strohbehn
-
Posts
542 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Events
Posts posted by strohbehn
-
-
This morning I went ahead and updated TinServant to include the Simmons Blink slider. The eyelid null function was fixed too.
Here is the file I'm using to update all of the TWO characters to include the Simmons Blink slider. If anyone finds any problems with it, please tell me ASAP because I hope to install this over the rest of the week into all of the characters. It does not include the auto_blink_cyle expression, only the blink slider and the constraints.
[attachmentid=17497] (file updated 6-15-06)
Two questions (probably for Rhett)...
1. How many of the characters currently have an "old" blink slider in them now, and have actions already been made that include the blink?
2. If I rename David's blink slider to "Blink", will all of the actions already made with the old blink slider work correctly with the new blink slider?
-
David (Simmons),
In your "proof of concept" model, why doesn't turning off the auto_eyeblink_cycle pose then allow the eyeblink slider to be manually set?
-
The intent is to have the automation feature available for "background" characters. For our main characters the eyeblink slider would be used, and when I use this I will be setting all of the eyeblink keys in the timeline.... easy, fast, and only one channel.If the automation part is removed and we drive the eyelids with just the eyeblink slider then David's got a good solution. the eyes close properly from all the situations I tried.
What would it take to integrate David's change in the eyelid motion with Mark's left-eye/right-eye eyelid null? To me it looks like they are independent of eachother.
I would much prefer to keep the existing eye setup "as is" and just add David's work on. This is about a 15 minute fix per model. To convert every model over to the left-eye/right-eye eyelid null solution, then add David's work on top would take about 1-2 hours per model. That's too much, I think. We've got our hands full already.
How does that sound, Rhett?
-
That's what I'd like to have: one pose slider with simple translate motion in it. Animatible through one slider in the poses window or a single channel in the timeline, whichever animators prefer to work with.
The left eye/right eye rig change is a nice innovation. We should decide whether that's worth taking the time to make the changes. Adding and changing the way eyelids in FACE are constrained and controlled probably isn't worth the effort when a single pose slider will do the job as well as it will ever need to be done.
PS: Here's how I think of it. Blink pose on top. Key Groups on the bottom. I'd prefer having one line to work on instead of two channels that don't hold actually pose data; changing the Eyes Open/Closed poses doesn't change the animation.
[attachmentid=17414]
Rhett, please take a look at the modified Chopfyt model that David Simmons uploaded to the svn. His solution should give you just about everything you're looking for, and the conversion won't take too long (per model). Please post back here if there's some other functionality you want beyond what David did.
Thanks,
Mark
-
I remember someone mentioning this a long time ago when we were developing FACE, and I believe they sent in a report on it, but I don't know if it was ever resolved. Would you mind sending in a new report on it?
-
Well, Mr. Simmons, it looks like you've done it again with another great solution! Very nicely done.
Since this is a "proof of concept" model I wasn't sure exactly how everything was (or wasn't) supposed to work. I wanted to play with the eyeblink slider by itself, but wasn't able to turn off the autoblink feature, so I deleted the expression that sets the autocycle. Without the autocycle, setting the eyeblink keys on the timeline with only the eyeblink channel (a single channel) is so easy and fast! What I especially like is that even if the eyelids are open different amounts from each other, the blink still works beautifully. I think it's exactly what we need. Your simple method that saves all of our previous work is a huge bonus, too!
The autocycle feature could be useful for background characters, but since the blinks are often associated with eye shifts and emotion I don't think our main characters would be using it much... Definitely worth having in there though.
-
Thanks a lot for looking at this, David. I'm very curious to see what you've done!I had it very nearly working before I had to go to bed...I still need to tweak the Expression. ...As far as overriding the existing "aim at" constraints, the order of the folders will take care of that if I'm right....it appeared to work fine when I was testing using Chopfyt.
Well, the way I had it set up only deals with the EyeLidsNull (joint pose), not the left and RightEyelidsNulls. So, if you are in split mode and move the eyelids the Key Eyes Open and Closed doesn't work correctly. I think it could possibly be fixed by adding the left and right eyelids nulls to the Key Groups, but there seems to be interest in making a blink slider so that only one channel is needed to work with. We'll see what David's got and iron this out ASAP. Keep an eye on this thread, Ken. We could use your input.Mark, what about the automatic blink setting you came up with a while back. You know the way you just clicked the setting on and off to make the keyframe. I thought that took care of this sort of thing no? Or would it not account for changes in the lids previously made?
Mark
-
Thanks for the suggestions.
A problem that I can't figure out is how to override the current "orient like" constraints on the eyelids which make them follow the movement of the eyes. David, I tried your suggestion (the second paragraph so far), and it does close the eyes but they stay closed... even after the blink pose slider is returned to its' 0 value.
I'm thinking that all I really need is a way to make the upper eyelids "orient like" the lower eyelids when a blink pose slider is activated. But, again, the problem is the current "orient like" eyeball that's already there. Would I have to put that constraint into its' own pose, then turn that one off when the blink pose is activated (with its' "orient like" lower eyelid constraint)?
Need a little help here with multiple constraints....
-
Howdy all,
This is for all TWO riggers and animators.
Rhett is looking for an easier way to automate eyeblinks, so I've been experimenting with a different EyeLidsNull mechanism. We tested a simple pose slider, but the problem with that is that it only works when the eyelids start from a neutral position. If one of the lids is open further than another, the eyes don't come together at the same time.
Please take a look at the TinServant_AlternateEyeControl_Test1d.mdl I uploaded to TinServant's svn folder. It has instructions in the logfile on how to test it.
See if you think it's any improvement over the original Eyelid functionality. Changing each TWO model over to this would take 30-45 minutes, so it's no small matter. It would also mess up any eyelid animation that's already been done.
As I'm typing this, I wonder if a pose slider using some type of expression could be made that would close both eyes to the same position, regardless of their starting point. Could this be done? If so, it would be a much faster, less intrusive fix. Any ideas?
Mark (Strohbehn)
-
I'm going to be working on the eyelids for the rest of the characters and will be using a smartskin for the upper and lower lids. If I do one side and "mirror all smartskins", are there other smartskins on these models that could be messed up by performing this operation? As I understand the "mirror all smartskins" operation, it doesn't affect any smartskins that have not been altered. So this should be safe to do, right?
-
Here's the quick fix:
1. Delete the Euler Limit constraints from the LEye and REye bones.
2. For the LEye bone "Aim at LEyeNull" constraint, set its X-translate offset to 9cm.
3. For the REye bone "Aim at REyeNull" constraint, set its X-translate offset to -9cm.
-
Boy, am I glad it didn't work out for me to make the Hash Bash trip...
People show up for what's billed as a fun-filled get together, only to find out that Martin's running a A:M sweatshop! If you look closely at the photos you'll see that everyone's ankles are shackled to the floor.
-
I'll leave it alone for a couple of days to make sure I don't conflict your work.
If you want to look at it yourself, try setting the Eye bones' "Euler constraint" enforcement value to 0 and see if that does the trick. I'm not near A:M today, so can't be sure, but am thinking it's either an "Euler constraint" or a "Spherical Limit constraint" I used to prevent the eyes from going too far to the sides. You may be able to remove it completely if it's not needed.
-
Ken, it's just a matter of adjusting (and possibly deleting) one of the constraints I put in to limit eye travel. It's not a big deal to fix, I just have to take a look at it again since it's been awhile since I've tinkered with it. It occurs on some of the characters that have eyes that start out not positioned looking straight ahead.
Let me look into it tonight and I'll post a note with instructions for how to fix this. I did it on most of the models that were affected, but am sure I missed some.
-
Here's the deal... I've been working on a model that I haven't posted to the svn recently because I'm experimenting with adding 2 extra spline rings inside the mouth, next to the lips, to allow a better NarrowOO shape. Since the mesh is now different from King Bal and Generic Loon, it makes sense that the poses don't copy over; however, I also tried to copy the poses from the svn version of Chief Loon, which should have the identical mesh to the other two, and it still didn't work properly.Mark, do you have an update to the chief loon on the svn?
As another test, I made a test pose on King Bal and dragged it onto Generic Loon. That didn't work either, so I'm thinking we've got three completely distinct meshes on these three characters.
Any suggestions for how we could get this to work?
-
Good going, Mark. I'll try to make the transfer from Chief Loon to the two characters you mentioned. That would be a great time saver.I was able to transfer Chopfyts facial poses to Nick Chopper. King Bal and generic loon may possible get a transfer from Chief Loon.
Update: The pose transfer from Chief Loon to the others didn't work. The results were that either the mesh distorted all wrong, or nothing happened at all. Not sure why it didn't work?
-
Chief Loon's FACE poses are about 85% done. Thanks for posting the list, Ken.
-
There's not much published yet regarding animating with the FACE interface. Most of what's out there relates to installing it and making the poses.
Based on Jason Osipa's "Stop Staring" method, and modified for our A:M version of his work, here's a quick overview of how animation workflow is intended to go.
1. Turn on the FACE interface to the Joint Controls setting (the 1 position).
2. The first couple of lipsync passes of your facial animation should be done using almost exclusively the Sync Null and the Lips Null, because this gives the mouth Narrow/Wide, and Open/Closed poses and all of the lip movements to form every phoneme (or viseme in Osipa's terminology). These two controls should get you about 80% of the way done. It's designed this way to make lipsync animation very fast.
3. Use the rest of the Joint Controls to block in the rest of the facial details.
4. When it's time to add in asymmetrical details, turn the FACE interface to the Split Controls setting (2 position) and tweek the poses. Remember that if one of the Joint poses is maxed out, moving its' split pose won't do anything (i.e. if the Sneer joint pose is maxed out, moving the left or right Sneer pose won't do anything).
Because of the item I just mentioned, you'll want to avoid switching back and forth between the Joint Controls and the Split Controls very often, so try to do as much of your facial animation as possible initially using the Joint Controls before switching to the Split Controls for adding asymmetry.
-
I'm still having trouble with Woot's face controls. I also have problems with Woot's Mom face controls, different problems (eyebrows, jaws, smile controls do not respond). I've reported Woot's face issues, but I have no instructions as to what to do next. I updated Woot's model, still same problem. I don' seem to have these problems with Shaggy's pose sliders. I'm stumped.
Scarecrow's eyelids don't work either. Woot's Mom's eyelids work but nothing else.
I tested Woot and Scarecrow. FACE controls worked perfectly. Scarecrow needs cheek puff and Dimple poses, but that's no big deal yet.
Woot's mom's poses haven't been completed yet. That's why the controls don't appear to work.
Are you sure you're using the interface properly, Dhar? Please see Ken's post on page 11 of this thread for instructions (Apr 18 2006, 07:33 PM Post #154).
-
Just make sure that the CP's on your center spline (from the front view) have 0 as their X-coordinate. You're correct, the model's feet should rest on the 0 Y-coordinate (ground plane).
-
Thanks, Chris. You may need to increase the mirror mode tolerance in the Tools>Options>Modeling tab to get your CP's to mirror. Paul Forwood's suggestion is the best way to start out. If you've already done a lot of work that you might lose by deleting half your mesh, and mirror cp's still doesn't work, then try Mirrorsplines.Thanks for this seminar - very informative! I'm having issues with the "mirror cps" command - where can I find the "mirror splines" plug-in? I'm using A:M 12u+.Here's info on MirrorSplines:
http://www.geocities.jp/masashi_wolf_watan...linesIntro.html
It's inexpensive and has several very useful features. Mirroring the splines worked for me in the V13alpha.
Paul, hop in and take one of the TWO characters FACE poses on. There are still several models that need work. And thanks for the reply regarding Chris' question.Mark, thankyou for the tutorial. Really well done! I will attempt all of this at some point.Chris, if you copy half your model and paste it into a new model window, align your model so that the central spline encircles 0,0,0 and then do a copy/flip attach you should end up with a perfectly symetrical model which responds correctly to 'mirrored' operations. If I missed your point I'm sorry.
Mark
-
I agree with Ken.
The speed of the actual crowing doesn't strick me as beeing too fast, it's the stuff before that that's too much. It's a fairly short clip, so simplify it more. If anything, maybe a quick leg kick (backward scratch) or two instead of the weave-and-bob thing.
Nice job so far, though.
-
Here's the latest addition to the FACE demo video library:
Creating_FACE_Muscle_Poses_that_Blend.qt (20:37 min, 35.56MB):
http://www.hash.com/strohbehn/Creating_FAC...s_that_Blend.qt
After a brief review of how FACE works, this video demonstrates how to make poses using Copy/Paste Keyframe techniques (better, simpler techniques this time around). It also deals with the problem of blending 2 muscle poses (Split poses) that each cross the midline of a model.
I'm also adding this to the list of demo videos available in the first post that started this thread. If you haven't looked at those and are interested, go check 'em out. They'll answer nearly every question you have regarding FACE... how it works, how to make it work with your model, etc.
Adios
-
That would make life easier as far as having to add all of this to the existing rigs.Much as I like the on/off pose feature that key groups provide I think I would prefer to use the copy action to action method
Thanks for chiming in here, Bob. We (I) kind of swerved off the path with these latest additions. Your points are well-taken and I'm now thinking we just need to stick with the bare necessities of "Reset FACE controls" and possibly the Eyes Open/Closed key which only uses a few constraints. These alone were worth the detour, though.This is an interesting and clever use of the Auto-Switching feature. The net result is a simple and quick way to drop pre-determined keyframes (poses, morph targets) into an animation. Although it is easy to use, it doesn't seem easy to set up. The extra bones and constraints to create this are superfluous, and most likely tedious to set up. Additionally every bone and constraint added to a model slightly slows AM's ability to animate through frames quickly.Bob
It's great to get your professional advice before spending too much time flailing around with counter-productive "solutions".
Witch model may have technical issues
in TWO Rigging
Posted
Could someone please take a look at Witch and see what the deal is with the spline references under Relationships>User Properties. I was going through the models adding David Simmons' eye blink slider and found this. I don't have a clue what it is, but don't ever remember seeing it before.
The model's svn history shows a conflict resolution on model 3240, and this is the first time those spline references appear, as far as I can tell.
Maybe it's nothing, but when I tried to install the eyeblink slider it didn't go well, so maybe it's something that needs attention.