline w/ 2 cp's, one at each end, and then use hooks to attach the vertical members? Roger