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Squetchy Thom


itsjustme

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Noel, I downloaded the plugin, copied it to the proper folder, started A:M... it says that it is not woking (Unable to load plugin...) AAAAARRRRRGHHHHH!!!

 

Is it v12 exclusive?!? I am (for forseeable future) stuck with v11.1!

 

Could something be done???

 

PPPPPPlllleeeeeeaaaaaaasssseeeee!!!!!

 

drvarceto

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Is it v12 exclusive?!? I am (for forseeable future) stuck with v11.1!

 

Unfortunately, the IK/FK switch that is in the arms and legs will only work properly in v12n+ or better, Drvarceto.

 

Here's a version that fixes a couple of finger issues...I didn't have a lot of time today. I'll try to get to it again tomorrow.

 

For anyone installing the previous version, you can update it by:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In the "Rig_components/arm_constraints/hand_constraints" pose, the "right_finger_index_control" needs the "store roll" turned off on the "orient like" constraint.

 

The smartskins for both ring fingers needs to be replaced.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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David, I have to say that IK/ FK switch has never been issue for me... as long as the squetching works, everything is fine...

 

However, I have to say that transfering of the bones is major issue... After 3 instalements of the rig, it takes me more than one hour just to move bones around... (and I am not sure that I did that properly)

 

Thank you again for the fantastic work that you have done...

 

I just ask for the small re-compiling of the plugin for us poor, old fashioned mortals that cannot upgrade... sniff, sniff ;-P

 

drvarceto

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Noel, I downloaded the plugin, copied it to the proper folder, started A:M... it says that it is not woking (Unable to load plugin...) AAAAARRRRRGHHHHH!!!

 

Is it v12 exclusive?!? I am (for forseeable future) stuck with v11.1!

 

Could something be done???

 

PPPPPPlllleeeeeeaaaaaaasssseeeee!!!!!

 

drvarceto

 

Sorry I've got to much on my plate to go back and figure out what would need to change to get it to work in v11.1 (that is assuming the v11.1 sdk supports it)

I feel bad, but I'd feel worse not suporting the users who do upgrade.

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Here's an update on the previous version.

 

Changes in this version:

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Shoulder controls are visible in IK, but hidden in FK now.

 

Added a child of the "chest_controller" that stretches when the chest stretches. It doesn't squash with the chest because I figured it would just make things harder to control. The controller that you manipulate will remain the same size.

 

Fixed the forearm rolling and increased the amount they can roll a little.

 

Fixed a couple of the bone hiding poses.

 

Fixed FK feet...the IK/FK switch still needs tweaking though.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

After some playing around with it, the whole body squetching works best with FK legs.

 

I did some experiments with the arms and still got a lot of twisting if everything is connected...I don't have a problem with the arm controls, but if anyone still thinks they should be different (or there are problems with them) I'll take another stab at it.

 

If you are in the middle of an installation or have the rig installed, you can update it by:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

changing out the "Rig_Components/arm_constraints_folder/arm_constraints" pose

 

changing out the "Animation_Controls/Arm_Controls/right/left_arm_FK_IK" and "Animation_Controls/Arm_Controls/right/left_arm_FK_IK" " poses

 

changing out the "Show_and_Hide_Rig_Components/show_geom_bones" pose

 

duplicating the "chest_controller", make the duplicate a child of the "chest_controller" with the "spine_1_stomach_aim" and "spine_2_mid_section_aim" bones as children...rename the new bone "chest_controller_SQUETCH".

 

changing out the "spine_3_chest_SQUETCH" pose.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Here's the latest installation version and Squetchy Thom.

 

Changes in this version:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

IK hands and feet are now nulls.

 

"hips" is now a null.

 

Corrected the FK foot control bone positioning during installation.

 

Updated the installation instructions to include fixing the FK feet.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

I'll post how to upgrade the previous version later tonight.

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Sorry I've got to much on my plate to go back and figure out what would need to change to get it to work in v11.1 (that is assuming the v11.1 sdk supports it)

I feel bad, but I'd feel worse not suporting the users who do upgrade.

How about posting the source code to the SDK forum and seeing if someone would be willing to take up the problem?

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Hi David,

 

An interesting rig you've got there. I notice that the knees keep flipping backwards when the feet pass pelvis height in IK mode. This might cause a problem for exaggerated movements.

 

The way I got round that problem was to place the knee pointing device within a parent bone that is either a child of the foot control bone or translates to it, and aim the parent at a target on the hip/pelvis bone. That way the pointing of the knee and leg roll in general moves relative to the foot position. I've not had a really close look at the rig so I don't know if this type of fix requires a complete overhaul, but I thought I'd mention it for consideration.

 

Apologies if I've missed a discussion on this glitch.

 

Steve.

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An interesting rig you've got there. I notice that the knees keep flipping backwards when the feet pass pelvis height in IK mode. This might cause a problem for exaggerated movements.

 

Thanks Steven! I'm actually in the middle of an overhaul of the legs anyway, so this advice is very timely. I'm hoping to get it done sometime tonight...we'll see if that happens. Thanks for looking it over. I checked out your hand and face gizmos, very nice.

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Hey David;

 

How's everything going? Are you communicating directly with Mark Skodacek (mtpeak2)? I think we have half a dozen TWO models approved and ready to go.

 

Martin Hash

 

I've been trying to make the IK/FK switch work correctly, Martin. The problem comes in when you switch from FK to IK...I think it's the way the kinematic constraint solves for rotation, but that's just a guess on my part. I've spent a week trying to get it to cooperate. Bob Croucher is taking a look at it. Once I have a solution, I can post an update. Sorry for the delay.

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I was wondering if my Hand Gizmo would be useful to this rig? I've now put squetchy functionality into it and it can be varied somewhat. You can find it here for testing.

 

I've only just finished it... well... I had a celebratory cup of coco between now and then... I'd be very interested to hear what it's like to use.

 

Steve.

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David, how are things going? I just become accustomed to have update of your rig every two days and now 10 days and no update?!? I am getting a bit od abstinence syndrom here!!! (LOL, just kidding)

 

I was just wondering if thre will be major changes in your rig, except for the larger autonomy of the leg movement?

 

I find it quite useful at it is now (this is absolute understatement: I find it AMAZINGLY useful), and I hope that I will be able to start animating with it (last posted version, I have started re- installing it into my avatar character) one of the next few days... in the meanwhile I was playing with the scarecrow model - rig is real joy to use...

 

Thanks again, drvarceto

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I was just wondering if there will be major changes in your rig, except for the larger autonomy of the leg movement?

 

The problem with the IK/FK switch is still being worked on, once that is resolved I'll have the arms and legs done. I'll have to wait for the solution in order to know what will be required to get it to work correctly.

 

As it stands right now, I have improved the finger controls so that they work properly, but, if we can manage it in time I'm going to try to get the functions of Steven Cleary's hand gizmo adapted. If we can't get it into the rig in time, we'll try to make it an easy add-on for already installed rigs and include it in future installation versions.

 

Sorry for the delay, Drvarceto.

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David,

 

Keep the chin up, man! You are doing a great service for the community (to say nothing of the TWO movie project)... While we all anxiously await the final results, we really appreciate your efforts and need to be patient, it will be worth the wait!

 

Thanks, and keep on keepin' on!

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No sweat, David!

 

You got us spoiled here! You have done something amazing for the community, and please do not feel pressurized to hurry anywhere...

 

I just wish I had your will and determination to push mu personal projects through as good as you do... I have really worked hard only with a looming deadline over my head...

 

No hurry, rig is perfectly useful as it is...

 

Drvarceto

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Okay, here's the latest version...keep in mind that it hasn't been tested in a version that has the fix for the problem with the IK/FK switch. In v12 and the first alpha for 13, the arms and legs will twitch when making the change from FK to IK. It should be fixed in the next version of 13.

 

Some other things to keep in mind:

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At present, when you bend the fingers beyond 90 degrees there is some bone flipping in the finger controller.

 

The knees are set to follow the feet in IK, you can't use the knee controllers to rotate the knees while it is set that way. If you turn the knee follow down to 0%, then the knee controllers work. the reason for this is it's the only way I could get the IK/FK switch to work consistently. I realize it's a pain, if you have a better solution I'll be happy to put it in.

 

The elbows are controlled using the bicep bone in IK. I didn't add the same kind of control that is on the knee because I was trying to make it as simple as possible to reduce any problems from the IK/FK switch. If it's a problem, I can make it the same as the knees.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

I'll try to have a fix for the fingers posted in the next day or so. If you find any other problems, let me know.

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Hey David.

 

Unfortunely I have some issues with the rig. I've been rerigging the rabbit model for the TWO project with the new installation rig. First is the x rotation on the knee controller when rotating the hip null and the hips_lower_controller. The second thing, which could be a result of something I did, is the feet don't seem to want to stay planted on the ground when translating the hips and lower_controller. Here's a clip showing the problem.

 

I'm starting to get the feeling that the rig is becoming too complexed, too many thing trying to work together correctly, it needs to be simplified. Is there anyway to downsize this rig without losing the squetch capabilities? The fk/ik switch can be done with just geometry bones and a hand target. Personally, I'd rather have the blending method, but that's me. I've been looking into combining the 2 method so you could do both, but there goes the simplicity. Thanks.

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I have finished installing of the previous version (11.20.2005) of the rig... Moving the bones around took me a while (I am still and for forseable future using older version of A:M), especially when I realized (after erasing of the INSTALL bone that I have it put somewhere else then intended)...

 

Anyway, this being only one - time chore, it is not terribly hard to do... but!!! I agree that this thing has grown, and grown, and... and if things can be done easier (Obviously IKFK switch has made things much more complicated then originally intended), maybe they should (even if it means little bit more work for the animators) and anyway, although I have more than a few minutes (experimental) animation done, I have used such a thing (The switch ;oP ) only once... maybe it is just me...

 

(This previous sentence is my personal record in lenghth and not getting the message through as intended, but I like it like that)

 

I also agree with Mark that making things more complicated makes them also more prone to mistakes (or should I say bugs)...

 

drvarceto

 

p.s. David, I am bitching here about something that I could not even think of achieving myself, so if you feel that this is beside the point, please feel free to ignore me ;oD

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First is the x rotation on the knee controller when rotating the hip null and the hips_lower_controller. The second thing, which could be a result of something I did, is the feet don't seem to want to stay planted on the ground when translating the hips and lower_controller.

 

Sorry about that, Mark. The "right/left_knee_IK_rotator" and "right/left_knee_controller" need to be parented to the "base_bone". That should fix that. I'm not sure about what's going on with the second problem.

 

Personally, I'd rather have the blending method, but that's me.

 

Honestly, that would be my vote as well. I would've been done a long time ago if we had gone that route. The IK/FK switch is a good idea, but it needs more testing. The problem came in because of the kinematic constraint, there was some odd twisting that made it where there would always be a twitch when going from FK to IK. The next alpha version is supposed to have a fix, so, I haven't been able to test it. I have been beating my brains in for two weeks trying to get this thing to work with the help of Noel and Bob (who have been very accomodating).

 

Since there is a push to get this done, I'm all for dropping the IK/FK switch and just go with the blending method...that's what I'm going to do. I'll post something tonight (probably late tonight).

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Since there is a push to get this done, I'm all for dropping the IK/FK switch and just go with the blending method...that's what I'm going to do. I'll post something tonight (probably late tonight).

Hold that in reserve until we've determined the IK/FK switch is a bum. (There's good reasons not to do the blend.)

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Hold that in reserve until we've determined the IK/FK switch is a bum. (There's good reasons not to do the blend.)

 

Okay, I'll hold off. It takes time to get something new to work, I hate being the one holding up the parade though.

 

I'll work on the problems that exist at the moment then and see if I can get the Hand Gizmo installed, Steven just sent me a file.

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Okay, latest update....with special thanks to Steven Cleary for his "Steve's Hand Gizmo" adaptation.

 

Changes in this version:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Inclusion of "Steve's Hand Gizmo"...I think I got it in there right, but double check me, Steve.

 

Fixed a squetch problem with the index fingers.

 

Fixed a problem when changing from IK to FK when the heel is raised.

 

Fixed the problem when the fingers were bent beyond 90 degrees.

 

Updated the installation instructions.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

I haven't installed this in Squetchy Thom yet, but, I'll post Scarecrow with it installed located here..

 

 

 

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

EDIT

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

I had forgotten to add the fix for the knee problem that Mark pointed out...it's in there now. If you downloaded the original file, you'll need to download this file for that fix (I think it was only two people). Sorry for any inconvenience.

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Here is David's latest squetch version merged with my latest FACE version.

 

Since I'm still using version 11.1h (until Jan.1, 2006) I wasn't able to test the installation of the whole rig using Noel's plugin. Please check this out and let me know if the parenting stays as it is now, and that the FACE bones don't get deleted in the process.

---------------------------------

Below are general instructions for the riggers that should be followed after installing the squetch rig into the characters:

 

After installation of the squetch rig you will need to do a few easy steps. Please refer to the FACE PDF install instructions for guidance. I already did steps 1, 3a and b, and step 4 for you. All that's left is:

 

1. Reorganize FACE controls to suit your character's model. Step 2a-c (pg. 4)

 

2. Add two constraints to make the interface follow your character's head movements. Step 3c (pg.5)

 

3. Optional... Move "minimized" FACE mesh inside your character's head. Step 5 (pg. 7)

 

4. Make the poses.

----------------------------------

 

Now I'll go pray that I did everything right. Please let me know if you find any errors.

 

[attachmentid=12019]

Squetch_Rig_12_5_2005a_installation_FACE1a.zip

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Mtpeak2,

 

David Simmons sent me a file a few hours ago with the FACE fully installed after running Noel's plugin, so I'm not sure what to tell you, Mark. Maybe it's a version thing with the plugin. Unfortunately I can't test it myself because I'm still in version 11.1h.

 

Here's the file he sent me. Hopefully he won't mind that I'm passing it on.

 

[attachmentid=12045]

 

Also, you won't be doing any scaling of the FACE rig... only translation. In fact, if you scale any of the FACE bones (other than the eyes, eyelids, jaw, etc.), the rig won't work anymore. See Steps 2a-d (pg. 4) of my install manual.

mark_12_6.zip

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My mistake, it did work. I was looking in the wrong place. I just thought the translation would have been automatic on the head proxy. Are the eyes there to replace the ones in the model? And don't worry, I haven't touch a thing, it's hovering over her head at the moment. :D

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I just thought the translation would have been automatic on the head proxy.

 

The head proxy is only parented correctly, it will translate and scale when you move the head "INSTALL" bone but it won't be in the correct position. All we have to do is reposition the head proxy to where we want it relative to the head bone in the installation version and it will be fine...I'll do that tonight.

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Here's the latest versions...there is now a four fingered version (three fingers and a thumb).

 

Changes in this version:

 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Added a four finger version to make installation easier for those models (Expressions in Hand Gizmo would need to be changed out by installer otherwise).

 

FACE was put in in the last version, it is also in the four fingered version.

 

Thumbs controls are also visible when using the Hand Gizmo controls with the other fingers individual controls hidden.

 

Updated version of Squetchy Thom that includes everything except FACE...since he doesn't have one.

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

I tried putting the "head proxy" for FACE where it was exactly where the head "INSTALL" bone is, but, since the installer would have to dig through a bunch of bones to unhide it later it turned out to be better as it was. Since I am at the limit of the forums on these ZIP files, the first one is the instructions for the Squetch Rig and FACE in one ZIP.

 

 

 

And the second ZIP has the four finger installation version, five finger installation version and the latest Squetchy Thom.

 

If you find a problem, let me know...contributors, please double check me.

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I just wanted to give everyone a heads up that there will be an update to fix the knee soon. I just have one problem to work out. It looks like it will be an easy upgrade. After that is done, I don't think there's anything else...unless someone finds something.

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David,

 

My fingers are crossed and I'm praying you're done. You need a break!

 

Thanks for hanging in there! What you've done is HUGE! (tiny little Elvis)

 

Jim

 

 

I've gotten tons of help from the community on this, Jim. People have been very generous with their time, their ideas and their sweat equity. I'll have to post a big "thank you" when I get done.

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Here's the update that fixes the legs. There is still one thing bothering me that I have contacted Noel about, but, other than that it should be good. The euler limits on the calf bones cause a twitch when fully extending the legs. It may be a programming solution or I'm not understanding something...either way it should be resolved quickly.

 

In order to update the rig from the previous installation version:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

delete base_bone/right_knee_IK_rotator

 

delete base_bone/left_knee_IK_rotator

 

add hips_lower_controller/right_leg_hinge_rotate and copy it, name the copy

"right_leg_hinge_rotate_FK_orient"

 

add hips_lower_controller/left_leg_hinge_rotate and copy it, name the copy

"left_leg_hinge_rotate_FK_orient"

 

copy "right_leg_hinge" and name the copy "right_knee_FK_rotator"

 

copy "left_leg_hinge" and name the copy "left_knee_FK_rotator"

 

reparent these bones so that they look like this:

 

 

hips_lower_controller

-

------right_leg_hinge_rotate

-----------right_knee_FK_rotator

----------------right_leg_hinge_rotate_FK_orient

 

-----------right_leg_hinge

----------------right_knee_controller

---------------------right_thigh_orient

 

 

-

------left_leg_hinge_rotate

-----------left_knee_FK_rotator

----------------left_leg_hinge_rotate_FK_orient

 

------left_leg_hinge

-----------left_knee_controller

----------------left_thigh_orient

 

 

 

replace the "leg_constraints" pose

 

replace the "left/right_knee_orient_like_foot_IK" poses

 

replace the "left/right_leg_FK_IK" poses

 

replace the "hide_non_tweaking_bones" pose

 

replace the "hide_body_SQUETCH_controls" pose

 

change the roll method of the IK foot nulls to "roll history"

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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One little observation:

 

For the users of 11.1 experiencing problems with copy / paste: Quick fix

 

Having alredy installed version of the rig in one of my models, and experiecing this copy / paste problem, I ve used newest rig that does not cause it (vesion 11_10), erased squetchy relationships in my model (I've keeped my custom made relationships for it), opened both models simultanuosly and draged relationships from the 11_10 model to my model... To my surprise, everything worked well, except for the hand gizmo (which is not incluuded in 11_10 model, anyway)

 

EDIT: erase relationships at the model -> user properties, erasing relationships foder seems to cause problems

 

I've experimented, and find out that allmost all previously created actions work with this solution...

 

Until David comes out with better solution, I think that this can be handy as a quick fix for the users of 11.1 version of A:M

 

Drvarceto

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I've tried to do this with TWO models which were posted in another thread and it doesn't seem to work... but it works with older setups... I have yet to check if the models would act weird but other than IK/FK switch (that wasn't working for me anyway) everything seems to move (allmost) perfect - fingers will move strangely, but I guess that is fixable...

 

Drvarceto

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Hey David! What's up man? You are nowhere to be seen;oD

 

As there are not any new iterations of the squetch rig posted, I guess we could consider last version of it as 'final'

 

I didn't hat the time to actually play some more with my hack over your rig (life got in the way), However, I tried to add hand gizmo to my model, alas... with no sucess (unles one considers twisting of the fingers in strange directions sort of sucess ;oP)...

 

I don't know if anyone with older versions of A:M tried this (above described) operation with their models... I would like to hear some (sucess) stories

 

Drvarceto

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Hey David! What's up man? You are nowhere to be seen;oD

 

As there are not any new iterations of the squetch rig posted, I guess we could consider last version of it as 'final'

 

The most recent version is probably not the last, unless my thinking about one of the constraints is correct, Drvarceto (it would only be a change in values on a couple of constraints at the worst). I still have an experiment to do, I just haven't gotten around to it yet. I'll do that tonight. At the moment I'm making a quadruped version using the present Squetch Rig...I'm rigging a cow for TWO. I grab time to work on this when I can, it's been hectic lately.

 

However, I tried to add hand gizmo to my model, alas... with no sucess (unles one considers twisting of the fingers in strange directions sort of sucess ;oP)...

 

Steven Cleary should have an installation version in this thread, it should help.

 

The v11.1 version of the Squetch Rig that I said I'd make will require a different leg and arm IK setup...v12 as well, unless Hash updates v12p. I haven't forgotten about it though, sorry it's taking me so long.

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I need a little clarification on something, please. When keying the squetch rig I keep getting error messages about constraint targets and then A:M shuts down. Here's what's been happening (and it's very possible I'm just doing something wrong).

 

1. Select all of the control bones and nulls at once using shift/click.

2. Set the rotate, and translate filter keys to on (none of the rest of the filters), and key bone.

3. Shift/click the force keyframe button, and select "In all filtered channels".

 

Bam... A:M gives the error message "Exception #031. Problem getting constraint target direction." and shuts down.

 

This happens every time, and sometimes gives different constraint names as the problem. I've tried using other filter keys as well.

 

I'm in version 12.0p.

 

Any hints?

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I need a little clarification on something, please. When keying the squetch rig I keep getting error messages about constraint targets and then A:M shuts down. Here's what's been happening (and it's very possible I'm just doing something wrong).

 

1. Select all of the control bones and nulls at once using shift/click.

2. Set the rotate, and translate filter keys to on (none of the rest of the filters), and key bone.

3. Shift/click the force keyframe button, and select "In all filtered channels".

 

Bam... A:M gives the error message "Exception #031. Problem getting constraint target direction." and shuts down.

 

This happens every time, and sometimes gives different constraint names as the problem. I've tried using other filter keys as well.

 

I'm in version 12.0p.

 

Any hints?

 

This is a bug in version 12. You cant key more then one bone like that. I reported it and Noel is working on it.

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Alright, I think this may be the final...although I've said that before. The last thing I had to clear up was some twisting in the legs. The orientation of the legs was causing the problem, they needed to have the same angle on the 'Y' axis. The euler limits on the arms and legs make it where the 'Y' and 'Z' axis of the thigh/calf and forearm/bicep need to be the same...the 'X' can be different and compensated for if the character has it's legs modeled bent. That's the only change in the models, I also updated the documentation. Everything should work in v13, there will be some twitches in the present version of v12 (12p).

 

Now, I just have to write up a "Thank-you" list...unless someone finds a problem.

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