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Contest Forum?

would you like a contest forum?  

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some facts (afaik anyway) to start with:

 

- hash contests sometimes have low participation

- it is policy that contest entries are not to be shown before voting

 

i think this could be improved by allowing WIP threads for the contests.

 

-> responses from the community to the wip could keep the artists' interest alive and make them go the whole way.

 

-> quality of the entries could even be improved since the artist would get early criticism for the project.

 

-> contest deadlines could be prolonged if there are many active wips, but few final submissions.

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I voted yes as I think it is a good idea. The only problem I can see is that knowing who created an entry could influence some peoples voting. It shouldn't I know, but it might, and is presumably why entrants names are witheld until voting is complete.

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Long time no see. Welcome back! :D

 

- it is policy that contest entries are not to be shown before voting

I'm not sure, but I think the policy rather is that the entries should be anonymous before voting and personally, I think this is a good policy.

 

If it's possible to allow anonymous WIP treads in a dedicated Contest Forum, I'm all for it and I think it will probably bring more interest to the contests as you say.

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previous concerns center around the contest moving farther away from a relative comparison of finished results and more towards a popularity contest.

 

i do agree that it would increase participation, and might even result in improved results, but i have little faith in most of the voters to truly evaluate each image on it's merits, and not on their personal relationships.

 

on the pro side, the benefits of winning a contest are relatively few, so i doubt money would change hands. ' ' )

 

-jon

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I've gotta say yes to this one.

 

It'd be nice to go to one place to see all the contests that are available and get specific information related to them. It can be hard to keep track of deadlines, themes and entry rules...

 

I'm sure whatever concerns might exist (i.e. the popularity contest stuff) can be addressed.

 

I'm assuming contests outside of Hash Inc's could be publicized but I'm not sure what is under consideration. The rules of the specific contest could relate whether publicly posting WIPs and images were allowed prior to the vote.

 

I say "Yea".

 

Rodney

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I have always thought that there should be a contest page here in the forums to remind people what contests are currently running, what the subject is, what the deadline is, what the rules are, etc., etc.

 

I think posting of contest wips, however, would jeapordize fare judging. I know that that's the way they do it at CG Talk, and it can be educational, but it does encourage CG groupies and people end up voting for the artist instead of the art.

 

So I voted YES for a contest forum but prefer no wips until the contest has finished. :)

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Here is what I think the purpose of a "contest" is for...

 

Someone is learning the skills... they can create and get critiques on their skills and execution in the wip section or other places whatever...

 

I see the "contest" as a "test". The contest should be TOTALLY anonymous. The entrant is entering it to show what they are capable of AT THAT MOMENT IN TIME.

 

Getting input and advice after the fact is a good thing... so their skills are improved for the next one... but...

 

When people reveal their intentions for a "contest" entry... from the start... to the end... it eliminates the.... "surprise"... it removes the whole process of discovery on the part of those judging...

 

You've seen it develop... you already know what it is... there is no... first look... fresh new eyes on it...

 

I honestly don't think a contest entry should be seen until the moment it is revealed at the judging phase. They are using all of their skills and knowledge in a competition. They shouldn't be getting advice on "how to win". They should hone their skills prior to entering.

 

--------------

 

I voted yes for the contest forum... but I think it should be repository for questions about a particular contest... posts regarding OTHER non Hash related contests... questions and critiques after the voting is done.

 

Just my spin on things.

 

Vernon "!" Zehr

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I voted for a contest forum.....and I do understand and prefer the contest be annon. ,,,,,,,But !!!! as for myself and maybe others I like to use a model or two of my own in the animation, and the model usually has been seen in the WIP or Showcase forum where I have posted it of a critique, so the anno..would be lost there, does anyone suggest we not use a model that can be linked back.? ...I didn't think so......Still I agree about it not being a popularity, or grudge vote.....there are a few folkes out there that wouldnt vote for a certain animation if they knew who did it, regardless.

 

Michael

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I would go for a contest forum being there just to let people know which ones are running and when they finish along with some cursory details about them. You could have a system where you can’t reply to the topics started; dates and information can be given but not have the results tainted with personality contests, spite and sympathy votes.

 

Favouritism will have a negative impact should there be WIP threads prior to the deadline and, for some reason, something bugs me about producing artwork by committee when it’s supposed to be an individual making the work with their own creative bent. Asking for opinions after the event is what I would expect to happen and (dare I say it?) more honest.

 

The anonymity needs to remain.

 

Steve.

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Anyone who is incapable of being unbiased in their voting... wouldn't be chosen as a judge in any "official" venue...

 

...However we can't pick the judges in the public contests... so... all I can say is that I personally never base my voting on any personal bias beyond the content...

 

If it is great... and I like it... it gets my vote regardless of how fat or bald or dysfunctional the artist... or if they use crystals for water divination...

 

 

;)

 

Vernon "!" Zehr

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i aggree, anonymity usually is a plus for contests. but when favourism comes into play, i think it doesnt help much that the name isnt added to the image, as someone could just send out some mails like "hey, go there and there and vote for my pic, its the 3rd row down, 2nd pic, the yellowish ball."

 

of course i could be wrong about that, but as i have experienced this great hash community, i think (most) people are mature enough to be fair.

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How about this....everything is anonymous until after the judging, then, the work-in-progress threads are opened to the public for help/critique/assessment? That way, anyone looking to improve gets the input they need to do so and you still keep the integrity of the competition. Also, the community might pick up tips on how to tackle problems they haven't encountered yet from more experienced animators.

 

Just a thought...it may be a silly one, but it' s a thought.

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Would it really change anything?

 

Don't most people hit "view new posts" when they come here?

 

Putting the contest stuff in a forum labeled "contests" wouldn't make it more visible than anywhere else.

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What I meant is having the WIP threads in a locked section of the forum like the Fellows area until after the voting, then, posting them in an area where they are available to everyone for feedback once the results are announced (or just unlocking that particular contest area).

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this solution would upheld the anonymity rule, but i think it would defeat most of the purpose.

 

but maybe this would work:

the contest forum threads could be "anonymous" threads until the contest is closed.

 

i'm not sure, if the forum software supports this feature or if it could be added, but it seems pretty straight forward to do:

 

in the modules that handle

- index.php?showtopic=XXX

- index.php?act=Post

 

the names, signatures, email buttons, avatars etc. of the posters should just not be shown, if the thread is set to "anonymous".

 

if its too difficult to add a property to the thread,

the description could be set to "anonymous" by the creator.

when he wants to "un-anon" his threat, he can just edit that to say something else.

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Putting the contest stuff in a forum labeled "contests" wouldn't make it more visible than anywhere else.

 

Rob,

Actually it would make contest announcements more visible than where it can currently be found. Currently information can only be found on the web page after the contest and when announced by Steve. All other information is posted helter-skelter throughout the forum.

 

A Contest Forum could collect the oft asked questions that we are all familiar with that come up each contest.

- The Themes

- The Rules

- The voting process

 

It would also be a great place to collect those critiques everyone says they want.

 

I'm not suggesting a Contest Forum would lead to the end of recurring questions but at least there would be a place to send people to get that information.

 

...and consider this...

 

Not every contest needs to be of the same level as the Monthly Image/Animation contests. This might be the place people could post mini-contests such as Avatar contests, Character Jams and more...

 

...getting people involved and exercising their skills seems to be the thing.

 

(My take)

Rodney

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Great idea!!!

 

I think that this would really improve participation in the contests, however although I agree that there is a need for anonymity, quite often it is easy to recognize most of the participants beacuse of their distinctive styles!!!

 

Anuway, I plan to participate in the next contests, so see you in the forum

 

Drvarceto

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As someone who has yet to contribute anything of value, I would be hard pressed to put too much weight into my opinion. But... ;-)

 

I like the idea. One stop shopping for those who want contest specific info. Competition usually gets the blood flowing and anything that increases overall program awareness and use is a good thing.

 

As far as the WIP questions, what if a couple of volunteers (HASH Fellows or others) provided anonymous feedback to WIP's while the contest was rolling. No one else would see the results until voting time, but the person entering the contest would still be able to receive good advice before the contest deadline. This keeps the entries fresh for the common folk while allowing someone to get much needed feedback while creating their works of art.

 

As far as using "View New Posts" is concerned, I use that function every time I log on. However, there are times when I can't review all of the new entries before having to log off. When I come back and click "View New Posts" again, there are frequently many threads that I have missed and only find while crawling around the individual sub-forums.

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what if a couple of volunteers (HASH Fellows or others) provided anonymous feedback to WIP's while the contest was rolling. No one else would see the results until voting time,

 

Masking/Unmasking - Hiding/Unhiding posts from the various entrants is expensive in maintenence time for whomever would be in charge of such a thing. As security rights go it would probably fall to Hash Inc. to keep it running...

 

I don't see it happening.

 

Secrecy isn't the way to go; whatever the percieved benefit might be. A WIP should be enjoyed by all or not even started.

 

Now nothing says that contests outside of the Monthly Image/Animation Contests couldn't have a WIP running to collect C&C. That'd be nice. Then we could rock the contests of the world. :)

 

(Just one opinion)

Rodney

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