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Squetchy Thom


itsjustme

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Here's my latest test animation, using the 28th version.

 

http://www.hash.com/users/zachbg/MonsterMash_mp4.mov

 

I noticed some weirdness with IK/FK blending of hands under extreme squash conditions (watch when the little guy grabs the liftgate), but that may not be an issue with the new switch controls.

 

It's a lot of fun to fool with the stretchiness.

 

Does the baseball cap have a control? (I know that's not an issue with the rig, just the model, but the baseball cap bone that I found doesn't seem to do anything.)

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I've been lurking on this post for a bit....

 

Zach, I noticed that "punkin' head" seems a bit baggy... in his skin... while "Sqetchy thom" (in the last tumble mov) didn't seem to have that problem.

 

I know this rig isn't final final yet.. but I noticed that, and assume that Punkin head is merely a slightly altered thom... but why the (well his skin looks more like a garbage bag as far as wrinkling etc than thoms)

 

what causes that?

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I noticed some weirdness with IK/FK blending of hands under extreme squash conditions (watch when the little guy grabs the liftgate), but that may not be an issue with the new switch controls.

 

I'm thinking the on/off switch will fix that...I'll look at that tonight.

 

Does the baseball cap have a control? (I know that's not an issue with the rig, just the model, but the baseball cap bone that I found doesn't seem to do anything.)

 

The baseball cap does have a couple of bones, but at the moment there's no built-in control. I left them there so that you could re-parent it if need be to move it around, but I have it parented like it is so that the squetch will affect the hat.

 

Here's what kept me awake too long today...a slightly busted version (I can't tell what's up at the moment, maybe Noel will shed some light on it). I altered the automated squetch design that David (Dagooos) posted because I wanted to be able to adjust the amount of automated squetch on each segment of the spine. It worked for a while in v11.1 (my test model still works in v11.1) then stopped working for whatever reason...it could be the way I used the Expressions. It appears to work OK in v12 from what I've tried (maybe a little stiff though). The IK spine appears to work alright and can manually squetch fine, I might've gotten too cute trying to squeeze more out of the automated spine squetch. I can very easily do an entire spine automated squetch, so, it doesn't kill the whole thing if this doesn't end up working. Anyway, see what you think.

 

I still need to update the shoulders and simplify the arm IK setup.

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Zach, I noticed that "punkin' head" seems a bit baggy... in his skin... while "Sqetchy thom" (in the last tumble mov) didn't seem to have that problem.

I'll have you know that punkin' head tells me he's VERY comfortable in his own skin... oh wait... that wasn't what you meant?

 

Yeah, I don't know why that is--all I did was bring the arm and leg squetch controllers down to their most squashed level. Maybe it's inherent in the way the squashing is achieved? I don't know. But they're both the same model, just one is orange (and has an extra decal).

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But they're both the same model, just one is orange (and has an extra decal).

 

I figured they were... that's why I couldn't understand... but then David mentioned the minor problems with the squtech and the spine ... maybe that's it...

 

Anyway it sure is fun to watch you experts play with this stuff!

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No, no, no! Why have two controllers for a function that is currently taken care of by one?

 

I'll put it back like it was....I think Noel was just thinking about preventing accidental squetching.

 

 

Noel just didn't know what he was doing ;) My point was that bones that shouldn't be translated etc should be locked.

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Zach, I noticed that "punkin' head" seems a bit baggy... in his skin... while "Sqetchy thom" (in the last tumble mov) didn't seem to have that problem.

 

The squetch preserves volume as you make something smaller, of course at some point things will start to fold a little depending on the model construction. You can model something to maximize the squetchiness by reducing the definition...which means you get more blob-like or sack-like characters. I tried to weight the CP's taking that into consideration, for the most part (and for most things) it seems to look alright in Squetchy Thom. I kind of like the "deflated" look you can get by squashing things to their minimum...you could animate him deflating a body part at a time sort of.

 

I figured they were... that's why I couldn't understand... but then David mentioned the minor problems with the squtech and the spine ... maybe that's it...

 

The problem with the spine is only in the automated squetching control, everything else should work fine...the automated squetching appears to work fine in v12 and worked in v11.1 for me for a while. I think I did everything right, it just may be a problem with allocation of resources...I'm not sure if the Expressions make it where they have exclusive control over what they are handling. I tried the Expressions on the manual controls, but it then locked out manual control, so, I made a secondary set of controls for the automated squetching...it works, but there are some inconsistencies that I haven't figured out yet. Anyone have luck using it in v11.1? How about v12? The automated squetching is in the "head and torso" area of the squetching controls (or something like that...I can't look at it right now).

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David;

 

I've got you down for a "final" release of the Squetch rig on Wednesday.

 

Also on Wednesday, Jim Talbot is doing a "final" release on SCARECROW'S modeling.

 

After which, Mark Skodacek is putting your "final" rig into Jim's "final" model for the Animation Directors to put through the "final" paces starting Friday, November 4th.

 

Is this going to work for you?

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I've got you down for a "final" release of the Squetch rig on Wednesday.

 

Also on Wednesday, Jim Talbot is doing a "final" release on SCARECROW'S modeling.

 

After which, Mark Skodacek is putting your "final" rig into Jim's "final" model for the Animation Directors to put through the "final" paces starting Friday, November 4th.

 

Is this going to work for you?

 

I can make it happen, Martin. I'll get rid of the variable automated squetch on individual segments of the spine (you'll still be able to manually squetch each segment as needed anyway and have an overall automated squetch) and the simplification of the arms IK may not happen if it slows me down. That would mean that the main focus on changes would be converting the IK/FK switch to an on/off and then making the installation version. So, that's how I'll attack it.

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Here's another problem for you. I don't think this is desirable. It maybe the way you assigned and weighted cp's.

 

Cool, I'll check that as well, thanks Mark. There are several "loose ends" that are going to be cleaned up...I'm going to try to have a version up for evaluation on Tuesday if I can so that it can be stress tested before making the installation version. I also have to make a version with five fingers.

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I just bought a copy of Snapz Pro for recording Blender tutorial videos; when the final version of the rig comes out I could try my hand at recording an installation video for it. Unless the 10/31 version is close enough, in which case I can just use that and start working on it right now?

 

So the offer's there, if you want it. But I don't want to go to far with that if you're still updating the rig.

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I just bought a copy of Snapz Pro for recording Blender tutorial videos; when the final version of the rig comes out I could try my hand at recording an installation video for it. Unless the 10/31 version is close enough, in which case I can just use that and start working on it right now?

 

So the offer's there, if you want it. But I don't want to go to far with that if you're still updating the rig.

 

I would wait for the version that should be up on Wednesday...you'll need the installation version. There are also some big changes...it doesn't look like I'll get a version up today to test drive before the installation version is up on Wednesday, I tried. I managed to get the IK very simple since the FK is already a limited IK chain, that cured several other things as well (you were right about that, Noel). The only thing I have left to do is to fix the shoulders...but I've got to get a few hours sleep, real life intrudes.

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Hey, the automated squetch control was cool, how it progressively stretched the spine. Really made it seem like it was actually stretching the skin of the character.

Its too bad the expressions locked up the posesliders though, looks like it made a lot more work for ya :blink:

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Okay, this is the final version of the rig...as far as I know. I'll try to bang out the installation version as fast as I can. Sorry I'm taking so long, there were a lot of problems to iron out...and hard to isolate. The arm IK/FK setup had to have IK arms added because the arm rolling wasn't able to be controlled easily...that one made me crazy for a while. However, it is a much simpler IK arm setup now. I fixed plenty of things throughout the rig...I tried every control and they seem to work. I'm not saying there can't be a problem buried in there somewhere, I just didn't find one.

 

The shoulders follow the arm movement to a certain extent, they can be shrugged using the shoulder control or by translating the bicep control while in FK...or a combination.

 

Anyway, give this a test drive. Now I have to make a five fingered version, make an installation version of both the four finger and five finger version and make instructions...and I have to work at 5am. I may not get any sleep, we'll see. I've been running on fumes for two days now, so I'm used to it ;) .

 

Hey, the automated squetch control was cool, how it progressively stretched the spine. Really made it seem like it was actually stretching the skin of the character.

Its too bad the expressions locked up the posesliders though, looks like it made a lot more work for ya

 

The automated squetch is still in there, David. It just can't vary the amount of squetch for each spine segment independently...maybe I'll figure it out when I get more time.

 

 

-----------------------------------------

EDIT

-----------------------------------------

 

It's going to have to be Thursday evening for the installation version...I've really got to get some sleep, my brains are burnin'. I can just squeeze in four hours of sleep before I have to go to work.

 

 

-------------------------------------------

EDIT

--------------------------------------------

 

I just snapped and realized that I have to fix the resizing of the IK arm bones when squetching...I'll have it fixed today (Thursday). Sorry about that.

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Just an update on where I'm at in the process...yeah, I know, I'm mad at me too. I have the five fingered version made and I'm somewhere around half-way through with the installation version of that one. I'm hoping (once again) to get at least that one done by tomorrow evening. There were so many changes that the original installation version isn't a very good guide in a lot of areas. Once I get the five fingered installation version done, the four fingered one will go faster since I'll have something to use as a guide. Don't think I'm slacking, I've been averaging three and a half hours of sleep a night since Monday...and I have to be at work at 5am, again. I'm off to get four hours of sleep before I have to go to work again.

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Just an update on where I'm at in the process...yeah, I know, I'm mad at me too. I have the five fingered version made and I'm somewhere around half-way through with the installation version of that one. I'm hoping (once again) to get at least that one done by tomorrow evening. There were so many changes that the original installation version isn't a very good guide in a lot of areas. Once I get the five fingered installation version done, the four fingered one will go faster since I'll have something to use as a guide. Don't think I'm slacking, I've been averaging three and a half hours of sleep a night since Monday...and I have to be at work at 5am, again. I'm off to get four hours of sleep before I have to go to work again.

 

David, I think I can speak for everyone in that the whole community will appreciate the great lengths you've gone to, to get this rig into the hands of the average user. I mean, the months of research and tweaking you're doing now are going to save lots of people time down the line, and that's by no means a small thing. So take all the time you need. Don't rush yourself; rushing leads to mistakes, and I for one would rather you got some sleep and the rig came out a day late than the rig be out Right This Minute with a few minor issues still unfound.

 

As for the fingers: Are multiple versions really needed? Why can't the five finger version become the 3 finger version using some sort of on/off slider chicanery? Since the fingers should all eventually be parented to the same base hand / arm / whatever bone, can't we just leave the unused fingers invisible?

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rushing leads to mistakes, and I for one would rather you got some sleep and the rig came out a day late than the rig be out Right This Minute with a few minor issues still unfound.

 

Well, you're right about that...I found a really stupid one, so here's a fix. The parenting of the right arm was messed up. The rig was actually due on Wednesday so that Mark could install it in Scarecrow, that's why I'm trying so hard to get it done. Right now, I'm thinking the AD's have at least something to test with Squetchy Thom here...I realize it's not exactly what they wanted, but it's what I have at the moment.

 

As for the fingers: Are multiple versions really needed? Why can't the five finger version become the 3 finger version using some sort of on/off slider chicanery? Since the fingers should all eventually be parented to the same base hand / arm / whatever bone, can't we just leave the unused fingers invisible?

 

The original rig only has four fingers, so, I had to make a five fingered version...I don't know if it's necessary for the two versions, I hadn't really thought about it. I guess all anyone would have to do is delete the pinky poses and bones in the five fingered version...that may be the way to go. I'll be hard at it again when I get home from work.

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David;

 

Mad at you? You must be an uber-team player! Your doing some really great work and putting in a lot of hours in the process. The work that you are doing will ripple well beyond the glory that is TWO.

 

Do you have kids? Have you seen how jumpy they get as Christmas morning approaches? Well, Santa-Simmons - we kids already know whats in the box under the tree. Try telling a kid to be patient :lol:

 

Is it ready yet is it ready yet is it ready yet is it ready yet???????

 

Sleep? How can you sleep when there are thousands of eyes watching your every move? :blink:

 

 

Executive summary - THANKS FOR EVERYTHING YOUR DOING!!

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Well, I want to third the sentiment.

 

The rig will be the vehicle that the animators use to bring life to the characters. It's as important as ANY part of the project. The easier it is for them to animate with this rig, the better the quality of movie we will be able to output. Your effort and the other riggers effort will be appreciated daily when the animating starts.

 

About Scarecrow, it wasn't ready on Wednesday either. :)

 

When the rig is ready, let me know and I'll send the scarecrow model to Mark.

 

Thanks,

Jim

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David, whenever you can get the rig done is fine, just send it to me when your done, they'll just have to wait for the rigged Scarecrow. If you knew from the start that this was the rig of choice, instead of multiple rigs, you could have been done by now.

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Well? How are "we" doing? Did you "release," David? Is Squetch ready for prime time?

 

I sent the installation version to Mark this morning, Martin. I just have to make the documentation pretty before I actually post it...that's what I'll be doing tonight (and double checking some things to be safe). Sometime tonight I'll have it posted here. Thanks to everyone for being so patient.

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Here's the installation version of the Squetch Rig with instructions in Adobe Acrobat format. If anyone finds a problem, let me know and I'll fix it as fast as I can. Once again, thank you for being so patient and thank you for the constructive input.

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Fantastic David! I've been following your trials and tribulations...

 

You are one dedicated man! TWO will probably be alot easier for everyone to participate in...

 

I'm downloading it now for future use, when I am competent to use it!

 

Thank you, so very much... all of us, from newbies like me, to grand poo baas, salute you and you have our gratitude!

 

okay, so that's a little over the top... but really, you deserve all that and more!

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David, the left foot doesn't roll correctly on the installation rig. Any ideas? It also doesn't work on the Four_Finger_Squetch_Rig_Final_11_3_2005 version.

 

Looks like I missed a constraint in the "left_leg_FK_IK" pose in the "Leg_Controls" folder. On the "left_foot_IK_roll" bone there should be an "Orient like left_ball_rotate_controller" constraint with compensate on when applying it. I'll post the fix here shortly. Thanks, Mark!

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After I uploaded the last update I found something else that needed fixing, sorry about that. Here's the fix for the latest thing I found.

 

What it amounts to is the way the heel was set up it wasn't able to move away from the end of the calf bone...so, now it can. I have updated the documentation as well.

 

If you already have a previous installation version that you are in the middle of installing, it's not a hard fix. What you would have to do is go to the "Rig_Components/leg_constraints_folder/legs_SQUETCH" pose folder, select the "left_heel_geom" and delete the "Translate to left_ankle_SQUETCH_target" constraint...do the same thing for the "right_heel_geom". That makes it where you can use translate mode to move the "right/left_heel_geom" and "right/left_heel_control" bones to where you want the heel controls and geometry bones. The "geom" and "control" bones should be in the same location (on their respective sides).

 

I'm going to go ahead and finish the installation on the Jane model so that I can help find some of these types of things...hopefully, there won't be too many.

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David, you are going to spoil us... you will make animation so easy for everyone... even I might get to finish something!

 

I am installing (again) your squetch rig into one of my characters right now... can't wait to see it finished...

 

I've played a bit with Squetchy Thom: Why there are forearm FK controllers roll handles if they can't be used? forearms can be rotated using bicep's FK roll handles... it is a bit confusing...

 

drvarceto

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Why there are forearm FK controllers roll handles if they can't be used? forearms can be rotated using bicep's FK roll handles... it is a bit confusing...

 

I may be misunderstanding what you're asking, Drvarceto...but let's see if I can get close. The rotation of the forearm near the wrist is controlled by the rotation of the hand controller. Since it's a limited kinematic chain, you can grab the forearm bone and use the end of that bone to also rotate the bicep when the arm is bent. You're right, the roll handle on the forearms is locked as part of the limited kinematic chain...before it was a limited kinematic chain it was a true FK arm and I did have only one axis available for manipulation, but, since you can use the forearm to position the entire arm now, you need to be able to use every axis since it travels up the chain.

 

I hope that answered your question. If not, I can always take a second stab at it. Let me know if you run across anything that needs fixing and I'll knock it out as fast as I can.

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Awesome work David. Once I get into bipeds in ABC this guy's my man. Thank you so much for your tireless efforts in creating an amazing rig for the community. Really wonderful rig. I'm sure you learned a lot during the process, huh?

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Mag-freakin-nificent! Beautiful rig. This is going to make animating a real pleasure. Thank you so much for your effort and generosity.

 

Very cool, Ed. This community has been very generous to me as well, I'm happy something I had a part in is being used. I got loads of great suggestions...I can't think of one I didn't use. It really made this a much better rig. If you find any problems, let me know.

 

I'm sure you learned a lot during the process, huh?

 

Definitely, Josh. Like everything else, tackling a project is the best way to learn...the way to refine your methods is to make a tutorial. It also never hurts to have so many experienced people that are willing to help. I am very grateful to everyone that made time in their busy schedules to help.

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David, thank you for all your hard work over the past few weeks, bringing us what promises to be an amazing leap forward for A:M rigs. I am still a big fan of Anzovin's TSM2, and will continue to use it, but now it looks like I'm spoiled for choise.

 

I am installing your rig in a version of my old Woot model as a first test.

 

I have a question regarding the green carpal bones in the hands. I have thumbs which are modelled with a 45 degree rotation along the z-axis. I have set up the white thumb installer bones at 45 degrees but I am unsure if I need to do the same for the green carpal bones of the thumbs.

 

Anyway, thanks again and looking forward to a good squetch.

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I have a question regarding the green carpal bones in the hands. I have thumbs which are modelled with a 45 degree rotation along the z-axis. I have set up the white thumb installer bones at 45 degrees but I am unsure if I need to do the same for the green carpal bones of the thumbs.

 

If you use rotate mode when rotating the white thumb "INSTALL" bones, your green "carpal" bone should be at the correct angle of rotation since it will rotate with it. Rotate the white thumb "INSTALL" bone (using rotation mode) to where the roll handle is perpendicular to the direction you want the thumb to bend. The same thing goes for the other thumb "INSTALL" bones (perpendicular to the bend)...you may have to adjust their angle depending on the thumb design. The finger "INSTALL" bones are different in that they need to have a 'Z' rotation of "0". Look at how Squetchy Thom's thumb is set up as an example.

 

Hope that helps, Paul.

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David, I'm still planning on doing the installation video, but the actual installation is giving me grief as your rig brings my system to its knees. ^-^ I have some time this weekend, though, so I hope I'll be able to figure out the install and then get it all going by then.

 

Incidentally, that PDF... that's one hell of a long page. :P

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David, I'm still planning on doing the installation video, but the actual installation is giving me grief as your rig brings my system to its knees. ^-^ I have some time this weekend, though, so I hope I'll be able to figure out the install and then get it all going by then.

 

It does have a lot of bones, Charles...probably three times as many as you end up with when you're done installing. Are you installing in wireframe mode? That might help a little. Also, what capture software are you using and what capture rate? I've used a capture rate of about 5 frames a second before and it went a lot easier on my computer while showing enough to get the idea across.

 

Incidentally, that PDF... that's one hell of a long page.

 

LOL, I didn't put any page breaks in it...I just converted an HTML page that I made using Open Office. I could always go back and put in page breaks if it causes problems.

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