Am I missing something?

[robinsn]

I was having trouble controlling my old skeletons - rolling, range of motion, etc. From what I could tell, TSM2 was supposed to help supply a more usable skeleton. I figured that it would give some semblance of reality in motion. I didn't expect it to be all set up for me, but I did expect it to help.

 

With the great help of another user (I bought TSM2 but have Tiger and it doesn't work) I put the TSM2 skeleton in my model, assigned CPs, and just to test the motion, I created an action and moved the arm (haven't started on smartskin, fanbones, etc). Below is what I get. When you build and install a skeleton with TSM2, doesn't it have some sort of constraints or anything installed with it?

 

I'm fairly new to AM and I think I understand how to do a lot of it, but I'm very frustrated just trying to get bones to move like they're supposed to and not twirl around in circles, bend around to the inside of the body, bend backwards, etc. Which is why I bought TSM2. Maybe this isn't something it will help me with?

 

Can someone tell me if I'm trying to use the wrong tool to help with my problem or am I just doing something wrong with TSM2?

 

Thanks!

[luckbat]

Um... You haven't run the rigger yet. The rigger is what installs all the constraints and extra bones. Right now all you have is your base skeleton, which has no constraints whatsoever, beyond what you add to it.

 

The TSM2 rigger uses your base skeleton as a guide to adding the network of "control bones," relationships and constraints that make up the TSM2 rig.

[robinsn]

Oh, I see! I guess you can tell how frustrated I've been with this bone thing. I just haven't been able to do what should be fairly simple. I've done tons of tutorials but nothing seemed to give me the answer.

 

So let me ask you this then - why are there 4 bones in the arm (not counting the shoulder and hand) when there's only one joint? How do you assign CPs to the bones or whatever you would do so that the arm doesn't bend in the wrong places? I would think that the bones would reflect real bones - one upper arm, one lower arm.

[luckbat]

The doubled arm and leg bones exist only to provide squash & stretch capabilities to your model. The rest of the time, they're locked together and move as a unit.

 

You should assign your arm and leg CPs to whichever bone is closest. That way, when the bones stretch, your CPs will slide along for the ride.

 

You might not think you need squash & stretch on a robot, but it comes in handy when you least expect it. For example, if a character is pointing directly at the camera, you can stretch out the arm, which makes the pointing hand look closer and more dramatic. The audience probably won't even realize you're distorting anything.

 

At other times, just using 1% of the stretchiness can help "sell" a quick movement or hard impact, even if you don't want to visibly deform your character.

[robinsn]

I see. That clears up a lot. Thanks.

[robinsn]

This is getting frustrating. I got the model rigged and it works much better! However, if I try to animate it with a saved action, nothing happens. In the TSM2 manual it says turn on Constraints and TSM Constraints. I turned on TSM Constraints, but have been looking for 30 minutes trying to find where to turn Constraints on. In the TSM manual it shows an image of the pose slider with Constraints and TSM Constraints. It's not there! (See image) I've run out of places to look.

 

Can someone please tell me how to turn on Constraints in V12 OSX? My only thought on it as that I did not add any constraints yet myself, only those that came with TSM2. Perhaps that's why it's not there? That doesn't explain why the actions don't work though.

 

Or is there some other reason that Hash's actions don't effect my model? I can animate the model and it works, but using, for instance, a walk cycle that comes with AM doesn't work.

 

Thanks again for any help!

poseslider.tiff

[luckbat]

Well, I've got good news and bad news.

 

The good news is, that whole "constraints" pose you're looking for is a non-issue. I'm pretty sure it's a holdover from TSM1, when the user had to place all of his or her skeletal constraints into a single pose called "Constraints" in order for the TSM rigger to integrate with them. That restriction seems to be gone in TSM2, so I guess the manual could use a little tweaking.

 

The bad news is, you're not going to be able to use the Hash actions. Actions are designed to be exported and reused, but only on models with identical rigs. All the Hash actions are designed for one specific rig known as the "2001" rig (sometimes called the "Eggington" rig). Many of the models on the CD, like Thom, are built using this one rig. So you can make the Knight dance the can-can, but not your robot.

 

Frustrating, I know. There is one saving grace, however, and that is that a good number of animators on the forum do much of their work with TSM2 skeletons, and I'm sure any of them, myself included, would be happy to donate some assorted TSM2 actions and walk cycles if you asked them nicely.

[robinsn]

Thanks, Mike! I'd say that's good news and okay news. At least it's not something that I'm doing wrong!

 

I hadn't realized that the rig was that essential to everything. Man there's a lot to learn!

 

It would be great if some nice, kindly TSM2 user who had such a collection of basic actions would be generous enough to share some of them with a novice such as myself who would really appreciate it and who fully expects to not be a novice for long and can return the favor sometime and also pass on the kindness to other novices who are just starting out!

[Eric2575]

Hi RobinSn:

 

I'm so happy to see that I am not the only one who has trouble with TSM2. When I read your post, it mirrored exactly what I was and am going through right now.

 

I did not understand and it wasn't made clear why there are so many bones in what should be one bone structures. As Luckbat pointed out, the extra bones are for streching. Why that isn't made perfectly clear in the TSM2 instructions is beyond me. Seems to be something basic and easy to include.

 

Something else to include is the little bit of advice Luckbat mentioned: assign cps closest to the bones. Again, it seems intuitive, but when you have never used TSM2 or are just a beginner to bones, etc, the instructions should just make a point of nailing that down.

 

Why isn't there a tutorial avi and mov file included in TSM2 that takes a more than basic human model, such as a Centaur for example, and shows the setup and rigging with detailed explanations for every step?

 

I'm so gald we have this forum, without which I would have a much harder time figuring out TSM2.

 

Keep sharing your experiences and good luck.

 

Eric