itsjustme

Okay, this is just a stop-gap until I get everything worked out. I'll stick with this new odd naming convention for the time being. Changes/fixes in this version: ---------------------------------------------------------- Knees and elbows scale correctly in v12 now. Forearm rolls correctly in v12 now. Foot ball controls combined into one control. CP weighting problem at the waist corrected...and a few other CP weighting tweaks. ----------------------------------------------------------- I'm still thinking about the hand controls and head squetching...next version, hopefully in a day or two. On the foot controls, I only eliminated one by combining both foot ball controls, although I could add the knee rotator to the control...I'm still debating whether to do that. Show of hands? I hadn't been double checking things in v12, I will now. Sorry for any problems this may have caused. In case anyone was wondering, the forearm problem was a percentage on the "aim roll at" constraint on the "forearm_left/right_geom_base" and the elbows and knees problem was a percentage setting in the "scale like" on them. The fixes work in both v11.1 and v12. I'll put my thinking cap on a little longer on the remaining issues.

I've been working in 11.1, I haven't tried it in v12...I'll check that tonight.

Hmmm, could you show me an image, David? Also, how did you manipulate the bones? Here's an image of what I think you're trying to get...this worked without a problem for me in FK. The bicep is rotated 90 degrees on the 'Z' axis using the roll handle, the forearm is rotated about 90 degrees on the 'X' axis the hand is rotated -.05 (X), 53.16 (Y), 97.5 (Z) and the hand is clenched 100%.

Makes sense...I'll have to do some thinking about how best to incorporate a change like that. I'm sure it's doable, I'll spend a little time on it. I'll roll it around in my head a little and see what happens. Thanks for taking the time to give it a once-over, Robert. I should have something in a day or two. Then, I'll update the installation version to match.

I'm not understanding something in this question...the feet controls are separate so that you can isolate each movement, one control for the overall foot position, one for positioning the knee, one for pointing the toe and one for rotating the foot while on the toe. It was the easiest way for me to set it up...the bones your are manipulating are the parent bones of the targeting bones. The arms are a similar setup. One of the things that I tried to eliminate is unintended rotations/movements. Combination controls can be problematic sometimes. It could be done a number of ways...what problems does this way create? Ideally, what would the controls look like to you? Other animators' input is extremely helpful, I want this to be as easy to use and as functional as possible. I could always go back and rework things if this is a deal breaker for everyone. This rig has a lot of unique problems that had to be overcome, my solutions aren't necessarily the best, just what I came up with at the time. I don't doubt it could be rigged in a similar manner...I saw the post, I just haven't looked at the setup. I'll take a look at it tonight. I'm working on the installation version of this rig now...it'll be at least a couple more days until I'm sure it does the job. It's looking like the actual positioning of the bones will be relatively fast once you get used to it...maybe a half hour, the first time will probably take you longer though. The real time is in the CP weighting...that depends on how fast you are at it. It's tough to get everything to work conventionally and squetched (there is only CP weighting, no smarskin on the model)...sometimes I have to compromise unless I want to increase the complexity. I could make the rig more complex, fix it with smarskin, fiddle with the CP weighting some more or a combination of the three. I'll take another look at that as well...maybe a little better job of weighting will do the trick. I probably didn't adequately answer all of the questions you asked, Robert....I'm a little slow sometimes. I'd be willing to try again though. ------------------------------ EDIT ------------------------------ The weighting change did fix the waist squetch problem, Robert...I think I was thinking about the whole torso when I weighted it, but it is better without the chest influence there. I'll have a version with the changes posted late tonight. I'll have to go with "Final_v2" though, just to eliminate confusion.

The foot control bone has it's origin at the center of the calf. You could move it in the bones window to where you want it...I'll take a look at it tonight, it shouldn't cause any problems. The hat has a bone that is the child of the head, you could always change the parenting if you need it to be completely independent.

I found out that I had knocked the right thumb controller askew in the "Final" version, so I had to go back and fix it. I reposted it as the same name because it was dubbed "Final"..."Final_v2" didn't sound very final. Anyway, if you downloaded the final, you'll probably want to re-download it. Sorry for any problems this may have caused.

I went over Squetchy Thom pretty good, I found a couple of flipped normals and an interpolation in the IK pose that needed to be changed to "linear". Other than that, I think he's done. Here's the final on Squetchy Thom. The installation instructions should be finished sometime this week, I made a special version of the rig to try to make it a little easier. I'll post that as well when I'm sure everything works correctly. I'm using the "Loon" for TWO as the test for installation...hopefully, I'll get it posted in a couple of days. Anyway, once again, if you find a problem, let me know. ------------------------------------- EDIT ------------------------------------- I corrected a problem with the right thumb position...sorry for any inconvenience.

The smartskin used in the rig is just for skeletal stuff, Ken. As an example, the on-hand finger curl bones use smartskin to tie the pose slider for curling to the control bone. The actual model geometry is purely CP weighting...I tried to avoid any smartskinning on the actual model so that everything you see the rig do is transferrable. For the most part the CP weighting is enough, if I were to do any smartskinning on the geometry it would be when the arms are scaled to 100% on the slider the elbows look a little strange. It's just careful weighting...moving things to their extremes and adjusting things. That's what I was thinking, it will give me a chance to see how long it would take to transfer the rig to another character. Of course the more times I install the rig, the faster it will go. I'll probably also try it on a more standard looking biped...when I get some time. I haven't tried installing this from scratch completely yet, it's been experimentation and modification thus far, Mike. Now that I have the design worked out, I don't think it would take more than a couple of hours to make the rig. However, the CP weighting might take more time than the actual rig building...I don't use the bone falloff when I'm weighting. Although, the weighting in Squetchy Thom would be a good reference. Actually, it shouldn't be much different from installing the 2001 rig, Bill. The difference though is the layout. I'll be working out a method while trying to install this in a couple of other characters and post my findings.

Okay, I won't call it a final yet, so as to leave me a little time for someone to find a problem. However, here's a version that is the same as the last version except that the bone hiding should be working correctly.

I'll definitely do that...where do I sign up? As has been mentioned earlier in this thread, it would be a good rig for the Loons. I've only seen a couple of the other characters, but it could probably be used in most humanoid bipeds. The finger controls are hidden so that you can manipulate the hand to where you want without them in the way. It's an on/off pose on the "hands" tab of the pose sliders at the top labeled "show_finger_controls". The "hips_IK" bone will move the entire model when translated or rotated...to move the hips independently, use the "hips_lower_controller" bone that points downward from the hips. It looks like you have pointed the "hips_lower_controller" to the character's right...repositioning that should center it again. The squetch controls can move any part of the body independent of the IK/FK setup, so, you can really get things moved around depending on what you're doing. Or am I misunderstanding, Ken? Hmmm, maybe you're having a problem that I had a while back...I was hitting the "force keyframe" button instead of just letting AM auto-key everything. It caused some rotation that I couldn't figure out when I hit that button several times. I'll take a look at the Action later tonight and see if I can isolate what's going on. I'll also go back and nail down the hiding of the controls so that they are hidden when they should be. -------------------------------- EDIT -------------------------------- After taking a look at the Action, I think it's the forcing a keyframe, Mark. If you force a keyframe, set it to key the bone instead of the model...it appeared to work for me that way. Although you might just let it auto key for you. If the "Smart Force Key" is checked in the "Action" tab of the "Options" menu it should set the keys for you for the bones you have manipulated. To set a key on a bone you haven't changed position on, wiggle it and put it back in the same position so that the auto keying will key it as well. Jeff Lew's DVD illustrates this method, it's well worth the money IMHO.

Once again, I think I fixed everything...we'll see how true that actually is though. Changes in this version: ------------------------------------------------- Fixed some parenting that caused problems in the arms when moving the model from the starting position. Added/modified the IK arm controls. There is now a designated translate bone, a designated elbow control and a null controlling bicep roll. ------------------------------------------------- I still have to dig through the poses to fix some of the bone hiding...it doesn't affect usage, but can be annoying. If anyone finds anything that needs fixing, let me know. Mark, if you get the same problem post an Action and I'll try to decipher it using that...but, I think that one is fixed.

I think I know what's happening...I had some strange things happen that made me change some of the parenting, I think it's causing your problem as well (it looks like it's making the shoulder fan bone pop). I also found an arm IK control problem that I'll have fixed. I'll run it through something similar to what you've been doing and see if my other fix cures that problem as well. I'll try to have a new version up by tomorrow. Thanks for giving this thing a workout, Mark. I tend to miss things when I concentrate on a single tree in the forest. I think it's very close though.

Let's try this again....I found a lot of little things I had broken in previous versions. I fixed the problems I found and added some small stuff. I haven't had time to really give this one a good test, but, I'm posting it in case someone sees something I don't. Changes in this version: ----------------------------------------------------- Fixed the remaining twisting of fingers when the hands are stretched to 100%. Fixed the IK being broken in the legs when using the squetch controls. Added a bicep rotation control for IK...I messed with automating it, but decided to leave it as a manual control. Tweaked the elbow CP weighting a little. ------------------------------------------------------ There were other issues I cleared up, I just don't remember if I introduced them while working on this version or if they were pre-existent. Anyway, slap this one around a little and see if it breaks. I'll see about trying that out once I get everything finished, Mark.

I'm not sure at the moment, Drvarceto. I don't think it would take much longer than installing the 2001 rig...that's the first experiment I have on my list once I get this thing finalized. I'm hoping to have another version posted by tomorrow.

It's not completely finished yet, but I haven't posted anything in about a week...so, here's a "so far". I still have to fix the arm rotation in IK to match what happens in FK. Hopefully, in the next day or so I'll get that done. Changes in this version: ------------------------------------------------------ The balls of the feet now have controls in IK...one to bring the heel up and one to rotate on the ball of the foot. The feet controls in IK may look a little busy...maybe I should add a pose to hide them. The arm rotation has been fixed (as far as I can tell) in FK. The biceps rotate using the roll handle on the "right/left_bicep_FK" bones, the forearms have controls limiting their rotation to the 'X' axis. Also, I've added some parent bones to the arm geometry bones to reduce the chances of bone flipping. The finger bone flipping should be fixed, it's the same solution as the arm fix. I added a baseball cap that I modified from the one on the A:M CD...I took off the decal, fixed the brim, took off the roughness of the material and fit it to Thom's head. -------------------------------------------------------- I think that's all of the additions...as far as I can remember at least. If anyone finds any problems, let me know. I'll try to get the IK issues fixed soon. ---------------------------------- EDIT ---------------------------------- Of course, after posting this, I found some things that'll be fixed in the next one with the squetch in the legs breaking the IK control and a slight finger problem when the hand is stretched 100%. Sorry about those.

That would be incredibly cool, David. I hadn't heard that, but if it does get made it would be very nice to have. I'll put that on my list, Mark. Thanks for pointing it out, I definitely need to address that. At this point, I've got the fingers fixed, better bicep rotation, added a shoulder fan bone, added a hat and am in the middle of ironing out some bone flipping things in the arms and fixing the arm rotation in IK. For anyone interested, the twisting in the fingers was caused by bones flipping over when they rotated across from negative to positive in the rotation arc. To fix it, I added one or two bones (one for the second finger joint and two for the third) as parents of the affected bones that would rotate in the same way...this has the effect of reducing the rotation of the bone so that it doesn't reach the flipping point. Hopefully, I'll get some more time to work on it tomorrow...I'll post something as soon as I cover the remaining outstanding issues.

Thanks for taking a look, Drvarceto. Once I get all of the problems fixed, I'll try the rig in another character. It'll be fixed in the next version. I should have something posted in a day or two.

D'oh, I misread this one...the limit on the 'X' for the IK made the elbow unable to move the way it needed to in some positions, so that'll be changed back. I'll see about adding this in the next version. I shouldn't read things when I'm asleep, I guess.

Very cool, thanks Mark. I'm a little reluctant to put an actual face on Thom...he's an icon. I did add the fingers to make sure that everything in the hand would work like I wanted. I thought about putting a hat on him so that you could easily see what direction he was looking since he doesn't have a nose. Which way would you go, David? I haven't tried lately either, Mark...but the last time I did, I found out that the values were still there and just had to be re-entered on the slider itself. Of course with the number of sliders I tend to use, it would be a pain. Thanks for hanging with me...I guess I chose to use the "Release Candidate" designation kinda early. Anyway, I'll go ahead and post something even if it may have a few warts. Let's see if this is closer: Changes in this version: -------------------------------------------------------------- Arm controls for IK have rotation limited to the 'X' axis for contolling the elbows. Fixed a problem in the rotation of the hips. Head and neck by default does not orient like the chest, a percentage slider is now added to accomplish that. The default is now FK arms and IK legs....maybe that has been the case, I forget. Turned the roll handles on the model bone, head, neck and chest bones to face front...I don't know why I had them facing backwards. Added an entire model squetch slider...I think that actually happened on the last version. ---------------------------------------------------------------- There are probably more things to do that I haven't seen yet, but I'll try to nail everything down as soon as I can. Let me know if you see any problems.

D'oh! I fixed a couple of things....sometimes my head doesn't work too good. I'll get it right one of these times. Changes in this version: -------------------------------------------------------------------- Fixed the FK on the arms to work correctly. Made the IK arms percentage sliders instead of on/off. Made the IK legs percentage sliders instead of on/off. Cleaned up some of the organization. --------------------------------------------------------------------

No problem for me, Mark. I'm probably going to give it a week and if I don't hear about any problems I'll do some general organizing and then post a final version...anyone with any issues, feel free to post them here. Once I get this rig finalized, I've got uses for it.

Thanks, Mark. If you notice anything else, let me know. I appreciate any critiques I get, it takes a lot of time to give a thorough review. The hip control is just a bone I added as the parent of a couple of the squetch nulls...the ability was there before, just not in an easily controlled manner. The knee control is a bone that I added as the parent to the knee and thigh targets...so, it is an IK control only. I also forgot to mention that I changed the naming convention from "IK/FK" to "IKFK" so that it wouldn't cause problems when using Expressions (the "/" would be seen as a division symbol).

David and Mark, I owe you guys each a future in-depth critique. I really appreciate it. I found a few things that I had broken in the FK leg controls and addressed the issues brought up thus far. Let's see what you think. Changes in this version: --------------------------------------------------------- Knee rotation independent of the foot control added in IK (control is on the back of the foot below the heel control...it rotates on the Y axis). Added a controller to isolate the hip manipulation (it's the bone pointing downward from the hips). Fixed the broken FK leg controls. Fixed a right foot squetch problem (it didn't have a "scale to reach" set, so it didn't match the left foot). Fixed the scaling of the hand controls when scaling the arms. Fixed the lack of leg rotation (I didn't notice it until I was working on the independent knee rotation). -------------------------------------------------------------- In the interest of showing my sources and giving credit where it is due: The IK foot controls are an adaptation of a David Rogers design...he has a tutorial posted here. Also, the carpal bone controls are the result of reading a series of postings that Raf Anzovin made to this forum (I don't remember where it's located though...anyone remember?) and the bone squetching came from watching the Expressions Tech Talk which you can find here. Once again, if anyone finds anything broken or in need of modifying let me know.

First, thanks for giving the rig a workout, Mark! There's a knee target that is a child bone of the "foot_control_right/left_IK", if you rotate that bone the knee will move...that's in IK, in FK the knee can move anywhere using the "thigh_right/left_IK/FK" bones. I could add another control though, I'll look at that tonight. Here I'm not quite understanding...the heel control is sort of like when you need the foot to say walk a balance beam and the foot needs to wrap around it. In IK, the "foot_control_right/left_IK" bone points the toes if you either move that bone down or lift the character by the "hips_IK" bone. Can you give me an example of a use? It might just need to have something else manipulated to get what you're talking about...are you talking about in FK? I'll take a look at that tonight. Thanks for such a thorough evaluation, Mark! It really helps a lot. Oh, and the resizing of the hand controls on RC2 when scaling the arms will be fixed in the next version as well.